[ANSWERED] An optional cooling pack for C7 (track use or other)
09-22-2016, 08:44 PM
#61
Tech Contributor
Member Since: Oct 1999
Location: Charlotte, NC (formerly Endicott, NY)
Posts: 40,081
Received 8,924 Likes
on
5,330 Posts
I did not know this. That is not good!I don't have much HPDE experience, just one event under my belt, and lots of chit chat from customers. I do understand that most HPDE on-track sessions are 15 to 20 minutes. I also believe that instructors and solo students have open track times, and depending on the event or day it can be as long as 45 min to 1 hour long. The C5 oil temps start to reach the higher limit after 15 to 20 minutes of hard driving. I only know this to be true at our home track, Watkins Glen. I also know that the majority of Corvette models (pre-C7) needed upgraded brake pads for more than a few laps. Many guys installed aftermarket radiators, and oil coolers to help keep the heat down as they gained experience and can drive their cars harder. I'm surprised to hear that the 911 can be taken to the track right off the showroom for extended track time. You learn something new every day.
The C6Z only needed brakes to run with the Porshes for extended periods of time. I could run all day long in temps in the 90s and the oil temp would stay right around 260 which is just fine with me.
The C7Z seems to be a very good track car right out of the box although I did add the GMPP Secondary Radiator to allay concerns about oil temps. The only issue I have with it is its brakes. The C6Z brakes were just not designed for track duty. The C7 Z brakes do well but the Ceramic rotors are just too costly to replace on a once per year basis. The car will definitely run with the Porsches and blast all but the Cup cars into the toolies at just about any track.
Bill
09-23-2016, 08:46 PM
#62
Drifting
Have never seen any report of real overheating on the street or highway. Have seen some people report overheating on track. Randy Pobst overheated the oil the first time he drove the Z06 at the press intro at Road Atlanta in the fall of 2014. That car went into limp home mode not just a reduced power level due to pulling timing.
I haven't run into anybody at the track who has actually over heated one although there is always somebody who knows somebody who did.
Based on some of the Randy Pobst experience I upgraded my new 15Z with the GMPP Secondary Radiator before I took the car to the track the first time. I have run the car for a total of 13 track days this year with the last couple being run with ambient temps in the low 90s. The car was run hard all the time and I never saw an oil, coolant or transmission temp that was close to overheating.
Other than postings on the forum and a few experiences with Motor Trend there is more discussion than actual fire. Do a search and find count the actual number of reported over heatings (not the thousands of repeat postings of the same event). Is there a problem, Yes. Is the problem as severe as some of the vendors and forum members have made it out to be? No.
I was surprised that GM claimed there were as many as 5% of the cars had some sort of track overheating issue. I would have thought it was in the 1% range. In those 13 track days I have put about 1200 track miles on the car or about 25% of the total miles on the car.
Bill
I haven't run into anybody at the track who has actually over heated one although there is always somebody who knows somebody who did.
Based on some of the Randy Pobst experience I upgraded my new 15Z with the GMPP Secondary Radiator before I took the car to the track the first time. I have run the car for a total of 13 track days this year with the last couple being run with ambient temps in the low 90s. The car was run hard all the time and I never saw an oil, coolant or transmission temp that was close to overheating.
Other than postings on the forum and a few experiences with Motor Trend there is more discussion than actual fire. Do a search and find count the actual number of reported over heatings (not the thousands of repeat postings of the same event). Is there a problem, Yes. Is the problem as severe as some of the vendors and forum members have made it out to be? No.
I was surprised that GM claimed there were as many as 5% of the cars had some sort of track overheating issue. I would have thought it was in the 1% range. In those 13 track days I have put about 1200 track miles on the car or about 25% of the total miles on the car.
Bill
With the Z51, the only issues I've seen is pre '16 A8 transmission overheating, no issues with engine overheating.
Obviously, things like the outside temperature and how much the driver is pushing the car (or has the ability to) will affect how hot the car gets.
Last edited by Jay_Davis; 09-23-2016 at 08:48 PM.
09-24-2016, 06:36 AM
#63
Advanced
At Spring Mountain this past June, I in a 2016 Z51 A8 was matched up with three Z06's in the last track session. Air temperature was 107+ F. A subsequent Cosworth Toolbox review of this track session revealed maximum engine oil and transmission temperatures of 295 F and 225 F respectively.
That said, it appears that during heavy duty track sessions in a 2016 or 2017 Z51 A8, high engine oil temperature could still be an issue, while high transmission temperature is no longer an issue due to the addition of a second transmission cooler. As a 2017 GS' grill reportedly flows 17% more air than a Z51's grill, high engine oil temperature may not be an issue with a GS or with a Z51 fitted with a GS grill.
That said, it appears that during heavy duty track sessions in a 2016 or 2017 Z51 A8, high engine oil temperature could still be an issue, while high transmission temperature is no longer an issue due to the addition of a second transmission cooler. As a 2017 GS' grill reportedly flows 17% more air than a Z51's grill, high engine oil temperature may not be an issue with a GS or with a Z51 fitted with a GS grill.
Last edited by RPOC7R; 09-24-2016 at 10:34 AM.
09-24-2016, 01:40 PM
#64
Drifting
Luckily I never saw 107+ at Spring Mountain. My first visit it did get up to somewhere between 98 and 100, and I was seeing up to 280 for engine and transmission, but that was a '15 A8 Z51, so it didn't have the secondary transmission cooler.
I have not seen a GS on track yet, so I don't have any first hand experience with that yet.
It seems like the ideal solution would be adding enough transmission cooling at the rear of the car and using the space up front for the secondary oil cooler.
I have not seen a GS on track yet, so I don't have any first hand experience with that yet.
It seems like the ideal solution would be adding enough transmission cooling at the rear of the car and using the space up front for the secondary oil cooler.
09-24-2016, 10:43 PM
#65
Advanced
Bill and I are friends. I am a senior instructor with a lot of experience. I have had my 2016 Z-51 A8 for 8 weeks now. I can over heat the water temp by running in Track mode and leaving it in Drive at every event I have gone to. I love... love... how the system works, putting me in the correct gear as I come out of every corner. I can run like this for ...at most... one or two laps. After that, the water Tmp climbs and then I have to use the manual mode and paddle shift 4th, 5th, and 6th for the remainder of the session. Oh.. I might get a few turns in using 3rd, but I find myself watching the water TMP gauge as much as I watch my tach. I came from a flawless 2010 6M manual that worked perfectly. I am waiting until the spring hoping GM will offer a solution. I appreciate all of the inputs that I am reading.
09-25-2016, 10:51 AM
#66
Drifting
Bill and I are friends. I am a senior instructor with a lot of experience. I have had my 2016 Z-51 A8 for 8 weeks now. I can over heat the water temp by running in Track mode and leaving it in Drive at every event I have gone to. I love... love... how the system works, putting me in the correct gear as I come out of every corner. I can run like this for ...at most... one or two laps. After that, the water Tmp climbs and then I have to use the manual mode and paddle shift 4th, 5th, and 6th for the remainder of the session. Oh.. I might get a few turns in using 3rd, but I find myself watching the water TMP gauge as much as I watch my tach. I came from a flawless 2010 6M manual that worked perfectly. I am waiting until the spring hoping GM will offer a solution. I appreciate all of the inputs that I am reading.