Greg Campbell

I grow exceptionally tired of cheap, binding poly and want to jump to some bearings. Before anyone suggests Delrin, I have considered going that root but think that the big boy jump to full on race bearings is best.

However, with the revival of Pfadt (through AFE) there are now 3 options and I wanted to ask peoples experience. My priorities would be proper fit and longevity for a dedicated time attack car.

Does anyone have any experience with the LGs or Pfadt to give an opinion on if the slide in (LG) or glue in (Pfdat) methods are better or worse?

It is worth the extra cost of sending the control arms to an installer (DRM) and have them machine and tolerence as required?

Thanks.

phipp85

With LG and DRM you'll need to send in your arms for them to install. I have the AFE/Pfadt ones in my car now. If I had my money and the many many hours I've spent making the AFE kit trackworthy I would buy the LG setup. I can elaborate more later, don't have time right now.

Werks

Here is my rule of thumb on things after having several years of pretty hardcore tracking under my belt and having gone through multiple configurations of suspension component from various brands. If you are serious about tracking and want the best, stick with a racing company like LG or DRM. If you want something that looks really trick but will probably break/fall apart and more than likely will ultimately result in you wanting to rip the hair out of your head in frustration buy PFADT.

RichieRichZ06

You don't have to send the arms in if you're comfortable machining the front arms down to the correct diameter. I would not recommend the common person try to install the mono *****. It is time consuming, but they are absolutely the best for consistency and overall feeling on track.

A good shop that has done that type of work before can handle the install. We've done quite a few LG mono ball installs now.

100%

I've tried them all and just like many others, my stories can be found on this forum. I have the LG Mono ball bushings in my car and I would never go back to anything else.

phipp85

I should have worded my response different. I was just trying to say don't think you are going to throw these together like a set of poly bushings using a simple vise. I figured most people aren't sporting a vertical mill and a tank of liquid nitrogen in their garage What is the the interference on the LG kit? I figured about 5 or 6 thousandths?

OP you have already gotten plenty of good advice in just a few responses. I still kick myself because was going to buy the LG kit and changed my mind last minute just to save a few bucks

jimtway

The interference on the LG kit is .030-.060". It would take over 1500F of heat differential to press their bearings in. You have to machine either the bearings down or open up your a-arms for a proper press fit. I machine the bearings down. FYI, this is a ton of labor.

I have installed a couple sets of aFe Pfadt kits. There kit is not a press fit, but a slip fit kit. You use aerospace grade locktite to install their bearings, backed up with snap rings. The only thing I ever had to machine and clean up was the face on the lower rear arms to get the snap ring to fit. Talking about maybe .010".

As far as wear/performance, both kit's bearings haven't shown any better than the other on track. I do like the upper a-arm pins better on the aFe kit. It looks and fits like a precision part. Alternatively, the LG upper pins are 2 piece, snapping together. These pins wear out and create slop. I had some showing slop right out of the box.

Hi Volts Z06

I was skeptical about the Pfadt glue in design at first but afte speaking to a few of my competitors who were running them, decided to install them 3 years ago. I can tell you the Loctite in the kit does bond remarkably well and is VERY strong. When I stuffed the car into the pit wall at NJMP this past May (due to a broken spindle) I broke 3 control arms BUT not one of those bearings came out. I've replaced a few monoballs that showed some wear after 3 years of racing but otherwise the product has performed well.

I will say that if had the time to install the press fit ones 3 years ago, I probably would have but knowing what I know now, I'd use the Pfadt units again.

brkntrxn

I have been tracking my Pfadt sphericals for several years now with zero issues.

mountainbiker2

I also had Pfadt bearings. One was loose from the start. All others were fine.

rfn026

Everyone is probably buying from the same suppliers. No one thats been mentioned is making their own spherical bearings. Here's an article I wrote last year about all of this.

Richard Newton

Olitho

I have been racing on the Pfadt kit for about three years now with no issues. I have in excess of 70 races and qualifying/track days on them without issue. They are still performing well and the install did not require machining.

RX-Ben

Richard, yes, the actual bearings are off the shelf parts but no, the kits are not using the same grade bearings.

Nowanker

OK, back to back comparison btwn Pfadt and LG... more like front to back comparison. F of my car has Pfadt, rear has LG. Both products look equally well made.
Bought it that way, so I can't speak to the installation, but using Loctite bearing retainer (green) between close fitting metal assemblies is universally accepted. In fact, I found both mfrs monoballs loctited into the housings to prevent slop.
Neither LG or Pfadt make their own *****... either will wear out but are cheap to replace (

RichieRichZ06

We have found the front upper control arms to be as much as .060" and the control arm get sanded down. Believe it or not, but a brake cylinder hone in the correct size actually works remarkably well. The rest of the control arms are usually .010-.015" smaller than the bushings, so dropping them in dry ice and heating the control arm to 500 degrees works perfect, but you only get one chance to get them in correctly.

It is time consuming, but I have had less issues with LG's press in style than I have with the Pfadt spherical units. I'm glad that everyone else seems to have them stay in permanently, but that has not been the case with a few of our fast local track nuts.

0Anthony @ LGMotorsports

Unless you are QA1, Aurora, SKF...... you are not going to spend the time nor money to get into the bearing manufacturing business.

I know ours are not the same, nor the same manufacturer as other companies just due to the size of the bearing and how we had to do them.

0Anthony @ LGMotorsports

Like the guys have stated before...

We do offer install service both in your arms or new arms for those that do not want to take on the install at home. I have done a number of them now, and I still say getting the stock lower rubber bushings out is harder than putting the sphericals in, but that's me.

Nowanker

Rather than downing the car to order them generically, I ordered replacement monoballs from LG for the back of the car. Nothing exotic... size 'COM 10(T)' as I recall. Not imaging the F would be Pfadt... I ordered another batch from a race supply for those.
Same size, and every heim joint mfr I checked except QA1 has the same dimensions for COM 10 monoballs. For some reason QA1 has a narrower body.
Someone must have already changed those Pfadt monballs and used the wrong size... Not.

trackboss

I have installed the blackdog pieces in all 4 of my lower arms. They are unique in that the have splines machined into the O.D. so as they are pressed into the bores they register properly and provide for some resistance to movement (similar to wheel studs). I believe Pratt/Miller used a similar design when they built the C5R's. The monoballs blackdog uses seem to be high quality as well as quiet.
In my front uppers I have the DRM setup. If it were me I would have machined the cross shafts a bit differently, but for the most part they seem to be well done.
For those that don't know, the monoballs themselves are off the shelf items for race cars, aircraft, etc. The work and design is all in the housings.
If the pivot point does not require any misalignment, such as the C5 rear upper pickup points, a simple delrin bushing with I.D. sleeve will rival the performance of a monoball arrangement with significant cost and installation savings.