VideoGameGeek

Looking to do brakes that fits with my cars overall "theme" (if you will) of street car/club racer. I was doing Auto-X for a while, dropped when I had my daughter and now I'd like to try out some HPDE and work towards my NASA Competition License eventually.

Trying to keep stock-ish engine (intake/header/X pipe/tune) and just start working on the rest of the car.

Is it a better idea to go with something like a Aero6 Setup for a 6-piston front while using 14" stock rotors, or would I get more out of AP Racing T-1 with their smaller 325mm rotors? Better to go big with something like a ST-60 front setup with a 380mm rotor, or use something with lower consumable costs so I can have a set for track and a set for street?

JSTAN

If you have not already done so, read this thread. Lots of good info regarding brakes.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...questions.html

JeremyGSU

If you're just starting out the AP T1 kit will work well for you for sometime and you don't have to upgrade to the 18" wheels. If you already have a ton of experience I would get the AP Endurance kit. You don't need something as big as a 380 kit.

VideoGameGeek

I already have 18 inch front wheels in the front that have some incredible clearance (though not enough barrel size for 380mm brakes according to the StopTech template so those are out).

What I don't want to happen is to end up with a set of calipers that are going to be thrown out in a year or two because they are just a baby step up.

The AP Sprint kit is a expensive compared to Wilwood, am I getting the bang for buck or are we talking a minuscule difference in performance? I know LG swears that the G-Stop kit works for many track rats, but since my end goal is to work up to a Competition License I would like to buy once and get there vs having to upgrade at a later date.

VideoGameGeek

Lots of good info, but I was more looking for people who have BTDT with regard to brake options. I have read every thread I could find, but so many different opinions ranging from W6A brakes are all you need to people saying they started with T1 front setups with stock rears and had to step up to endurance brakes with 355mm rotors.

My thought process right now is to use a front setup that uses a front Z06 14" rotor to resist fade, but I think that the options for that setup are more limited.

Z06Tracker

If I were doing it again, i would likely buy the Willwood Aero6 (14.25 in rotor) for front and the Areo4 for the rear. A buddy (Brkntrxn) of my has raced these for a couple of years and has had great results. You can run the same pads front and rear if you want. The current version caliper design is less friendly in terms of changing pads, but a great performing kit for the money.

I ran the Stop Tech ST40 kit on the front and stock rear calipers with a two-piece floating rotor, and this set-up also performed very well. But, the Willwood kit is hard to beat for the money, and I don't think you would need to upgrade later.

VideoGameGeek

Any issues with the shimming Wilwoods require?

Any particular issue on the track endemic to Wilwood vs what you have seen with AP/Stoptech/Brembo?

It was nice to find a very big setup ready to accept stock sized rotors.

Z06Tracker

I don't think his required any shimming. PM him on this forum, he is very helpful. Also, look at his build thread.

If you want a kit that won't require upgrading, then get something with bigger rotors. If you are W2W racing, the larger rotors help to dissipate heat.

You might also watch for deals on StopTech. Occasionally you find significant price reductions. Depending on timing, you might find a 4 wheel ST40 kit for a good price.

ZedO6

I went with the Wilwood Aero6 14.25 BBk on my C5Z. I too talked to Kevin (Brkntrxn) regarding some fitment questions I had and he was both helpful and still very happy with the package. I considered Stoptech, AP, and Brembo. The Wilwoods by far were the best bang for the buck in a racing brake package. Plus the same kit will work on the C6 should I change platforms later.

I ended up buying from Todd at TCE who was a tremendous help with details, gave great service and the best pricing I could find. Even gave me a credit for the stock street pads included with the kit towards an upgrade to the excellent Wilwood H pads

As for shimming, really a non-issue and the fact that I ended up with different shims on R/L corners validates the need to fit the caliper brackets to the car. I'm sure you can toss the kit on without shimming but performance may suffer slightly.

Anyway, the brakes are incredible. Gone is the mushy pedal after 3 laps hot laps. No more swapping out cracked rotors between sessions or dealing with ridiculous stock thickness pads.

0Todd TCE

To add a bit to the question of shims: this has been covered before with some feeling that such things are not necessary "if the parts are made to fit correctly".

This is a true statement but does not take into account variation of product by other suppliers. In the case of the Aero6 caliper kit for example you are assuming that every brand replacement front rotor is the same spec. From experience; they may not be. Re cast by other suppliers in China, India, Canada....then machined who knows where...a variation of offset is not uncommon.

The other issue is dust plates and ducting.. Depending upon how they are mounted removing the plates can effect the caliper centering. Or not. Or adding ducts...In the end the Wilwood caliper bracket allows for a variety of options is all.

Two weeks after someone here threw a fit about these shim another owner elsewhere was pitching his fit about needing to machine his brackets too allow him to keep his dust plates on anther vehicle/brake kit brand. Can't win I guess...

ScaryFast

What problem are you trying to fix? Define "performs better". Stops better? Lasts longer? Cheaper pads and rotors?

Your stopping g's will ultimately be decided by your tires, not your brakes. All of these kits (including stock C5 brakes) can lock up the tires. Therefore, none of them will "stop better". I've looked at the data with three different calipers on my car (Stock, Wilwood SL6, and AP T1 kit) and the ultimate stopping g's do not vary much.

