varkwso

As in all things it starts out small. Common examples are kids, houses, credit card debt and retirement plans. Track addictions are no different. Initially, the decision is to just go to a high performance driving school in your stock street tire car to "check it out". Then before you know it you are looking at ever increasing consumables bills, a better tow vehicle, a backup track vehicle and a bigger car hauler to support the 32 wheels and tires you are taking - just in case - plus the 2 track cars and tools (including a TIG welder - it could be needed you know). This all came rushing back at me when we started reloading the trailer (1 car only), truck (not a dually) and the support vehicle GTO (wife's car) at CMP this last weekend. It only seems like yesterday when it seemed like I had money and some free time.

It was a great weekend at the track though. I got there at 0630 Friday to hook up with Pete in his Saleen S281 and his latest Saleen, a Parnelli Jones Boss 302. You could safely say he is a Ford guy since he has about more muscle Fords at home (bet he started out small also). He is an old friend I met at VIR several years ago and we get together at a track whenever we can. We had great times getting him comfortable at CMP with his S281 on Friday. It was fun, fun, fun until the NASA trailer showed up. Then I went to work getting ready for Time Trial for the weekend. Like my youngest son said about school "it takes a lot of time when you actually do the work". The work Ken Brewer put in before the season really made it much easier for all of us. After the trailer was unloaded, the car teched and the heavy work was done Jake and Josh showed up for the "arrive & drive" program Friday evening. Funny, ROAR Racing actually gets paying customers for their program - all I get is two "team members" who are hard to find when work is to be done. But in true track bum style we all mooched a great meal (and duct tape) out of the ROAR team Friday night.

Our car did great, especially when Jake was driving it. With a fresh set of front Carbotech XP10 brakes and "sticker" 295/40-17 Kumho V710s (masterfully mounted by Marc Younts) Jake laid down 1:44x laps on Saturday and Sunday. It was noted, quite widely apparently, that I was 1.005 seconds slower then him. I need another transponder – that way we can both podium. The weekend mantra was "more than a second" wherever I went - next time I get the coaching from Brian Smith. I would like to point out that I set up the car, adjusted the tire pressures, checked the oil, topped off the brake fluid, bled the clutch and wiped down the dew. Oh, I also funded this adventure. Josh was seen only in the company of a young lady all weekend. Luckily, her Mom gets a lot of work out of him. We do have a clutch, prop shaft, or transmission issue which did limit us a bit all weekend. It works better when it goes in gear for you at all the corners, straights and brake zones - for anybody we suddenly slowed in front of you in dumb places - we are sorry. Johnny found a smoking deal on a complete prop shaft and delivered it to me at CMP. It looks like a Spec clutch and aluminum flywheel will be going in also next weekend to get ready for Roebling, CMP, Roebling, Road Atlanta and Roebling in the next 5 weeks.

Time Trial went pretty smoothly. We were checking licenses and collecting/going over classification forms on approximately 30 entrants. Most competitors provided them this weekend but a few slipped through. All competitors are required to provide them by Road Atlanta or they will run in TTR until we get a reviewed classification form. The grid ran well and most people went out in an order that minimized required passing early in the session. There were a few issues on people coming out of the hot pits right into traffic on the straight – luckily the blend line was honored. Quite a few Time Trial check rides were given this weekend. All I can say is sign up early to make sure you get in TT.

The fastest times were 1:44x (Corvette and Integra) all weekend with quite a few cars playing in TTA and TTS. There were some hard fought battles in all classes all weekend. There were quite a few new "rookies" who did well and the sessions flowed without issue. We did have one Subaru STi have a severe accident in T14 requiring a Life Flight for a fractured vertebrate in the last session Saturday. The driver made the best of several bad options and he was doing well on Sunday. Good seats, harnesses and R3s are on the short list.

Now all I have to do is unload the truck, the trailer, drop the entire drivetrain from the engine back on the 99 Vette, find the problem, buy the parts, fix the problem and button the car back up in time for Jake to "arrive & drive" at Roebling.

heavychevy

OMG, I hope that wasnt Matt in the STI, but whoever it is I wish them a speedy recovery. My goodness! That really makes you think about the dangers of this sport. Be careful out there guys.

Are you saying he did or didnt have the proper safety equipement?

mikahb

Nice writeup, enjoyed it! Good luck getting Jake back together and finding that extra second.

racerjon1

It was not Matt in the STI.. as Matt's STI is getting upgrades, and Matt brought out his Impreza 2.5 RS... though.. there is more to that story also, but it at least doesn't end in a trip to the hospital.

