Zoxxo

Not just near the end of qualifying. They do that in all the sessions. You get the PIT whenever the car has entered pit lane and is still moving down the lane. Once the car reaches it's pit box it goes to PIT.

If you have qualifying recorded you can see this clearly at Q3 6:06 where you can watch the on-screen timing tree superimposed on video of Raikkonen leaving the track, coming into the pits, and stopping at his pit.

The checkered flag means that the car is in the pits after the session has ended (and won't be going back out again.)

Z//

froggy47

Thanks Z!

BrianCunningham

SPOILER STARTS HERE














Hamilton got Screwed

I'm sure the conspiracy theories will say Merc wanted 3 in a row for their driver

BrianCunningham

Press conference transcript

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/mo...ess-conference

froggy47

Thanks for the link, love SV's last comment, concern about the grid girls, my kind of driver.

VetteDrmr

I've gotta say, it doesn't take much to come to that conclusion. It wasn't just a dumb decision, it was an OBVIOUSLY dumb decision. Even if Rosberg and Vettel had both come in for tires, if Hamilton stayed out they would have had a very tough time to get past. Hamilton's press responses were very guarded and "canned". "We win as a team, we lose as a team." "We try to go and win the next one." etc.

I do wonder, though, why did they bring out the safety car? It seemed to me the cars were pretty much down to a decently slow speed via the VSC, the recovery crews were making good time cleaning the track, and I thought they were going to be ready to go back to green pretty quickly.

Any ideas, anyone?

Now, the Indy 500, THAT was a good race!

Have a good one,
Mike

Zoxxo

As I said before, it's easy to "see" a conspiracy theory if that's what you are looking for. But it would be a good thing if folks learned to simply ask (and answer) a couple of questions before leaping to such a conclusion.

1. WHY? This is the number one question that such theories need answering. What would Mercedes stand to gain from such a ridiculous, public, act? I have yet to hear any reasonable answer to this. Why would they premeditate and then execute a plan that would make them look like fools to the entire racing world? And why would Merc purposely give away valuable points - both driver and constuctor - to Ferrari?? And why would you purposely tarnish the world-wide PR value of a one-two Monaco victory (the very reason that Merc is in this game in the first place) with this image:



Why?

2. HOW? The number of things that needed to happen in order for them to put this supposed "plan" into effect is prohibitive on the face of it. If Verstappen had not crashed the issue would never have come up - the last 14 laps would have taken place as normal and Lewis would win (barring any other incidents). So, in this case, Red Bull (or at least Verstappen) would have to be in on the plan and ready to risk life and limb just to initiate things at the proper time. Seriously??

From Autosport:Totally aside from the above quote from the FIA folks, remember that this was the first time *ever* that the VSC was used in an F1 race. And it's at Monaco. So human nature alone would make you a tad nervous about choosing it as your option. I'm not saying that was the case as Charlie Whiting is "the man" with stuff like this. Just sayin'

Remember that the VSC is not meant to replace the safety car. It is meant to be used pretty much as you saw yesterday - to slow the cars down around the entire circuit and prevent F1's version of "racing back to the flag".

The Safety car lasted just 7 laps and 13 1/2 minutes. The crash happened on lap 64 and they went back to racing on lap 71. On lap 66 they finally hoisted Verstappen's car into the air after having to dislodging it from the absorption barriers at Ste. Devote. The remaining 5 laps were spent (a) rebuilding the barriers to spec (they will not start the race back up without this being true) and (b) getting all the lapped cars properly behind the safety car as per regulation.

I would guess that with the teams shouting at Charlie re: clarification about correct positions on track, an extra lap was spent making sure that everyone knew what had happened and that all was correct before they went back to green. There were "we're checking the video" statements on at least two radio transmissions. Just my own guess, however.

Hamilton missed coming out of the pits in first place by just three seconds. It was that close. One, two, three.




Everything we watched made perfect sense to me. I just can't understand the instant "it was rigged!" bit that comes up when things like this happen. Even more on point, this is Monaco - crap like this happens a LOT but no one remembers from year to year. In 2011 Vettel won the race after a red flag that allowed him to change to fresh, soft tires and eliminate the likelihood that Button and/or Alonso would take him for the win. How come no one cried "Fix!" in that case? Did Red Bull order Alguersuari (Toro Rosso w Ferrari power) to hit Petrov and cause the red flag in order to ensure Vettel's victory? Heck, that one's a lot easier to fit into a conspiracy theory than yesterday's race ever could be. In the 2011 race there were both legitimate How? and Why? answers to be had. Not so yesterday.

