MikeM

This is why I asked in post #51 if you figured out your prior problem with timing. Why not just put your timing light on #1 plug wire and spin the engine over and see where your timing really is?

hedgehead

Try it using one set of points.

Jim_C

Utahcarguy
I have not followed the whole thread so forgive me if you already know this.
You said "Then, I rotated the dist cap counterclockwise until the light came on"
It"s a problem if you locked the distributor at that point. The spark plug fires when the points OPEN. When the points open the field in the coils primary collapses inducing voltage in the secondary.
You should have rotated the distributor till the light came on then backed it off till the light went off. Lock it at the point the light goes off.
CUL Jim

Utahcarguy

Jim C, I locked it once the light went on as I rotated counterclockwise. I haven't had a chance to work on the car since this time, but my plan is to retard the distributor enough so the engine seems to crank easily(basically your advice without using the test light but rather listen to the engine). Once I get it started I can work on dialing in the timing a bit better.

Thanks for your help.

Jim_C

Utahcarguy
It's really pretty simple to set initial timing. If you set the engine to 10 degrees and rock the distributor so the light alternately goes on and goes off, then set it to the exact point the light goes off, the spark will happen at 10 degrees. Good luck!
CUL Jim

Utahcarguy

I tried this last night and still had issues. I pulled all the plugs to see if I had hydro lock and I didn't. The car cranked easily with the plugs removed. I put them all back in and it struggled to crank again. Turns out, it was my battery.

I hooked up a jumper box on the car and it cranked much better, but still didn't fire! I'm headed to work on the car again this afternoon. Anything else I should try?

As a note, I have my old CSV installed in the doghouse, but I disconnected the other side of it. Instead, I have a long hose connecting to where I am sucking on it while cranking. I've also tried just plugging the hole. She still hasn't fired up.

Y0GI

Are the plugs still "wet" like they are getting fuel?

My '63 FI failed one time because the flex cable between the distributor and the high press. fuel pump broke. Sounds like this might be a long shot for you though.

Yogi

Utahcarguy

Thanks for the tip, but I have my cable exposed outside the cable housing so I can see it working properly. And it's new

Y0GI

Cool! One less item to worry about.

Yogi

MikeM

That doesn't mean it is turning the pump just because you can see it turn without the housing. There are short cables and long cables and there are good pump shafts and worn pump shafts where the cable fits.

Have you tried squirting some gas into the plenum as suggested several times a week ago to see if that will make it hit? If you have, I haven't seen it.

Utahcarguy

Mike, I replaced the pump shaft. I know it turns the fuel pump because as I said in weeks past, I did a flow test with the unit of the car.

Unless I'm missing something, a flow test would prove the unit is working correctly as long as gas squirted out when vacuum was applied and the shaft was turning the FI fuel pump.

I did not squirt gas in the doghouse but rather starting fluid and it kicked a little like it was going to start. The FI expert I had over (he has 6 of these things apparently) said the gas would just go down one cylinder while the mist form the starting fluid would disburse more evenly throughout all 8 cylinders.

I hope once my battery is fully charged I can get it to kick over! Jeez. This has been ridiculous.

MikeM

You should have done this to start with and the second thing you should have done is run your "expert" off your property as he doesn't know what he's talking about.

Raw gasoline won't burn. Vaporized gasoline will.

Utahcarguy

So I got the car to start AND run today. I almost shed a tear I was so happy.

To recap this thread...just kidding. As Mike pointed out, my lack of knowledge and understanding about how to systematically diagnose issues, I was all over the board with these problems. I'd like to blame some of that on the fact that the difficulty was compounded by having multiple issues at the same time without knowing it, but in the end, I am just a novice trying to figure things out over the internet.

First it was the Petronix system that failed. That was replaced by good ol' points.

In the process of diagnosing fuel issues, I replaced a component of the FI unit called a Spill Plunger (SP). This interesting device was replaced in case of future potential issues mine was prone to having (wimpy internal spring). It was replaced by the newest rendition called the Thumb Tack SP. I had no idea what it did, but after reading the ST-12 manual, I knew I could install it.

I installed the new SP and didn't give it another thought until today. During the last couple weeks while diagnosing issues, I found that my FI unit would work perfectly off the car during a flow test, but would not run while on the car. I thought the distributor was turning too slow compared to the drill.

I called John De Gregory, where I recently bought these FI parts from, and explained my findings. He explained that the SP acted like a accelerator pump and perhaps b/c the fuel only flowed during high speed drill testing, that maybe that was the issue.

I pulled the FI unit off again and sure enough, the SP was loose in it's location. It had not properly seated with the O-ring. So I lubed it up and got it seated correctly. I started a flow test and it flowed at a MUCH lower speed now. At that point I knew I was golden!

Now the car runs, but it's rough. I used my timing light to get the timing correct (12* at idle on the front driver's plug (#1,right?)), but I'm getting some diesel sounds and rough engine running. At first I thought I was too advanced, so I retarded the dist. and that helped, but the rough running didn't go away. I set the points gaps and timing, but not dwell (needed even if gap is set?)

I also checked all the spark plug wires on the dist and on each plug. I guess there is a chance that one or more of the new plugs is bad and a cylinder or two isn't firing???

I started a new thread. Please see it here

rustylugnuts

Unless this was already covered, I’d check for moisture inside distributor cap, may of develop a hairline crack. If moisture is present squirt a little WD-40 inside wiping clean with clean with rag. Check for loose or cracked ignition wires. Also replace cap ASAP if moisture is present.

I request an old school mechanic that can be present. Troubleshooting online regardless of experience can lead you down the wrong path and be very costly. Having a good (old school) mechanic live is worth his weight in gold, and you can pick his brain learning valuable information that you can’t find anywhere online.

Hands on, is the key!

Fuelies rule..... rustylugnuts

Frankie the Fink

Did you ever get a vacuum gauge hooked up ?

These engines are a big air pump and that gauge is a helluva diagnostic tool. F/I or carbs; doesn't matter !