As far as safety equipment, I think that this incident works as a very real reminder of just how fast things can go bad, and what kind of damage could be done. I don't know that any of us consider turn 14 at CMP "high speed" but when circumstances presented themseves, the results were only a smidge short of catastrophic.

The STI held up very well, Subarus are very safe cars, and it was not a structural failure that caused the injury and the car looked better than some rollover cars I have seen with cages.

As a friend of mine said when I related the details to him, he said, "I can't even imagine competing in a car without at least a roll bar." He then added 5-point harnesses and good seats to the list of things he wouldn't race without, and those items may very wellhave prevented the injury.


Jon K

varkwso

Too many Matt's with STi's - Matt Ball was not at the event - his car has been under construction pretty much since OLOA last year.

The STi had the stock safety equipment. It worked pretty well for the accident. It is conjecture to say what would have happened with other equipment. I personally do not like 5/6 points without H&N protection - but that is a personal preference.

heavychevy

So the injury could have been prevented or lessened with a HANS device?

I know I'm a prime example of what not to do as I spent my whole first year of TT with nothing but factory restraints, but I'd be all for them increasing the safety measures requirements for TT. I've been called stupid enough times to go ahead and buy a roll bar.

racerjon1

A Hans device wouldn't have helped him, as he was in factory restraints, and I don't think any head & neck restraint would have helped because it wasn't a head movement injury, it is a compression fracture of L4. (Just above your ****)

From the description I got, it was the impact with the ground when he finally landed on his wheels that caused the injury.


Jon K

racerjon1

I have discussed this a few times with people, and I know SCCA requires roll bars at most levels of competition.. I think in some of the lower speed time trial events they don't, but only in the "lower speed" cars.

I suspect that it will happen soon enough though, events like this tend to make people react.

Jon K

Timz06

There was no doubt in my mind that it was not 'if' but 'when' an incident would happent at these events. There are too many danger factors including;

-Inexperienced drivers running TT
-A large number of cars driving on track
-A large number of cars with different capabilites, which cause faster cars to overtake slower cars with a lot of speed, and unexpectedly catch closer cars in bad places on track. Inexperience with traffic management causes drivers in faster cars 'to run up ' on other cars and hit the brakes in places where they should not be braking.
-Passing anywhere on track which causes the previously mentioned inexperienced drivers to drive off line, where they are not used to be driving, or making passes where they should not.
-Exteremely fast cars going over 160 mph, and aggressive drivers (experienced and not)

Couple all of these factors with no safety equipment, and you have an accident waiting to happen. I think minimum requirements should be a roll bar, with race seats, and harnesses. That is what I run with.

Experience requirements for TT drivers should be the same as for instructors- about 3 years experience with about 30 events under their belt as a general rule.

This is still a young program, and the organizers are working hard to make changes. I have enjoyed running with the TT group, that is why I am concerned, as serious incidents could cause the downfall of the program.

Tim

Tim

Cobra4B

^ Tim are your running TTs in the C5Z? Did you finally throw some mods in it?

racerjon1

Good points Tim, especially the part about different rates of speed.. I remember closing on cars at Mid Ohio with a 70mph difference..

In this case, there wasn't much density, though he was around other cars, and I sort of question the wisdom in running close to other cars in a time trial event. (I am not going to get into drafting and such in slower cars.. that's another can of worms) I try to get away from other cars as much as possible in the TT groups.

Also, in this driver's case, he is pretty dang experienced from what I understand.. years racing karts, rally driving, etc.. this seems to be "just" a parts failure.

However.. I think that "just" a parts failure is a big danger. high speeds + parts failure + lack of extra safety equipment = bad stuff.


Jon K

beerkat

From the little bit I know of the incident the roll over was caused by what some call a "Dukes of Hazard" jump, a small bit of ground that acted like a ramp. Before the new track change you did not carry as much speed into turn 14 as you can now. So when you go off straight you are going to travel farther than in the pass. I think that CMP needs to grade/drag/level the run off area of 14 and make it bigger.

heavychevy

Well there is nothing you can do about that, other than force people to be prepared for it. There have been some driver error accidents at Road Atlanta Time Trials, but I've also seen instructors hit the only wall there is to hit at Roebling. I have stated on nasaforums.com that eventually and possibly now at some events like Road Atlanta, Barber, and other events where TT is sold out, that they allow more TT participants and make two groups. 15 - 20 minute sessions are more than enough time when other groups only give three laps.