Z//

Zoxxo

I just came across this. Here's Adam Cooper telling the story this morning:

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/an...-so-very-wrong

Z//

froggy47

Different rules on VSC vs. SC?

This is what I thought I heard as explanation, under VSC all gaps remain as they exist when the VSC lights up. Under SC the cars can (safely - subjective) close up behind the leader.

If I heard that right?

My question is, how does Race Control, control those gaps when real cars, driven by real drivers at all kinds of different speeds are circling the course? Let's say there was only a VSC and the real SC never came out.

Zoxxo

They get info on the steering wheel. Part of the reason it took a while to implement was that all the teams needed tp update their steering wheels - some where still not using wheels with text readouts.

From espn.uk:

"Previously drivers were expected to moderate their own speed under yellow flag conditions, but under the VSC they will have to stick to a time determined by race control in each marshalling sector. If drivers go under the time they will be reported to the stewards in order to be penalised.

"The new regulations add: 'No car may be driven unnecessarily slowly, erratically or in a manner which could be deemed potentially dangerous to other drivers or any other person at any time whilst the VSC procedure is in use. This will apply whether any such car is being driven on the track, the pit entry or the pit lane.' Cars will only be allowed to enter the pits if it is in order to change tyres

"When the VSC period comes to an end, a message will be displayed on timing screens and the "VSC" message on trackside light panels will be replaced by green lights."

Remember that the main purpose of the VSC is really to clear some of the "red mist" from the drivers' eyes and get them to not try and gain time by pushing the envelope of "ok" through yellow flag areas on the track. This pushing the envelope was deemed to be a/the primary cause of Bianchi's crash. By making *everyone* slow down *everywhere* at once on the course, they put an end to that bit so the drivers can relax a bit without fearing that they are losing time to the bozo 30 seconds back. If they can go back to racing without the safety car then great. If not then no harm done.

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NemesisC5

Christian Horner calms fears that Red Bull might leave Formula One
MAY 24, 2015

TEAM PRINCIPAL ADDS RED BULL NOT INTERESTED IN GETTING INTO THE ENGINE BUSINESS

For now, the tension between Red Bull Racing and engine manufacturer Renault remains, but RBR team principal Christian Horner says the team isn't leaving Formula One.

The explosive criticism of earlier in 2015 has now subsided, but it was Red Bull wanting to take all the credit on Saturday for a much better qualifying outing in Monaco that saw Daniel Ricciardo qualify fourth and Daniil Kvyat fifth.

"What we saw was that Red Bull has sorted out our problems with the chassis," team official Dr. Helmut Marko told Speed Week. "This has nothing to do with Renault. This is just the car."

Indeed, on the twisty streets of Monte Carlo, the engine matters less.

"We are a team," team boss Christian Horner told Spain's Marca, "so we win and lose together, but everyone can see that our big problem at the moment is the engine."

Renault recently threatened to pull out of F1 all together, or leave the premier Red Bull team stranded perhaps by buying the junior outfit Toro Rosso. It triggered rumors Red Bull might have to make its own engine.

"We are not engine specialists," Horner declared in Monaco. "We are chassis specialists and at the moment we are not interested in that (making an engine)."

So for now, Renault and Red Bull, unified by contract until the end of 2016, are staying together.

When asked about a sale of the team or an alliance with Audi, Horner answered, "Although there is a degree of frustration, we are not thinking of leaving F1."

By GMM
-------------------------

Now that the inferior Renault engine excuse has been put on back burner (for now) Horner and Red Bull tout their improved finishing order to chassis improvement. Please show a little integrity and wait at least another two races with improved results before publicly patting each others backs.

Also, not sure when CH issued the statement to Spain's Marca but I would assume it was before they admitted Renault engine not the problem.

Zoxxo

Well crap. That was at the top of my list for my birthday.

Z//

froggy47

Thanks.

VetteDrmr

Maybe not "conspiracy", but "opportunistic". I'm full on with you about pre-planning to cause someone to "lose", just way too many variables to control. BUT, opportunistic? Well, that can happen with the flash of the yellow.