Buy a new (not fatigued or spread) set of C5 calipers for $240. Make sure you're getting NEW and not remanufactured. Rockauto has about 10 options for C5 front calipers, but only one part number is NEW. Maybe splurge and get rears, too. Buy some good 2-piece rotors for all four corners and add front air ducting. Change your fluid and find a pad that you like (DTC-70, ST47, Carbotech) and then revisit your situation.

I think you'll find that your $3k for a BBK is better spent elsewhere for now.

VideoGameGeek

I spent a qhile looking at brake torque and effects of brakes.

I narrowed down that I wanted a system that would hold up for lap consistency, require fewer changes for pads/rotors, and be able to keep costs down by using widely available pads and stock sized rotors.

I personally think that braking is one place GM cut corners.

VideoGameGeek

I hear you, but I would be remiss if I didn't ask those who have BTDT before dropping the coin.

My wife hinted that I may be getting some bucks for a joint Christmas/B-Day gift to put towards the upgrades.

ScaryFast

And what did you determine from the info?


Hold up for lap consistency how? Consistent lap times? Consistent pedal feel?

I am not trying to be difficult, believe it or not I am trying to help (and possibly save you money). This forum is full of posts where people put on a brake kit and say it "feels better". Who the hell cares how it feels? How were your lap times before and after?

The T1 kit was issued to solve a specific problem which I don't think you have. The other brake kits are simply adapting better calipers to our cars because people will buy them. Results are varied.

As for costs, have you compared the costs vs longevity of the types of pads you like to use?

If you're set on a BBK just because it "should" be better, I'll bow out of the conversation and let others chime in.

SunnydayDILYSI

I have the LG kit for 17" front wheels, it's similar to the AP-T1 kit. Since you already have 18" fronts, there is no reason to go with either of those other than low cost pads and rotors. At some point, you will be looking for more brake performance on track. I recommend stepping up to the Stoptech kit (I likely will over the next year or two myself) if you can do it with a reasonable amount of shim.

VideoGameGeek

More along the lines of not having fade and not having to hot-swap pads frequently.

My only point on AP/ST/Brembo is: is it worth 2-2.5 times the money? Am I getting that much better performance.

SunnydayDILYSI

For HPDE, the AP and LG/Wilwood setups with stock rotors / wheels are great. It is a big upgrade over stock and I out brake most folks in a very competitive group (instructors and racers of various classes). These calipers offer much better pad life, consistent braking, and low cost relative to stock. However, it is hard to lock up the wheels with DOT R tires (e.g., NT01 and R888). If you want to be competitive with wheel to wheel racers on slicks, bigger brakes front and rear are required. If you don't care about being competitive with top racers, it isn't worth the money.

JRitt@essex

If your goal is to ultimately get your competition license and be tracking your car fairly frequently, brakes will become one of your biggest expenses alongside tires and fuel. That is a fact. To minimize your long-term brake expenses, you should buy the best front brake kit that you can afford. Doing so will pay dividends until the day you sell your car. Do it once and do it right.

I've had many customers go with lesser kits, only to find out that they still don't have the performance they were always seeking. They're still dropping a lot of money on consumables, dealing with fade, having to bleed their brakes at the track, etc.

With a fairly stock car (which it sounds like you plan to keep), you can usually get away good pads, lines, and fluid on the rear of the car. Generally speaking, most guys tracking their car go through 3 sets of front pads and/or discs for every one set of rears.

If you want to call us, we're happy to talk about your specific setup, plans, etc. and make a recommendation. Also keep in mind that AP Racing holds its value better than most other brands on the used market. When you buy our kit you often get 60% back on it when you take it off the car and sell it used. The same can't be said for many other lesser parts.

Anyway, give us a ring and we'll point you in the right direction. 8am-5pm ET, 704-824-6030. Thanks.

In the meantime, check out our blog and see what our customers have to say about our Essex/AP Racing Brake Kits.

ZedO6

I can second what Jeff has posted above. While I didn't go with AP, I did put the biggest brakes I could fit on the front of my car and retain the 18" wheels. I was only doing this upgrade once.

I read multiple posts were guys "upgrade" to better calipers and stock sized two piece rotors and quickly outdrive that setup. Likewise with any of the C6Z OEM rotor with aftermarket caliper options.

It's simple physics, a matter of converting energy into heat. Although I have no plans to build my stock LS6 or turn my car into a track only car, I came out of 15+ years of road racing and expect to run full sessions with a consistent brake pedal. The cosumables cost is significantly lower and I simply do not worry about my brakes anymore. I do a bleed at my shop as part of my pre-track prep and never worry about the brakes at the track.

Also like Jeff suggests, I only upgraded the front brakes. Rears are stock with ST-47's. On R comps the rear brake do not suffer like the fronts did and the pad wear and rotor life are acceptable.

Lots of good advice in this thread.

sccaGT1racer

There is nothing worse than going for the brakes at 160 mph and not having consistent braking lap after lap. Put the biggest brakes you can afford on your car. Ive used wilwood ,brembo and ap when I was racing. The ap's were the best and the brembo's were a close second. Wilwood was just a step up from stock.