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Phil, if you have to change the setting of your fuel pump > go to #6 Pro-Tuning; scroll down to #11 - Fuel Pump Control; then go down the page to #7 - PWM Low Flow; Adjust this down until the fuel pressure gauge reads 58 psi or very close. Mine reads 59 psi with the PWM reading at 47.5%. If I go to the next lower setting (46.3%) my gauge drops to 56 psi. Conversely, if you go to the next step higher - above 47.5 psi the gauge reads 61 psi.
PWM Low Flow =
When the fuel flowrate is low, and all of the other conditions for allowing PWM control to be met, this is the percentage of duty cycle that is used. Set this such that fuel pressure doesn’t drop below the rated fuel pressure of the system.
Here's a tip about the handheld controller and the settings in both tuning sections > Go EFI Tuning and Go EFI Pro-Tuning. When you are looking at a parameter you want to change > highlight on it by scrolling to it. The parameter will light up and tell you the scale in either time, per cent, rpms or ratios.
Once you have high lighted a parameter the value changes in the last column to show what scale you will use - %, ms, ratio and rpm. In some tuning sections it could be all per cent changes. In other sections, all different variables could be represented in the list to tune.
OK, now that I'm at it. The most important function to set is the IAC steps and this is related to getting the idle set correctly from the beginning.
I have reset my IAC steps a number of times. The first time I set my idle when I first started it - somehow I was mis-informed and set the rear set screw on the passenger side. From there a number of mis-steps until I got it sorted out.
The right way. Front drivers side - Phillips head screw - turn in to raise idle by opening the front 2 barrels just a little. An 1/8 to 1/4 turn at a time. Motor should be at operating temp. when making this adjustment. Shut off engine, after turning screw, for about 30 seconds or until the numbers disappear from dashboard display. Repeat procedure until your happy (3-10).
Every time I improved the function of the IAC steps, all the other values improved a little as well. If you change settings and go for a drive. After, if you scroll through the settings - the ECU makes changes just slightly to some of the variables. Even now if I change parameters I check my IAC numbers keeping them between 3-10. Because as you change different parameters i.e. DFCO; Decel Open IAC or LOOP Rate Up/Down the IAC steps change as well. So as you constantly adjust variables you also have to keep an eye on the IAC and if the steps change too much an adjustment must take place.
The IAC does not like to be static. As I come to a stop many times it drops to 0 and stays there for a few seconds before creeping up to 3,4,5,6,or 7 sometimes up to 10 or 11 at idle. I've tried setting it at 11-14 but found the engine didn't like this as much but still ran pretty well here.
If your IAC is set properly - setting the other parameters becomes much easier. It's OK to play with the settings but only do one parameter at a time. Don't be afraid to go up and down to see what the changes do.
Write down or take a pic of your original settings so you know what they are if you have to return to these.
Learn how to save a good calibration in the Pro-Tuning section - go to Read Calibration and save it in one of the 5 settings available.
All these parameters of adjustment are pretty well universal across the TBI fuel injection spectrum. From F.A.S.T. to Atomic, Holley, Edelbrock, QFT or however. The settings and parameters are almost the same across the board. Liken it to the different carbs on the market - they all have similar settings and ways to adjust them as does TBI fuel injection.
And if anyone thinks one TBI system is better or superior than another TBI then just peruse the various TBI forums and you'll see they are all the same. Guys with problems - not enough tech help or not enough expertise to go around.
Some guys - absolutely zero problems to guys completely giving up and wanting their money back. It doesn't matter what forum the problems are the same.
The problem as I see there are just too many variations of engines and HP, vacuum, cubic inches, side pipes jeez even barometric pressure and elevation - what have you. Tuning can be daunting unless you know how to manipulate fuel maps which some systems allow - not all.
Trying to tune your way to success maybe formidable.
My education continues.
