Old Road Tests 1966 Vette fastest? 1969 Fastest?
09-29-2006, 11:44 PM
#1
Team Owner
Thread Starter
Old Road Tests 1966 Vette fastest? 1969 Fastest?
Opinion only. All data points to the ZL1 vette as fastest, but with stock exhausts limited to low 13 pass (3.70). The L88's mostly probably ordered with 3.08/3.36 for road racing and should be in top ten with this axle and most definitely with 4.11/4.88's. The famous 1966 L72 test, I don't see hard facts but that 12.8 @112 lingers there on all of the lists! The early year 450hp rating I think wasn't just a sticker in 1966. I do think early L88 engines were released with M22 and that test was maybe a very special car! 1969's would be stronger than 1968 based on oval port heads etc. The most accurate test as a benchmark for Corvettes of C2 & C3 is the honest 1965 396 14.0 at 103. The 1966 had bigger bores and lost a little weight. The 1969's & 1968's have to be able to hook up better because of tire size. The side exhausts differences from 1966/1967 to the 1968/1969 substantial? Naturally I don't want to talk about cars with headers because a good 327 1962 with headers being lightweight can get into the 12's. Honest opinions! You guys know who you are! The type of guy that has looked at these articles, wrote down the car features, put them on a list together, thought about the actual test weights, rear end ratios, engine installed etc.. Don't want the replies from guys that have heard from a friend from another friend about a 1966 427 beating a 1969 L88 in small town, USA. Be real! I am going home, will look at this post Thread on Monday to see how the actual slide rulers come out on this topic! Have a great weekend!
09-30-2006, 04:55 AM
#5
Racer
How about a...
...3000lb wet without driver 1970 ZL1 in a 69 L88 Coupe (stock 11.5:1 pistons, stock cam, stock heads pocket ported, stock manifold port matched with a dominator and 3/4" spacer, 2 1/8" open headers, 4.88 gears, 10.5" slicks, IRS set to 2" of travel via custom 2" metal blocks bolted to the hub carriers, and a TH400 with a converter = ???
Ready?
This one was built by GM Project Engineer Gib Hufstader and his crew, and timed at the strip (Motor Trend, Oct 1969)...
How about 10.60 @ 132MPH with a blueprinted essentially stock ZL1 with gears, headers, slicks, converter and carb!
L88's and ZL1's were race cars and as such were normally taken down and blueprinted prior to racing. The stock exhaust was only included to keep them quiet when moving around the factory and dealer parking lots prior to delivery to some lucky soul, who promptly trashed it.
Doug
...3000lb wet without driver 1970 ZL1 in a 69 L88 Coupe (stock 11.5:1 pistons, stock cam, stock heads pocket ported, stock manifold port matched with a dominator and 3/4" spacer, 2 1/8" open headers, 4.88 gears, 10.5" slicks, IRS set to 2" of travel via custom 2" metal blocks bolted to the hub carriers, and a TH400 with a converter = ???
Ready?
This one was built by GM Project Engineer Gib Hufstader and his crew, and timed at the strip (Motor Trend, Oct 1969)...
How about 10.60 @ 132MPH with a blueprinted essentially stock ZL1 with gears, headers, slicks, converter and carb!
L88's and ZL1's were race cars and as such were normally taken down and blueprinted prior to racing. The stock exhaust was only included to keep them quiet when moving around the factory and dealer parking lots prior to delivery to some lucky soul, who promptly trashed it.