WHY is a great question, and is actually mine? WHY did they pit Hamilton? IMO it couldn't be that he came into the pits unannounced, as the crews wouldn't be ready. So, either the team called him in or he talked them into agreeing with bringing him in. In either case, WHY would the team come to that conclusion?

My answer is give a huge boost to Rosberg's mental state. In the past several races he's just acted like a, well, I started to say whipped dog, but certainly NOT like a driver fighting for a championship. Reacting, defensive, always seeming (emphasize seeming) to be a half-step behind Hamilton.

Any idea why the medical car was sent out? Verstappen got out of the car fairly routinely as far as I could tell.

Good point.

Thanks for clarifying that for me. So, do the teams know what the sequence is for bringing the safety car out after the VSC? Or is it a crap-shoot? If it's defined then the STUPID banner gets brought out again for the Merc camp. If it's *not*, then Merc just learned a pricey lesson (BTW, the SC did get deployed before Hamilton pitted, right?)

Yeah, I agree. To me, "rigged" implies coordination with entities *outside* the team, and that's just nuts trying to figure out. Frankly, I just can't figure out WHY Merc would bring Hamilton in, other than I don't think it was accidental.

Have a good one,
Mike

Zoxxo

• He is pretty much always a half step behind Lewis.
• There is no way that Mercedes is paying $400-$500 million per year to play in F1 so that they can hand-hold their #2 driver like that.
• There is no way that Merc would CHOOSE to gamble a sure win for their newly-crowned $150 million boy in order to boost Nico's confidence. This idea ignores the damage this would do the driver #1. And the downside should Hamilton discover that they are playing such games would be??

Follow the link is Message #28. It tells the whole story.

Hamilton was quieter than normal after the race (and not "spitting blood" as one Sky announcer suggested he would be) simply because Lewis started the whole cascade of events himself!!! Read the article.

It took Verstappen 52 seconds from impact to being out of the car. He (rookie) was still holding the steering wheel after the car stopped in the barriers and he held it for quite a while - seemingly quite still (stunned, no doubt.) It took him a full 25 seconds to undo the wheel to allow himself to get out. No doubt the high speed of the impact along with the above "symptoms" which Charlie could see on his video feeds and the rescue team would see on site, led to the "better safe than sorry" option of bringing in the doc.

At this point it's a crap shoot but experience will enable the teams to make educated guesses in the future. If they (Charlie) can clear an incident quickly and everyone is ok then the VSC should be enough. But they are always going to err on the side of safety.

Yes it did. Almost a full two minutes before. Using the timing on the my video playback, it goes like this:

1:33:00 - crash
1:33:23 - 'virtual safety car' shows on the display
1:33:53 - 'safety car' replaces 'virtual safety car'
1:34:04 - lap counter goes 64 to 65 - Lewis (race leader) has crossed start line. No pits on this lap
1:34:05 - video cuts to show Merc pit crew in the box "ready for action" (see article)
1:34:14 - video shows Verstappen talking to "doctor"
1:34:18 - video of pace car leading HAM coming down the hill from Casino. No one else is in view behind him.
1:35:55 - overhead shot of Lewis pulling into pit box for tire change. 4.1 second stop!
1:36:16 - lap counter goes 65 to 66 as ROSBERG crosses the line as the new leader.

Read the Adam Cooper article

Z//

VetteDrmr

Thanks for the reference, that is a good analysis. And provides the two pieces of info that I missed: 1. That LH *saw* the Merc crew on pit road and assumed that Rosberg had pitted (why didn't he ask?), and 2. low he lost the margin for that short period behind the SC.

Yeah, I'm good with being conservative from a medical POV. I think we were so focused on the replays that we lost track of how long he was in the car.

Thanks for sharing, and have a good one,
Mike

froggy47

What rpm's do they launch at for the start? Also for exit pit - race conditions?

VetteDrmr

So, what did you think of the televised race? Top two cars put on a heck of a show IMO.

Have a good one,
Mike

Zoxxo

I have no idea

Z//

Zoxxo

Indeed. Enjoyed it. The GP2 folks usually put on a pretty good show at Monaco once you get the "Peter Principle'd" drivers out of the way (or off the track.) It's also kind of cool that they still sound like proper race cars.

If you haven't watched it, this is a pretty cool video:

http://tinyurl.com/lfdnzlv (youtube - i hate the forum's routine of embedding a giant video frame in my posts )

Z//