Wayne, Any results from your dyno session? My tank arrived Tuesday afternoon. I started on the switchout first thing Wednesday morning. Removed carb and mounted throttle body. Ran fuel pump wire and handheld wires through an unused firewall plug just below power brake can. Inside the cockpit I cut the existing wire and soldered 12 gauge wire to it. From there I routed it along side the existing wiring for the fuel sender and rear lights on the driver side to the plug at the rear of the compartment and then to the pump. Pulled spare and assembly, removed mufflers, drained tank and removed tank. Mounted fuel filter regulator in similar position to yours, but under frame instead. Supply line and fittings installed from regulator to hard line. Then I attached fuel sender, pump assembly, and filler neck to tank. Ready today to install tank and then move to front to run fuel line from hard line to throttle body. No problems so far! I'll take some pictures today.
I used 400HP Street EFI kit (the new one, without timing control) with in line fuel pump with return. It took me at most one day to convert. Start up and first drive was very smooth. Happy so far.
Wayne, Any results from your dyno session? My tank arrived Tuesday afternoon. I started on the switchout first thing Wednesday morning. Removed carb and mounted throttle body. Ran fuel pump wire and handheld wires through an unused firewall plug just below power brake can. Inside the cockpit I cut the existing wire and soldered 12 gauge wire to it. From there I routed it along side the existing wiring for the fuel sender and rear lights on the driver side to the plug at the rear of the compartment and then to the pump. Pulled spare and assembly, removed mufflers, drained tank and removed tank. Mounted fuel filter regulator in similar position to yours, but under frame instead. Supply line and fittings installed from regulator to hard line. Then I attached fuel sender, pump assembly, and filler neck to tank. Ready today to install tank and then move to front to run fuel line from hard line to throttle body. No problems so far! I'll take some pictures today.
Bob, 67 convertible
Bob, sounds like you did a nice job getting it this far. Keep up the good work and post later for an update on your perseverance. Hope when the engine starts for you everything is good.
Yea did the chassis dyno last week. This is what I learned from that.
HP to rear wheels is 380 at 5800 rpms and torque is at 430 at 3800 rpms. The dyno tuner said I'm losing 40-50 HP in my sidepipes. I have the Sweet Thunder 2 1/2'' pipes. He said I need a 3'' internal diameter pipe. Classic Chambered Exhaust makes 3'' chambered pipes and I think I will pick up a set in the early fall and install them - then back on the dyno.
Anyway, on the day of the testing the tuner had never seen a FiTech system so some learning was involved. I spent a good 4 hours on the dyno while he was tuning. We had to take a break at least 3 times because it got hot in the car. After it was all over there were a lot of parameters that were changed and some numbers were much different then what I would have assumed. For example my DFCO return fuel value is now at 200 from 65 because at this point there is no popping in my exhaust at the 3500-4500 rpm. He also mentioned to me about not using 94 octane because of the ethanol in it. So I will try Esso 91 octane without the ethanol to see if this makes a difference. Maybe I will be able to lower that 200 number if the 91 octane works.
That's why I'm changing my pipes as well. Classic Chambered said there pipes don't pop, backrap or drone. Hope it's true - they also have a pair of sidepipes with resonators that are suppose to be a little quieter without sacrificing HP.
The last thing the tuner said I needed was a pair of tires that can really hook up. Nitto drag radials 275/60-15 are on the agenda but I'm not sure how soon I will get them - still doing the research on that change.
I had FI Tech 4 installed on my 65 roadster. I love it, car runs great, runs smooth, idles smooth etc. However on three occasions it has not started ad hoc. I drove it and turned key off came out an hour later and it would not fire off. We found there was no gas being feed into the injectors. After checking the inline fuse, my mechanic said it was loose and pushed it in tight it fired off and ran great for a week and was driven daily. Then it happened again after a short drive it would not start. After several attempts including the key to the off position I finally got it to start. The car idled smooth and run good.
I spoke to FI Tech support and they said it had to be an ignition problem since I verified I was getting proper fuel pressure to the injectors and to check the blue wire to the negative side of the coil to make sure it was tight, it was and is. I even bought a new coil but again had the problem of it not starting after running great for a few drives. It has good spark and it cranks good but just no gas being shot into the injectors on occasion.
Initial installation included a new gas tank with an electric fuel pump in the tank and a return line. The fuel pump is working fine and supplying proper fuel pressure to the injectors, you can hear it click on when the key is turned on.
