Devil_Dog

Good morning and Happy Memorial Day to all.
Here's my latest challenge. I am just finishing up the restoration of my 64 vert which included a new complete wiring harness. Now that everything is hooked up I am finding an assortment of electrical problems. Which include:

- Tail Lights: When I turn on either turn signal all four tail lights flash. The front passenger side turn signal is strong but the driver side is weak. I suspected this was the result of a bad ground and added an additional ground line to a rear driver side signal lamp, still no joy.... Also the rear license plate light is non functional as well....

- interior lights: do not come on when the doors are open, nor when I attempt to manually turn them on with the headlight switch (turning counter clockwise). Now the crazy thing with them is they DO come on if the headlights are on and I press the brake pedal!

Thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated!! For what it's worth everything else seems to be functional and she starts up great!
So close to finally being able to take her out for her first post restoration drive!

65silververt

Tail lamps- Did you replace the steering column harness wiring? Do you have the dealer optioned hazard flasher switch? I'm going to guess that your problem might be located in the steering column harness if it was not replaced. Check to make sure the steering column harness wires are all in the correct place on the plug where it meets the main harness.

License plate lamp- Have you checked for power to the wire with a tester? Ground the tester to a known good ground and see if power is getting to the wire. If so, then it is a ground issue, especially if your tail lamps are working when in the parking lamp/lights on mode.

Courtesy lamps- I could be wrong, but this could also be linked to your steering column harness and a ground if they are coming on when you depress the brake pedal.


Considering your problems, I would start with the old wiring(if there is any) and check to make sure all wires are in the correct place. Second, i would check all grounds(including the negative battery cable) then check them again. Make sure you don't have any rust behind any of the connectors and if so, sand it off to bare metal. Third, I'd check the new wiring to make sure somebody did not connect the wires incorrectly to the plugs.

wombvette

I would look for the connection between the interior lights and the brake lights for a clue. The interior lights would be connected to the brake lights through only through the rear wiring, and then through the parking light circuit. That goes through the harmonica plug on the steering column. If one of those wires happen to be in the wrong position it could feed throughout the system. Or maybe the rear connector to the rear harness. Unplug the rear harness and test for proper operation on the front and the interior lights. Could have more than one thing going on at the same time.

Easy Rhino

Jason,

I was wondering what had happened with this car - you've made some amazingly quick progress on your '64. Outstanding work. I suppose that the old interior got tossed?

I agree with starting with the steering column wiring. Most do not enjoy futzing with wiring, but it is a necessary evil. Good Luck.

Devil_Dog

Silververt, thanks for taking the time to post a response. A few answers to your questions:
- I didn't replace the steering column harness, but the signals, etc all functioned properly prior to my replacing the harness.
- I don't have the dealer installed hazard flasher.
- I have disconnected and reconnected the steering harness and all appears to be in place.
- I looked again at the wiring to my license plate light and figured out I had wired the ground to the frame instead of the light frame. Switched that and it is now working fine.
- Battey ground. I am currently running a modern stereo system with two amps so in an effort to ensure I was getting ample ground connection to the battery I ran two lines back to the battery one from the engine block and the other from the frame. Both are zero gauge lines. So I shouldn't be having any issue with ground connection to the battery.

Thanks again for the insights and if you have any more thoughts/questions please let me know.

Cheers,
Jason

65GGvert

The symptoms indicate a missing ground. All the rear lights are grounded behind the dash. The ground wire goes from the rear up through the rear body connector to get there. Each of the sockets at the rear must have a ground. They are connected together by short ground wires under nuts on the sockets. Same for the license light. Until you get a proper ground for the rear lights, you won't be able to troubleshoot because all the lamps on the car that are grounded will feed the voltage through the filaments to ground and cause other symptoms that aren't related to your problem.
Also double check your courtesy light bulbs (all three) to be sure that you have the proper bulbs. If you use a single contact bulb instead of the proper dual contact (case is not grounded) #90 bulb, you'll cause lots of other issues because those bulbs are different from the others used. They do not ground to the case of the bulb, but rather through the second contact at the bottom of the base, which is then grounded through a wire that grounds when you open the door or turn them on with the headlamp switch. Test by pulling out the courtesy bulbs and see if your other symptoms go away.. but the ground must be good at the dash for the rear lamps, or you're wasting your time.

65GGvert

Look at the black wires at the bottom right of this diagram and follow through the rear body connector to the dash. Everywhere there's a black wire in that section at bottom right of the diagram, it must read continuity to ground.

Devil_Dog

Hey Rhino. Yup the last of the old interior is now gone. So close to being done that it's killing me to not be able to drive it yet. But first I need to figure out this electrical challenge!
Back to wiring....
Cheers,
Jason

Devil_Dog

65gvert, thanks for the insights. Will continue trouble shooting as per your suggestions.
Cheers,
Jason

65silververt

Did you just check for a loose connection on the steering column wiring or did you check to make sure that all wires are in the correct sockets?

Devil_Dog

Okay so I figured out the problem with the tail lights. Apparently the previous owner had wired backup lamps even though the car doesn't have a backup switch on the transmission. So when I ran the new harness set up for four standard brake lights the different bulbs in the inner tail lights were causing a short. So to fix the problem until I can replace the tail Backup light assemblies with standard brake light assemblies I just pulled the bulbs. As soon as I pulled the bulbs my turn signals started working correctly.
Although all turn signals now work correctly I still have no brake lights nor do I have any interior lights.

Progress, but still not street legal....

Thoughts?

Devil_Dog

I just checked to ensure all was tight and that all the wires were properly seated in the connectors. I didn't check to ensure that the correct lines were in each space, but now that you mention it I will check it out! Thanks!

Devil_Dog

Okay so my saga continues. I now realize that my inner tail lights are actually designed to be back up/reverse lights, and that they had the bulbs for reverse lights. But my car doesn't have he reverse light switch on the transmission not do I have the harness for a car with reverse lights. Once I pulled the incorrect bulbs my turn signals started working correctly but I still have no brake lights. So the question is, would having the wrong tail lamp (even without bulbs) cause the brake lights to not function?

Trying my best to track down these issues and any thoughts are greatly appreciated!

wombvette

Shouldnt

Devil_Dog

Thanks, I was thinking the same thing. Just need to keep chasing the gremlin...

65silververt

If you want to swap back up lamps for regular lamps, I'll trade you(as long as yours are in the same condition) Mine are like new.

Devil_Dog

I wish I had seen this earlier because I would've been interested, but I went to Zip and bought a set yesterday!

Devil_Dog

I now have brake lights!!

Decided to replace the signal switch in the steering hub and now I'm good!

Only problem is my horn is no longer working. Two steps forward, one back... But at least I'm now able to finally get on the road!!

Much thanks to all as always, I love this forum!!

Devil_Dog

Everything is now working as it was intended! Only issue is the horn gives me a shock sometimes. Apparently a ground challenge, but at least it works!
Thank you all again for the insight and support!

65GGvert

Run a jumper from one side of your rag joint to the other and see if that fixes your shock. The originals had a copper strap across them to ground the column to the other side. The shock is the collapsing field of the horn relay through your body instead of through the rag joint.