C5 autocross beginner. shocks/swaybars or tires.
06-06-2014, 07:57 PM
#1
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C5 autocross beginner. shocks/swaybars or tires.
I kind of want to put some money from my next paycheck into the car to make it more fun for autocross. I am not expecting to be hyper competitive, and apparently my vararam already takes me out of A stock. Right now the only mods are the intake and a borla catback.
That being said I want to either do c6 z06 shocks and a c6 z51 sway bar OR put some sticky tires on the front (rear tires only have ~2k miles on them. The fronts have a decent amount of tread left on them, they are Kuhmo 400 tread rating, I'll look closer to see which tire they are when I get home.
What do you guys think? New front tires or shocks and sway bars? Next month I will probably do whatever I don't add this month. Might be two months from now...
That being said I want to either do c6 z06 shocks and a c6 z51 sway bar OR put some sticky tires on the front (rear tires only have ~2k miles on them. The fronts have a decent amount of tread left on them, they are Kuhmo 400 tread rating, I'll look closer to see which tire they are when I get home.
What do you guys think? New front tires or shocks and sway bars? Next month I will probably do whatever I don't add this month. Might be two months from now...
06-07-2014, 12:32 AM
#2
Melting Slicks
Tires are #1. Miles is not as important as tread compound. You want the stickiest tires you can afford. You probably have to buy a set though. There are many guys on this forum with all the trick parts. If they don't have the right tires, they don't stand a chance. 
Steve
Steve
06-07-2014, 08:35 AM
#3
Gasoline Addict
I would suggest that you change nothing and go get some seat time first. Once you get a little better after a couple of events, then decide what parts you need to throw on the car. Tires are obviously the best improvement you can make to get better times. However, technique is even more important. I personally would spend that paycheck on a autox driving school... you will have a lot more fun, once you learn the basics.
06-07-2014, 08:55 AM
#4
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I've actually been thinking about that too. It's just really fun to mod cars haha. Well, my brother is coming to visit and we have a three day autocross event coming up. He also has a good amount of experience autocrossing and is going to show me the ropes. Thanks for the suggestions so far.
06-07-2014, 09:47 AM
#5
Team Owner
First off, read this for some good information While it applies more to SCCA autocross events, there's a lot of good information there for the novice entrant.
I wouldn't change anything at this point. As mentioned, the best thing you can do to improve your skill level is seat time. The more events you attend, the more you learn about the sport, your car, and how your skills are taking shape.
Start with making sure the tires are inflated to the correct pressure for the car. That will be on the sticker on the door jamb. You might even add 3-5 psi to start and as you get a feel for the car, drop some pressure, maybe 1 psi at a time. I would suggest buying a good pressure gauge that has a way to release air.
Make sure the car is as empty of stuff as possible. Even the floor mats should come out. No cell phones, iPods, travel cups, etc. The car will have to go through a basic tech inspection. It will be checked for excessive fluid leaking, worn suspension, exhaust in place and not loose or hanging down, seat belts in good shape and the battery is held down tightly. Can't hurt to check the torque on the wheel lugs. Some groups will want you to remove the center caps so you may want to do that at home.
Don't worry about a helmet right away as most events will have loaners. Ask if you can use a motorcycle helmet with a current Snell "M" rating; some sanctioning bodies won't allow them, some will. Once you decide you like autocross, then you can start to look for a helmet. YOu might be better off with a helmet with a current Snell SA rating. The SA rating is for motorsports use.
And get SEAT TIME!!!!
I wouldn't change anything at this point. As mentioned, the best thing you can do to improve your skill level is seat time. The more events you attend, the more you learn about the sport, your car, and how your skills are taking shape.
Start with making sure the tires are inflated to the correct pressure for the car. That will be on the sticker on the door jamb. You might even add 3-5 psi to start and as you get a feel for the car, drop some pressure, maybe 1 psi at a time. I would suggest buying a good pressure gauge that has a way to release air.
Make sure the car is as empty of stuff as possible. Even the floor mats should come out. No cell phones, iPods, travel cups, etc. The car will have to go through a basic tech inspection. It will be checked for excessive fluid leaking, worn suspension, exhaust in place and not loose or hanging down, seat belts in good shape and the battery is held down tightly. Can't hurt to check the torque on the wheel lugs. Some groups will want you to remove the center caps so you may want to do that at home.
Don't worry about a helmet right away as most events will have loaners. Ask if you can use a motorcycle helmet with a current Snell "M" rating; some sanctioning bodies won't allow them, some will. Once you decide you like autocross, then you can start to look for a helmet. YOu might be better off with a helmet with a current Snell SA rating. The SA rating is for motorsports use.
And get SEAT TIME!!!!
06-08-2014, 09:54 AM
#7
Intermediate
If you think you are hooked and will autocross for sometime, I would also recommend a harness bar of some sort as well, before shocks etc. Tires are most important. A harness bar with a 4 point harness will allow you to concentrate more on driving and less on staying put. These are not crash protection and should not be substituted for a regular seat belt on the street or at a track, but work great for keeping you firmly in your seat during autocross.
06-08-2014, 01:51 PM
#8
Safety Car
Don't spend any money on modifications for the 1st year. Spend your money on entry fees and travel to different events. Run as many events as you possibly can. Right now your car is faster than you are.
Learn how to dive it before you modify it.
We were going to have shirts made up at one time "Don't drive better - Just buy more."
Richard Newton
Historic Racing Images
Learn how to dive it before you modify it.
We were going to have shirts made up at one time "Don't drive better - Just buy more."