Any ideas what to check for next? I am concerned of being caught out and it not starting.
Last edited by c5biscuit; 06-15-2016 at 11:27 PM.
Reason: Want to make a new post in lieu of a reply.
Since there is only about 6 wires - start with the ground first. Then, since it seems to be in the ignition wiring, try to check for a good circuit here. Try to find where the splice is and check to make sure the connection is proper. Did you crimp and solder joints, heat shrink and tape. Sometimes something as simple as this causes those kind of problems. Also, engine to chassis ground is it intact.
I'm going to guess you didn't do the install by the sound of your thread. That's why my concern about the wiring.
It sucks when it works good but then gives you headaches with the no start hitch.
Hope it's not to hard to solve -- good luck and keep us posted.
Since there is only about 6 wires - start with the ground first. Then, since it seems to be in the ignition wiring, try to check for a good circuit here. Try to find where the splice is and check to make sure the connection is proper. Did you crimp and solder joints, heat shrink and tape. Sometimes something as simple as this causes those kind of problems. Also, engine to chassis ground is it intact.
I'm going to guess you didn't do the install by the sound of your thread. That's why my concern about the wiring.
It sucks when it works good but then gives you headaches with the no start hitch.
Hope it's not to hard to solve -- good luck and keep us posted.
Bob, nice read. Glad for your success right out of the shoot. All that research you did paid off big time for you. And you are using the C5 filter/regulator for returnless? If you are it sounds like it's also working well. Good the elevation is not a problem for you.
My fuel pressure is close to what yours is set at - mine 62% giving me 58 psi.
Just to let you know the more I drive the learning improves all the time. After my dyno test the tuner told to get out on the open road and hold the throttle position at 2000 rpms and go up 500 rpms at a time and hold that position being aware of how your engine sounds. Of course, my problem would occur in the 3300-4500 rpm range. So whenever I could drive at an rpm in this range and hold my foot steady on the gas I would watch the dashboard screen AFR trim till the numbers started to get close to 0.0. They will bounce around the zero number and will be a little pos. or neg. Once close to this value I would go up another 500 rpms and again hold the pedal steady until the AFR trim leveled off again. My dyno guy told me to do this up the rev range till she learned the AFR trims. I will say it was pretty good advice and has helped the learning potential of the efi. Now once you get close to your rpm redline you may want to be a little more careful.
C5biscuit, Fitech directions say to run red power wire directly to battery. What they don't mention is that you need a good ground for the throttle body, too. I ran mine from the front right corner where the metal is clean directly to the battery. Often these random electrical problems crop up because of low voltage due to poor connections or poor grounds.
I just finished my install of a 600hp unit and I am extremely pleased with how it turned out. I used a LS2 type returnless setup with a fuel filter/pressure regulator installed below the tank under the rear frame rail. A single line runs from that to the throttle body while a return line goes from that back to the tank. The supply runs behind the rear frame rail, over, then along the side rail, follows the side rail up over the axle and along the top of the wheel well, down between the crossmember and the seat pan, along the inside of the frame rail to and thru the next crossmember, then over the splash guard, back over the rail and up to the filter, gauge, and 45 degree fitting at passenger front side of throttle body. This really limits the number of possible connections that can leak. Problems that I had: fuel leak at tank due to poor fitting between brass tank and aluminum pipe thread fitting. Used liberal amount of teflon tape to fix that. Could not use existing hard line due to excessive corrosion at front end of line. Fuel pump would not run on initial start try due to ground wire broke free from crimped connector. New connector and also soldered it this time. It then started and ran great, but while I was checking connections and fooling with controller I found that my heater core started leaking into right footwell. Fortunately I have not installed my new carpet yet. Just the padding and a mat got wet. Had to insert 5/8 and 3/4 bolts wound with tape into back of heater hoses to bypass heater. I only had to adjust fuel pump from stock setting of 40% in startup page (new due to Fitech command center problems) to about 70% to get get 58psi on my gauge. 40% only gave me 25 psi on gauge. I originally thought I had a bad gauge because it did run fine at idle, at least at that pressure. Weird! I also had to increase the accel pump setting at normal operating temp due to a cough when I tried to rev the engine. Went from 0 to 70 for that setting. My home here is at just under 10,000 feet elevation. That is the primary reason I decided to try EFI. Took a test drive up and over Hoosier Pass which is 11,529 feet. Car ran like a scalded dog! I stopped several times to check for leaks, etc, but no problems and it started back up every time. IAC counts are perfect right out of the box! Could not be happier with this unit. I am not using the timing control yet and not sure I will bother. I have a MSD 6 and billet distributor. Big block hood to go on today. This post may seem out of order as I inadvertently deleted my previous post!