I just think that I've come far too close to spec miatas around turn 9 and 11 at Road Atlanta which are blind and those are some very dangerous places to go off. I actually may prefer a 4 lap strategy, since that's all I get most times before catching traffic anyways.

racerjon1

Yea, that's what happened, he told me that he aimed for the fence rather than the tires as he thought it would do less damage, I am not sure if the "ditch" or whatever it is is behind the tires, so it might have been better to not aim at the fence.

The problem with making that zone longer is that the skidpad is now there - so that's out. He actually ended up on the skidpad and when I saw the car sitting when I drove by I thought "how did someone crash on the skidpad."

What I suspect we see is a wider sand trap, more tires and no more uneven ground.


Jon K

varkwso

If you go with 5/6 point harness in my opinion a H&N restraint is very prudent. You have cinched down all motion to absorb energy except your neck with the added weight of the helmet - having been under high G for long periods wearing a helmet - it is hard on the neck.

I do not like wearing 5/6 points that are not matched to the rest of the equipment. Given a lower back or a neck injury the choice is clear - I prefer neither by the way.

I am not against "roll bars" but what will that really do for my C5? The STi DID NOT crush its roof nor have any of the many I have seen crashed at tracks. The STi driver stayed in his seat (apparently) - but he landed very hard on his tailbone - not sure a race seat or more harness would have helped that a lot. He may have prevented some slap down IF the stock seat belt did not lock (which is unlikely) with a 5/6 point.

The driver had his TT check ride last year at Barber I believe - and yes he was experienced and I talked to him about traffic management in the grid. He was a little frustrated with the traffic - we grid by lap time and his times put him in the "bell" of the curve with most of the drivers. He was running 2 seconds faster a lap in the session he left the track.

We are policing the participants hard in TT - for capability and equipment. But it is a mixed class with some big "clumps" in sections. we are also making a daily download session and the morning TT drivers meetings mandatory. It is serious competition and we will treat it that way.

We ran mostly alone except for the stragglers put out right in front of us from the hot pit. It depends where you are on the grid...

racerjon1

I can see that, and I honestly believe it should probably be part of a system.. cage, good seat - and by that I mean with side bolsters for your head - H&N, 6-point belts, etc.


Subarus have incredible rollover protection from the factory.. I have seen pictures of an Impreza (same STI chassis) that had an 18-wheeler roll over it and the passenger compartment was in great shape. The Subaru in question had some crush damage, but I have seen worse with roll cages on Civics..

However, do we start making a distinction of model cars and protection required.. I saw a C4 roll at Nelson Ledges this year, and I promise you those things need a roll bar, the driver was lucky only the passenger side b-pillar collapsed.

So maybe we do say "if the car passes xxx rollover tests" then it doesn't need a roll bar.. who knows.


The driver remembers hitting his head on the roof on one of the impacts, and then getting slammed down in the seat when it finally landed on its wheels.

While we are at it, Subarus have a seat belt pretensioner that acts with the airbags, when they go off a gas charge reels the seatbelt in and locks it (though, even if it isn't working the regular inertia wheel WILL still work) The STI in question here had Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution seats.. in replacing them the driver had removed the side airbags from the STI, disabling the airbags and the seat bealt pretensioner...

Again, we start getting into the function of a system here, and I think the moral may very well be that it's not smart to mess with the system that is in place without changine the entire thing.


Jon K

varkwso

In that we are in violent agreement - when you mod the tested stock system you need to do it with the analysis of the changes - I did not know he disabled some of his safety systems.

All C4s are a Targa - my C5 FRC is a different animal. But if one car requires them - all should require them to the same standard....makes my job much easier.

I am getting a harness bar, harnesses, compatible seats and H&N for my car (and all three drivers).

I started SCCA racing with a lap belt only....a long time ago...

racerjon1

He may not have known either, I talked to my One Lap car owner from last year who checked with his Subaru guru to find that out...


So are we at the point where we should require roll bars in TT?

And that Lap belt thing is scary. Of course at the Indy 500 early in the century drivers were happy not wearing belts, as being thrown free was better than being crushed by the non-rollbar cars.. so it shouldn't amaze me at the things we look back at and say, "wow.. why."


Jon K

varkwso

I do not believe so - you can participate at the level you are comfortable with - cars crash well today - that STi crash would have been brutal in my SCCA legal MGA. Course hitting 100+ in the car took all the straight Road America had.

If you want a roll bar you can have it - if you do not - in my "world" anyway, the driver assumes the risk - but lawyers will drive what we do. I believe the NASA rules state any roll bar has to be CCR compliant - that is a cage....not a street car in anyway then.

heavychevy

What is CCR? Deos that mean full cage?