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I'm a bit late to the party, but I read all the posts over the weekend. The D & D Grand Sport in Norway (white/blue roadster with #2 on it) is #32, my old car. This was Deans track and magazine car from 1995. He was hauling it back to Ohio from Arizona for a magazine shootout and his haul truck broke down. He unloaded the GS in West Texas and drove it to Austin, TX and offered it to me. It was a good car. Dean knew I was interested in buying a car, so he offered me a complete car (less wheels and tires) for the price of a kit.
Tim, can you post pictures of your former GS? I've seen pictures of a very early D&D coupe with the paint and livery of the #003 GS (i.e. "2" and white hammerhead stripe) over in Europe somewhere, but never a roadster.
The D&D roadster in Norway was almost identical to the one I obtained in 2010 from a gentleman in California. Mine was #DD021 and I had pictures from the Facebook page with Dean and my car. My car was originally owned by a gentleman in PA that knew Dean and was either the first or second roadster of 12 that Dean built. By the way mine was the one that was at the Russo Stelle auction that got damaged in Jan 2010.
The D&D roadster in Norway was almost identical to the one I obtained in 2010 from a gentleman in California. Mine was #DD021 and I had pictures from the Facebook page with Dean and my car. My car was originally owned by a gentleman in PA that knew Dean and was either the first or second roadster of 12 that Dean built. By the way mine was the one that was at the Russo Stelle auction that got damaged in Jan 2010.
I remember your car well and the damage it suffered. I hope it's completely repaired and working well now. And, I knew Rick, the fellow from whom you bought it.
I believe yours was the 2nd roadster built. #020 is a maroon roadster out of Florida and it is the earliest serial numbered D&D I know about.
(Before serial numbers were assigned, D&D Grand Sports were assigned VINs based on a Julian date.)
Good to hear from you again Jim. Yes you and I spoke on the phone before I purchased and yes I have completely restored but I don't thank you are ever finished with them. I am still thinking about building a new engine for it but for now is on the back burner since I just finished building a new home at the age of 70. At least I have a larger garage that I can store both my Vettes and the trailer.
By the way the first owner of my GS was Lou which I have also spoke to a few times and if you look closely in the Facebook picture I referred to has his name as "Driver" on the side.
Here's a picture from 1996. Dean wanted the racing wheels and tires and that was fine with me. I had PS Engineering make a set of wheels for me and put street tires on the car. It was a fun car, the paint job was beautiful.
Here's a picture from 1996. Dean wanted the racing wheels and tires and that was fine with me. I had PS Engineering make a set of wheels for me and put street tires on the car. It was a fun car, the paint job was beautiful.
This is too weird. That is the car I own now. The original owner of my car was Lou Depretis which appears on the side of your car in the picture. My car is DDGS021 though and Rick in Calif. bought it from him along with a coupe at the same time.
Here's a picture from 1996. Dean wanted the racing wheels and tires and that was fine with me. I had PS Engineering make a set of wheels for me and put street tires on the car. It was a fun car, the paint job was beautiful.
Tim, I noticed that the car in Norway has a small block in it. Mine has a BB 454 boarded to 463 that Lou took out of a dragster he had. I do have PS Engineering wheels like yours had. The livery had been changed to "George Wintersteen" when I got the car and I actually purchased from a gentleman that Rick sold it to at a cars & coffee in Irvine,Callif. Dean must have built two roadsters almost just alike.
I just remembered something else about my car, it had a B&M Hydro in it which was unusual because most had standard rather than auto. I cured that though when I blew the torque converter up. I converted to a period correct Muncie 4 speed and made the transmission support removeable.
Ed, I believe #32 was build for Lou, but for some reason he didn't get it. It may have been because Dean asked to use it for promotional purposes and Lou didn't want the car after he was done. I believe he built another for him even though yours is earlier. Dean may have taken #21 that was designated for someone else and passed it on to Lou.
Dean blew the engine in #32 at an event in Fort Worth, hauled the car to Austin, TX and Larry Ray helped him put a motor in it. I was present for the motor swap. They were going to pull the motor on the return trip home and give it back to Larry or pay him for the motor (can't remember the agreement). Dean borrowed hit father-in-laws truck for the trip and it broke down on the way home. Dean had a broken truck and a borrowed motor at this point. He drove the GS from 400 miles to Austin in 45 degrees. When he arrived to Austin, I got a call from Larry saying that Dean needs to sell GS #32. I bought it from him. Dean proceeded to rent a truck, drive 400 miles to the other truck and trailer and load the broken truck up for the drive back to Ohio. I don't know how he got the rental truck back or if he did. This may account for why Lou did not want #32. If I've presented some of the story incorrectly, I apologize. This was in April of 1995.