Last edited by Corkscrew; 06-17-2016 at 05:01 PM.
Reason: Explanation!
Wayne, Thanks for all your help. You really seem to have a handle on this EFI stuff. Also the Chevelles EFI forum that you pointed out has a ton of great info.
Bob, what I like about the EFI section on the Chevelle Tech Forum is a lot of the guys are Ford and Dodge guys as well as all kinds of Chevy people. Everybody there is interested in helping - so all that good info ended up their and people just started graduating to this forum. Before we knew it, great info was coming through.
What I don't understand is why a couple of Fitech techs aren't there offering advice. They know this forum exists because of Bob (rel3rd) who was paramount in getting info to the general public. Also, Fitech made changes to their system because of what transpired with the FCC because of Bob. I too received my refund for my FCC just a few days ago.
I have nothing bad to say about FiTech. I think their throttle body is one of the best working TBI systems of the bunch. I checked and read all their instruction manuels. They all have some drawbacks and strong points but Fitech is easy to install, has the least amount of connections, has data logging, advanced tuning and is the least expensive by far. Their only caveat - a better instruction manual for tuning and explaining how everything works especially in regards to what the settings mean.
Bob, thanks for the nice comment about what I know about EFI. When I started out 4 months ago I new nothing about fuel injection. Had a steep learning curve and still only know enough to get by.
I had an interesting thing happen to my handheld controller this last weekend. It stopped working. It would work fine when connected to my computer, but dead when hooked up in the car. Wiring was checked to be intact and connections to handheld felt normal. Called Fitech Monday afternoon. Let it ring at least 40 times before someone finally answered. They took my name and number and said someone would call back "in a minute". Well, that minute lasted until late this afternoon. Talked to Cody. After I described what the situation was, he immediately said to look at the connection point for the small power wire. The pin in that connection had been pushed to the side and was not inserting into the external connector. Pushed it back to center and that fixed my power problem. Apparantly I am not the first to experience that, as he said they are going to change the connectors and the point of connection at some point in the future. Meanwhile, the car is running great here at 10,000 to 12,000 feet elevation! It should be really impressive at sea level.
Hello everyone. I just installed a system on my '63 autox car on a 350 roller cam/4spd setup. I've been following along on this forum and on the chevelle forum, and i want to say thanks to Wayne and everyone for posting so much info. I wouldn't have purchased the system with out seeing the open communication first.
I do have one question that i haven't seen an answer for: Is it possible to take DFCO out of the picture completely?
I autox'd this weekend, and trying to feather the throttle through a sweeper (very light throttle, off and off the pedal) was a mess because when the gas returned the car jerked a lot. Also, i had very loud popping on decel (i have chambered undercar pipes).
Hello everyone. I just installed a system on my '63 autox car on a 350 roller cam/4spd setup. I've been following along on this forum and on the chevelle forum, and i want to say thanks to Wayne and everyone for posting so much info. I wouldn't have purchased the system with out seeing the open communication first.
I do have one question that i haven't seen an answer for: Is it possible to take DFCO out of the picture completely?
I autox'd this weekend, and trying to feather the throttle through a sweeper (very light throttle, off and off the pedal) was a mess because when the gas returned the car jerked a lot. Also, i had very loud popping on decel (i have chambered undercar pipes).
Any help is appreciated, thanks jason
Jason, I'm a little late on getting back to you. I was on vacation and away from a computer.
