bsalie99

SCCA announced and new CAM class
http://solomatters.com/introducing-c...can-muscle-cam
I currently am running my 2002 Z06 that has a warmed over LS3 swapped in in the SSM class. SSM has become a joke with featherweight foreign cars that can not stay running for more then 5 mins and could never run on the street.
I would have to switch to running a 200 treadwear tire like the BFG Rival. I would think that putting down power might be a problem.

lefrog

I use Nitto NT05 (TW200) on my 02 Z06 (stock engine) and they do a pretty good job. They tend to get quickly greasy if it's really hot but otherwise they get to temp pretty fast and handle the power fine in stock sizes.

427ZM

Cool looking class! This will be the class I run in the few times I run this year.

BrianCunningham

Sorry Bill didn't see this thread

I'm in if you are

BTW I'm actually at the NER SCCA SOLO meeting now, I'll bring it up

findung 335/17 & 335/18 may prove a challenge

bsalie99

It looks like its rivals for tires, not cheap, but about the same as Hoosiers

hklvette

Hmmm. Neat class concept. TW200 limits maximum usable power and helps cars with less-than-ideal suspension.

l98tpi

Just my opinion but I don't think a 80 or newer car is truly a "Classic". I think there should be a limit on the Year of the vehicle.
A C5 Z06 vs a 68 to 80 Camaro, Firebird, Mustang?? I think the SCCA is trying to attract them not bring them around for an *** kickn and run em off.

427ZM

I think, just like the Good Guys cars shows/events, they need to get younger folks into the hobby for it to grow/live, and opening a division up like this promotes this. I can tell you, I've never done an SCCA event (autoX yes, but no sanctioned events) due to rules and classes, but with this class, I will surely be involved in a local event or 2 this year.

l98tpi

There is a novice class for people new to sanctioned autox events. And the different classes are set up to be as fair and competitive as possible. It is fun when you can compete against other cars and have a chance to get a quicker time than the other cars in your same class. But it wouldn't be much fun if you show up and wouldn't have a chance to be competitive. Now, being new to the sport and getting beat is something a competitor could expect, but as the skills improve and there is an unfair advantage because of the other car, hence c5z vs 68 Camaro or even a 2010 Challenger, this will turn people off.

This is just my thought and maybe I'm thinking too deep into the matter.

427ZM

No, I think you're probably right in line with folks that have run frequently, and I do understand that stand point. From the SCCA stand point, there are now more and more completely chassis'd classic cars that are highly competitive with late model engines and other high end treatments that previously to this class, didn't really have a home. My car ('02 Z w/ a 434 LS) as well, wouldn't have a home short of this class from my understanding of the previous rules.

Regardless of how it turns out, I applaud the SCCA for the attempt. It can allow a lot of different cars that are street cars to come out and compete. I look forward to it!

Barbara_S

I am right there with you Bill, but don't buy street tires just yet. I was at the meeting at the New England region tonight, and it doesn't seem like there's support for the CAM class. I traded email last week asking the SCCA national office if I could run my 88 in CAM, and was told there's nothing stopping me from entering. They also said, depending on who actually starts running, they may try to split the class but the quote I got was that there may be changes, but there will be a place for C4 Corvettes.



The region players make the region rules and maybe because none of them drive an American car they are not interested in making it happen. There are some comments on the region forum suggesting coming up with restrictions like live axle cars only. Both are restrictive and neither is in the spirit of what the class is supposed to be (IMO).

I'd like to race with other V8s and get away from the lightweight cars I'm classes with but right now there's too much debate on how to deal with the new street tire class changes that the CAM suggestion was dismissed quickly at the recent NER meeting.

I would say there would have to be member support at the yearly meeting next month, and that's a catch 22 because the people here that might be interested, or any of he target audience of potential new members just don't have a say in it.