Ed, I also remember Dean saying that Lou wanted a big block and automatic, that helped justify not taking #32 in addition to the wear and tear on the car. The motor that came with the car when I got it was not as radical as the one that blew up in Fort Worth.
I remember your car well and the damage it suffered. I hope it's completely repaired and working well now. And, I knew Rick, the fellow from whom you bought it.
I believe yours was the 2nd roadster built. #020 is a maroon roadster out of Florida and it is the earliest serial numbered D&D I know about.
(Before serial numbers were assigned, D&D Grand Sports were assigned VINs based on a Julian date.)
Jim
Jim, do you have a list of the D&D cars? I am wondering where my "kit" fits in. I have looked throughout the car and frame but cannot find any serial markings. My car was built in CT in 1997 by Autoworks.
Bill, my 021 DD roadster has the serial number etched with weld on the drivers side frame member under the hood and a plate on the drivers side birdcage door seal. I don't know if it was put anywhere else on the frame.
Tim, thanks for the added information on our cars. These replicas have a sorted history just like the originals. It is kind of fascinating to learn where they have been and who had them. I had heard about the breakdown in Texas but did not know rather it was my car or another one. You helped clarify that and why both of our cars looked so much alike.
Jim, do you have a list of the D&D cars? I am wondering where my "kit" fits in. I have looked throughout the car and frame but cannot find any serial markings. My car was built in CT in 1997 by Autoworks.
Bill,
I have varying amounts of info about the following D&D Grand Sports:
You'll note that between #020 and #094 there is consistency in the VIN format. I have no idea how/why the other VINs are so different.
Not listed is our own D&D prototype which doesn't have a sequential VIN at all. Rather its VIN is a Julian date indicating the construction date, in particular 31392, the 313th day of 1992.
Of some note is that DDGS069 is the GS formerly owned by Tim Allen.
I could give you an approximate VIN range for your D&D if you posted the following photos:
1. Profile shot of the whole vehicle from the eye level of the belt line
2. Head on shot of the front suspension from a point of view low enough to see up to the front crossmember and steering rack. Bonus points for enough detail that I can see the radiator support brackets.
3. Down looking shot of the entire steering shaft and u-joints.
One other thing.... the VIN on our prototype is written in a bead of weld on the bottom side of one of the engine mount brackets. You have to be under the car, obviously, to see it. Have you looked in that area on yours?
Jim
Edit: I just noticed that my list doesn't include DDGS039 and DDGS040. #039 was built by CF's own JohnZ, John Hinckley. #040, a Penske roadster, was once owned by a close friend of mine. I don't know why my info on those cars didn't show up.
Last edited by jim lockwood; 03-09-2017 at 04:12 PM.
These replicas have a sorted history just like the originals.
Some more sordid than others:
Our D&D prototype was purchased by a German racer who intended to import it to his country and vintage race it as the real GS #003. He went so far as to have counterfeit FIA papers created which show the race history and ownership of our GS back to 1964! Before the car left the US, though, it was impounded by US Customs and held for 13 months while its true identity was determined. Dean got involved. GM got involved. Lawyers were involved. And out of this whole mess came GM's awareness that people were making Corvette look-alike vehicles and their effort to shut down the industry as a whole.
I always got a kick out of Lou Depretis name on my car. I traded it on a 1968 L89 in about 1997. The fellow I traded it to sold it to Christian. Christian and I communicated for quite a while, he was a nice fellow. I know he had a wreck on the track and had the car repaired. He sent me a Swedish magazine article about the car in about 1999.
Can you imagine Dean taking the car off the trailer not far from El Paso, TX and driving it with no plates to Austin in frigid weather? He had an oil leak and the car looked like it was in a war. He would stop for oil and to warm up and get back on the road. I remember the phone call asking if I wanted a completed car for the price of a kit.......
I could give you an approximate VIN range for your D&D if you posted the following photos:
1. Profile shot of the whole vehicle from the eye level of the belt line
2. Head on shot of the front suspension from a point of view low enough to see up to the front crossmember and steering rack. Bonus points for enough detail that I can see the radiator support brackets.
3. Down looking shot of the entire steering shaft and u-joints.
One other thing.... the VIN on our prototype is written in a bead of weld on the bottom side of one of the engine mount brackets. You have to be under the car, obviously, to see it. Have you looked in that area on yours? Yes, been all over the frame.
03-06-2017, 11:21 AM