It can be taken down some. DFCO Cut Fuel Map can be reduced to as little as 10. Mine is set at 12. This should stop a lot of what your experiencing.
As well:
Dfco Return MAP = Above this MAP, Deceleration Fuel Cutoff will be exited, and fuel injection returned.
Dfco Cut Fuel MAP = Below this MAP, Deceleration Fuel Cutoff can be used.
What you should do before adjusting these two parameters is watch your MAP setting. Accelerate to about 3500-4500 rpms and let your foot off the gas and then look at your MAP number. What is the lowest number that is achieved with foot off gas. Lets say it's 20. So, DFCO return map is set at about 22. The DFCO cut fuel map would be set at 19 because below this the fuel will be cut right off until the MAP rises above 22.
These are just examples. Try to keep these two parameters fairly close to each other. Not just 3 values apart but maybe 5-10 values but you will have to drive and experiment. There are other values to adjust but these will get you going in the right direction.
For whoever else is working through installing one of these systems, here is my update:
At first (after talking to fitech) i thought the exhaust popping on decel was 'lean pop' but that was wrong. Watching the O2 sensor it was going up to 20 without DFCO.
So doing what Wayne described i set the DFCO Cut and Return MAP numbers and it helped the popping a lot. I have under car chambered pipes by the way.
My next problem was when it would exit DFCO i would get a crazy hard surge of fuel which would jerk the car forward, so after calling fitech the told me to back down "ACCEL PUMP 170F" and that has seemed to fix it. I went down 5 steps at a time. My next autox is this weekend so we'll see how it does there.
Two more experiences i had:
I burned through a spark plug wire boot and had some crazy things happen to my system (i'm using timing control) in that the screen would lock up with RPM showing over 15,000 and my ignition would shut off momentarily. The arcing from the boot to my ex. manifold caused the interference.
My screen went nuts while i was driving the other day like someone was pushing the bottom right button repeatedly and it actually changed some settings (the car started running terrible) before i could unplug it. I think they have a tolerance problem on their aluminum case, and i had to loosen the 4 screws holding the halves together to relieve the pressure on the screen. I will probably get some thin washers to put between the halves.
For whoever else is working through installing one of these systems, here is my update:
At first (after talking to fitech) i thought the exhaust popping on decel was 'lean pop' but that was wrong. Watching the O2 sensor it was going up to 20 without DFCO.
So doing what Wayne described i set the DFCO Cut and Return MAP numbers and it helped the popping a lot. I have under car chambered pipes by the way.
My next problem was when it would exit DFCO i would get a crazy hard surge of fuel which would jerk the car forward, so after calling fitech the told me to back down "ACCEL PUMP 170F" and that has seemed to fix it. I went down 5 steps at a time. My next autox is this weekend so we'll see how it does there.
Two more experiences i had:
I burned through a spark plug wire boot and had some crazy things happen to my system (i'm using timing control) in that the screen would lock up with RPM showing over 15,000 and my ignition would shut off momentarily. The arcing from the boot to my ex. manifold caused the interference.
My screen went nuts while i was driving the other day like someone was pushing the bottom right button repeatedly and it actually changed some settings (the car started running terrible) before i could unplug it. I think they have a tolerance problem on their aluminum case, and i had to loosen the 4 screws holding the halves together to relieve the pressure on the screen. I will probably get some thin washers to put between the halves.
thanks
Jason
Thanks for the update.
I have also been having some issues with my handheld...Sometimes, very intermittently, the screen goes gray, blanked out. I have to unplug both wires from it, and re-plug them in, then it seems ok, aside from loosing memory of what 4 things I was using it to monitor...
Also, the last 2 times I drove the car, the small "mouse" push button that changes screens, and saves info with, doesn't work but about 1 out of every 15-20 times. This only happens when trying to push button IN, not sideways or up and down...to make a change, I have to use the on screen buttons at bottom of screen, to change and /or edit...
Jegs says they will warranty, via email, but I am going to call them later today, as well as call FiTech for confirmation of where to send it for repair/replacement.
05-28-2016, 01:42 AM
A Couple OF Tuning Tips: may help some