-Barbara -

427ZM

Please reiterate, event though I'm not in your region, that drivers that have never competed before due to class restictions are interested in SCCA due solely to this class offering! It will grow the sport to a younger base, which is needed.

bsalie99

I was Part of the Street Mod class when it was introduced. At that time the class was immediately populated with cars that met Most of the considerations of the New CAM. There were camaros, firebirds, mustangs and even a Supra( Japans try at a pony car). The rules were written in a way that also attracted the Diamond start cars( eagle talons, ). At the beginning there an "gentleman's" understanding about the level of streetability of the cars. No protests even at nationals, everyone just wanted to get along and have fun. That all changed after a few years. I now see that you have to regulate every little thing to prevent people abusing the spirit of the rules. Once the BMW M3 drivers showed up in the class, the streetablity went out the window. With loose rules and unlimited budgets, cars with 100k in mods that could only run for 5 mins started to rule the class. At the time I lost interest and move my under preped car to CP.
The Times have changed, both in our region and with the cars that I see at carshows every week. The current best selling sports car in US the camaro is almost unseen at our events( Sorry Dan not you) and the Mustangs are almost as rare. The classic cars I see at shows fall into 2 catagories, Restos and pro touring. These new and touring cars are built to play in out sport , but there is no place for them to be classed. I have talked to these people week after week and they Have Zero interest in coming out and being paired up with some "underweight foreign Buzz bomb" ( quoted from an owner when I spoke to the Camaro club).
At this time the majority of the racer that are running the NER are NOT going to attract this HUGE segment of the car drivers. We have people that have built super fast, to the limits of the rules cars and can drive them better than I could ever think of doing. But they are so far from what these people drive that they have Zero interest. Now the NER does not have any issues filling the entries, but look down the grid at what is there. It looks like a Foreign car repair lot.
I am all for this class and will most likely compete in it even if I dont agree on the street tire rule. Just look at the other clubs that use our locations, there is very little cross over between the entrants.

lefrog

Honestly in NER, I think the SCCA has already too many participants at their solo events. When you already have 200 participants and can get only 4 runs on a good day, you don't really need to attract more people.
As the region is very competitive, there is always someone in each class that has a car that exploits every trick in the rulebook to come ahead. Don't take me wrong there are great drivers there but it is just very hard to have a car competitive enough so that only driver skills will make the difference, especially for us folks with older Vettes.
The good news is that we have plenty of other clubs in the region (BSCC, NE-SVT, TC USA...) that usually have Corvette classes (street or race tires) and its plenty of fun!

bsalie99

I wanted to follow this up in the NER forums, but it wont let me in. If you can help me barb, it would be great

BrianCunningham

Here's the NER thread

http://www.ner.org/forums/index.php/topic,3318.0.html

they all seem to be missing the street tire part of the rule

also none of them own American cars

the rule SHOULD have an age thing, but not at this stage we need to get the # up

bsalie99

Brian I have to disagree about the age thing. the cars this is targeted at are more than capable of holding their own with anything newer. and the newer muscle car car market is huge. Danny Popp and Mike Johnson both either have or are building C3 vettes that are way better than my C5, and they are the tip if the iceberg. You are right about the people in charge not seeing the market, GM and ford are producing the top of the line sportscars and MOST of the owners Have Zero interest in being classed with a 1980 civic that weighs 1900lbs. There is no common ground between the owner groups, American Muscle cars share that common thread,The guy that buys Camaro might buy a Vette or a mustang, but he is not interested in a civic or a miata( unless it has a LSswap)
I hope they offer the class I would run it, I am not happy with what SM has evolved into, If they had a CP like class for vettes I would have moved, as I did with the camaro

BrianCunningham

Bill if we have enough people we can run the class

I'm in, sounds like Barb's in, any more?

bsalie99

Prob get Jeff, and barb might convince her Jeff. And some P.R. at car shows letting them know we have a class and novice program for them could fill it

Dr. Evil

I got out of it few years ago when everyone started chasing tires. It gets so expensive to buy new sets of race rubber every year. It was easier and more cost effective to buy a set of R6 and go to track days since I wasnt competetive at autox. Guys showing up with new A6s with trailer street cars and cubic dollars.
Now that I'm in a new Camaro SS I've thought about trying it out again but they dont make race rubber in 20", if they did it would be cubic dollars. The whole issue of a 200TW tire interests me quite a bit though. I have no desire to give up a Sunday for 4 runs where I compete against a 2500lb car on race rubber though. Just not gonna happen, even once.