ericstanley

Okay so I'm going to my first AutoX event, a non-competitive school and practice session. I've read the sticky and a million other posts but I'm curious to know how the more experienced among us run their active handling set up and why you prefer one setting over the other.


Thanks,

Eric

Racer86

the problem with most street systems of AH/TC for racing, is the car may do something different than what you are trying to do. I was a driver instructor in the Ferrari club and at VIR I was driving a Ferrari F430 with the active handling on. At the apex of turn one with a well driven ZO6 on my butt, I gave the 430 full throttle, the ZO6 did the same, but the Ferrari computer was not happy with my intensions and did not let the car accellerate, however, the ZO6 did go, and had to avoid my backend. He went off track to do so. Not good!. Never again will I use any form of AH/TC on the track until the software agree's to pay for any on track damage it causes.

TedDBere

Turn it all off. It's the only way to learn to drive a car at the limit and the only way to go fast.

And be gentle with the throttle and quick with the clutch.

Racer86

Ok , one more personal experience with AH/TC. On the Ferrari F430, it has a bunch of understeer. I trail brake it into a turn,,,, Ok so far,,,,, It starts to understeer (front end pushes out from the apex,,,, not so good, I breathe the throttle ( as You do to rotate the car into the turn) Standard "lift" to cause the car turn in to tighten into the turn,,,, AH applies the various wheel brakes and the car will not rotate,,,, car pushes off the apex, and slows, and I miss the apex by 5 feet. AH/TC,,,, not if I am driving.

ericstanley

Thanks for the insight!

fhturner

I answered "OFF", but I should clarify. I'll usually run the first session of an event (sometimes even first session of each day) w/ the system in Competition Mode. I'll also do this if conditions are less than optimal, such as this past weekend at Barber, when we had friggin' snow covering the grassy areas on Saturday morning. I do this to keep the safety net in place while I re-familiarize myself w/ the feeling of the track and car. It's probably not absolutely necessary, but that's just the routine I've gotten used to...


Fredo


[This is for HPDEs really; I don't do much AutoX these days, but when I do, everything is definitely OFF]

naschmitz

Turn it off at the track and get familiar with how the car handles.

Then try one run with it on to see what TC/AH tries to do for you. In an autocross the system will be very busy if you are fast. But now at least you have learned what that tool can do for you and decide when you want to use it.

TC/AH is a much better tool for the street when a slippery man-hole cover or surprise bump in a corner gets you sideways.

Now if we could reprogram our cars to be able to turn AH off and keep TC on, that would be great for a wet autocross!

ericstanley

Makes sense!

Wayne O

I don't run a lot of autocrosses but I do run road courses a couple days each month. I always use comp mode. I can over-power traction control if I want but I always shutoff TC whenever going WOT. For me, going WOT with TC on is counter-productive...like two opposing forces fighting each other.

Comp mode gives me greater tolerances for sliding or drifting the car. I try not to slide but when I do, comp mode most always gives me enough play to work with before butting-in. If something goes severely off, comp mode would provide a certain level of imposed control that might just help.

naschmitz

I have gotten really sideways and gotten lots of wheelspin with "Competitive Driving Mode." I don't know if it really is a safety net or not. What have you observed the car do for you in this mode?

TedDBere

I'll jump in here with a comment.

It helps until your driving habits exceeds it's limits to help. That's why I turned it off. I found I was leaning on it using it to overcome my poor skills until I exceed even its ability to save me. I turned it off and had to learn to drive the car all over again with out "leaning" on it to help my poor driving skills. And I then got much faster, learning how to control the car, with better reaction skills to avoid spinning.

If you want to learn how to drive well, learn how to drive the car with it off.

BTW, I still keep all the computers on while driving on the street. You never know what you're going to encounter on the street and I like to have it on then.

naschmitz

Hi Ted,

On the track I drive with everything off too. But when I turn Comp mode on just to see what it does, I can't tell if it is doing anything. When you say you are able to "lean on it," what can you get it to do? Do you have to be so out of shape that with it OFF you would have spun?

Thanks, Bert

YorkL8apex

Off in AX and Road Courses, even with a tune the tolerances just get confused as you sling the car around at speed in AX or on a road course.

FYI lots of guys run Comp mode at the drag strip, no real disadvantage and if you get sideways there you need all the help you can get

Racer86

so it looks like everyone agree's,,,, on track,,,, turn it off. I thought that the comment about hitting a manhole cover or slick spot on the street is exactly what AH/Tc will help save an accident from happening. On the street,, leave it all on. Track, turn it off until the techies write the software to really help.
on another comment,,,, Yamaha is currently using a traction and anti wheeling control system,that is using GPS,so the computer knows where the GP bike is on the track and adds the necessary "maps" for that "corner" to control the traction, and in the case of GP bikes, front end lifting at corner exit under throttle. All in real time. So, this stuff will work, but in the case of a street Corvette,,, might not see it for many years

TedDBere

The best way to describe it is to realize that when you are learning to drive fast you push the car to it's limits and when you exceed those limits you learn where those limits are.

When you use AH and TC you push to the limits of those systems too, until you exceed even their limits. Unfortunately the AH/TC limits are different than the limits without the nannies. Their limits are higher and you learn to use the system to reach those limits too. When you hit the AH/TC limits they kick in and slow you down, without the nannies you learn the limits and can avoid the application of the brakes and throttle modulation of the systems. Avoiding the activation makes you faster.

sperkins

I would have to disagree with the majority here. For a newbie track-goer (myself included), I think it's best to keep at least the A/H system active. You should be more concerned with learning the proper line, shifting, braking and overall car control rather than trying to power-slide the car through the corner. At this point, the car is better than you. Learn the limits of the car first and then explore yours.

69autoXr

This is regarding autocross however, not track. I voted turn everything off. If you can learn to control the car without the nannies at autocrosses, if/when you do hit the track you'll be ahead of the game. IMO all newbie track-goers should run several autocrosses before getting on a road course.

sperkins

I guess it would be different for AutoX.

Racer86

Yes, that might be ok, but the problem on a real race track with the nannies on, is that other cars may get involved with you when your nannies does something that no one expects. That is what happened to me (see post above), the AH did not allow me to get the car off the corner fast, and the ZO6 following me had to leave the course to avoid our car. Both good drivers, at speed, under control, until the Ah had a different idea on how to handle the situation. It pulled the power back and caused the car to understeer badly. Its not just your car that can have the problem. The ZO6 driver looked like this in my mirror

sperkins

You are obviously an experienced driver and you were expecting to power through the corner when the AH said . My point is that a novice wouldn't and shouldn't be doing this. Where you would have jumped in the throttle to slide the rear, he would more than likely hit the brakes.