Richard Newton
Historic Racing Images
06-08-2014, 02:27 PM
#9
Team Owner
If you think you are hooked and will autocross for sometime, I would also recommend a harness bar of some sort as well, before shocks etc. Tires are most important. A harness bar with a 4 point harness will allow you to concentrate more on driving and less on staying put. These are not crash protection and should not be substituted for a regular seat belt on the street or at a track, but work great for keeping you firmly in your seat during autocross.
It's also important to use seats are are designed for harnesses. Check with the sanctioning bodies to see what the rules are. Most associations will require that the harness belts go thru holes in the seat back that are made for that purpose.
Tires can play a big part but tire rules at most events may put you into a class where you cannot hope to compete initially. Even a change in size that's different from stock sizes can move you to a different class. SCCA is going thru a change in their tire rules for various classes based on treadwear values. There are lots of decent sticky tires available that are made for the street.
Again, you need to enter lots of events, figure out how to learn the course by walking it first then driving. Be as smooth as possible driving the course. After awhile, you will be going quicker. I have seen novice drivers shave over 10 seconds off their times from their first-ever run to the last run of the day! It's all about "seat time"!! Did I mention that earlier??
06-08-2014, 02:38 PM
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I had looked into harness bars and harnesses too, but I wanted to wait till I start to really get into it and learn my car more. I also wanted to wait till I could add the seats to go with it. Once you add up harnesses, harness bar (or roll cage), seats, seat hardware, and shipping it gets pretty pricey. And I was looking at the cheaper FIA approved seats from a few different companies.
Thanks again for all the info guys. I think I might still replace the shocks because I am running f45 shocks with 60k miles right now and they are starting to show their age. If I do replace the tires I'm probably just going to go with some comfortably sticky 220-300 road tires.
I can't wait to get started
Thanks again for all the info guys. I think I might still replace the shocks because I am running f45 shocks with 60k miles right now and they are starting to show their age. If I do replace the tires I'm probably just going to go with some comfortably sticky 220-300 road tires.
I can't wait to get started
06-08-2014, 06:00 PM
#11
Intermediate
Nothing is really"needed" right away other than a car and the desire to run it, but people like to mod their cars and if you are going to spend some money on it and not something that gets you seat time/instruction then...
I agree 100% that your best spent dollar is on instruction and you don't need to spend any real money on the car early on and money on shocks, springs etc...is not needed as most can't get that close to the full potential of the c5 or z06 without learning to drive much better first.
It really depends on your goal. Most people who come to autocross are just looking to have some fun with their cars and are not too worried about classing and modifications, they just want a car that looks and sounds good first and is competitive second or third. If you get hooked, and your someone who wants to be competitive, then what car your driving and the class your in become factors and you start only making changes that keep you legal in the class you want to run in. Putting on slotted rotors or bigger wheels for example pushes you out of a stock class and into a more modified class, which requires more money and more mods to compete, but generally does not make you quicker.
I will disagree about it when it comes to decent tires as having old or lousy tires gets pretty frustrating, pretty quickly and that is not going to keep you as interested or excited about autocross.
I found the harness bar to help quite a bit, especially in the leather seats of the Z06. My 03 Cobra and STI both had Alcantara centers in the seats and they held you in place much better. An instructor I had said, that a harness can be worth 1/2 second or more per run and he was right, I agree completely.
As far as 5 and 6 point harnesses, it just isn't needed for autocross. Your not going to submarine out of your harness in an autocross unless the event organizer is setting up something really unsafe.
If your going to track the car then, in most cases, a harness bar is a poor and unsafe choice, in my opinion. I think you only need to look at what can happen with a poor design to think twice about using anything other than a properly designed and tested setup.
Convincing yourself that using one to protect yourself from a collision may be an unwise choice. That is not to say one could not be designed and put in, but are you willing to be the guinea pig for a design that has not been crash tested? There is a reason why race organizations like SCCA and NASA have minimum standards for certain types of events.
Continue to go have fun and learn about the experience and you will start getting a better idea of what direction you will wish to follow.
I agree 100% that your best spent dollar is on instruction and you don't need to spend any real money on the car early on and money on shocks, springs etc...is not needed as most can't get that close to the full potential of the c5 or z06 without learning to drive much better first.
It really depends on your goal. Most people who come to autocross are just looking to have some fun with their cars and are not too worried about classing and modifications, they just want a car that looks and sounds good first and is competitive second or third. If you get hooked, and your someone who wants to be competitive, then what car your driving and the class your in become factors and you start only making changes that keep you legal in the class you want to run in. Putting on slotted rotors or bigger wheels for example pushes you out of a stock class and into a more modified class, which requires more money and more mods to compete, but generally does not make you quicker.
I will disagree about it when it comes to decent tires as having old or lousy tires gets pretty frustrating, pretty quickly and that is not going to keep you as interested or excited about autocross.
I found the harness bar to help quite a bit, especially in the leather seats of the Z06. My 03 Cobra and STI both had Alcantara centers in the seats and they held you in place much better. An instructor I had said, that a harness can be worth 1/2 second or more per run and he was right, I agree completely.
As far as 5 and 6 point harnesses, it just isn't needed for autocross. Your not going to submarine out of your harness in an autocross unless the event organizer is setting up something really unsafe.
If your going to track the car then, in most cases, a harness bar is a poor and unsafe choice, in my opinion. I think you only need to look at what can happen with a poor design to think twice about using anything other than a properly designed and tested setup.
Convincing yourself that using one to protect yourself from a collision may be an unwise choice. That is not to say one could not be designed and put in, but are you willing to be the guinea pig for a design that has not been crash tested? There is a reason why race organizations like SCCA and NASA have minimum standards for certain types of events.
Continue to go have fun and learn about the experience and you will start getting a better idea of what direction you will wish to follow.