Doug
Originally Posted by TCracingCA
Opinion only. All data points to the ZL1 vette as fastest, but with stock exhausts limited to low 13 pass (3.70). The L88's mostly probably ordered with 3.08/3.36 for road racing and should be in top ten with this axle and most definitely with 4.11/4.88's. The famous 1966 L72 test, I don't see hard facts but that 12.8 @112 lingers there on all of the lists! The early year 450hp rating I think wasn't just a sticker in 1966. I do think early L88 engines were released with M22 and that test was maybe a very special car! 1969's would be stronger than 1968 based on oval port heads etc. The most accurate test as a benchmark for Corvettes of C2 & C3 is the honest 1965 396 14.0 at 103. The 1966 had bigger bores and lost a little weight. The 1969's & 1968's have to be able to hook up better because of tire size. The side exhausts differences from 1966/1967 to the 1968/1969 substantial? Naturally I don't want to talk about cars with headers because a good 327 1962 with headers being lightweight can get into the 12's. Honest opinions! You guys know who you are! The type of guy that has looked at these articles, wrote down the car features, put them on a list together, thought about the actual test weights, rear end ratios, engine installed etc.. Don't want the replies from guys that have heard from a friend from another friend about a 1966 427 beating a 1969 L88 in small town, USA. Be real! I am going home, will look at this post Thread on Monday to see how the actual slide rulers come out on this topic! Have a great weekend!
Last edited by doug_dayson; 09-30-2006 at 05:04 AM.
09-30-2006, 09:55 AM
#6
Team Owner
After going to the dragstrip myself a few times I have pretty much lost interest in this topic... why? Track times and mph will vary greatly depending on how the car is set up and how it is driven. The car mags should just put their test vehicles on a dyno instead of taking them to the track. Then you might get comparable results. Some of those test cars given to magazines in the 60s and 70s were not regular factory cars taken at random off the assembly line, but were specially prepared vehicles setup to produce impressive test results. One would like to think the car mags were using good drivers but who knows and how can you compare one month's test to the next month or one mag to the next mag? And including a car with a production run of 2 (or 3) is ridiculous also. L-88s? What is the point of testing a 69 L-88 with a factory 2" exhaust? 
09-30-2006, 12:00 PM
#7
Racer
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09-30-2006, 12:44 PM
#8
Race Director
Originally Posted by strokervette
I found this... http://www.autofacts.ca/classics/fast.htm
09-30-2006, 03:10 PM
#10
Team Owner
Thread Starter
Thought I had better check the thread!
Where did all of these Mustang Guys come from????????????? I do respect them, and would choice a 1965 GT-350R in my garage so as not to offend. I know this topic has been brought up and brought up again. Actually I have calculated, factored in tires, gearing, wind resistance, etc. and have what I think is almost the definitive list on just the early c1 c2 & c3 Vettes. I honestly wanted some final input just to see if I missed something or someone else had a theory worth considering on anything! A manifold, an exhaust, a carb etc. could change the net hp (to rear wheels) just enough to put another car in front of another. It looks like most guys here are content to just let the 1966 L72 list as supreme. Yes the ZL1 tests in the mag, I have looked at! My second list will include factory prototypes and dealership tuner specials. I honestly don't mind listing the runs with headers on cars like the L88's because they usually got a set when they got the car. I would like to exclude cars with like small blocks that had no factory available header. Naturally the side exhausts would be fine. A 1964 running a 8.20 tire gets kicked out. Sometimes you can tell where to draw the line on a Hot Rod or Car Craft tuned vehicle. When they start changing plugs, or advance curves etc., that one has to be thrown out. Just calculating the actual weight of these various years was interesting. The Curb weights listed in all of the books are so ridiculous. If you add or subtract for this or that, then you can derive how those numbers were published. Basically a 63-67 car weights less then a 68-77. 1975 are heavy. Heavy duty drivetrain added to bigblock cars. Disc brake weights vs Drum brake weights. 4 speed or automatic.
Therefore the 1969 ZL1 rules. I have both 1964 and a 1968 car so I like both styles but the 1966 L72 should not stay on top. The ZL1 is passed on because of only 2 built. But why I keep it on the list is because two individuals got them through the dealership. Therefore it counts as a production car (limited production naturally). The L89 I think could beat the L88 in the 1/4 mile just as a 440-6 pack Mopar could whip a 426 hemi. Launched better, more streetable torque etc.. but those L88 and 426 hemi's were catching up quick and would blow by the others. If guys truly aren't interested in this discussion. Then I will happily die having my list and just keep it to myself. With enough support, logical thought and input. I originally thought that the Corvette Forum could gather up the most accurate definitely list of the actual fastest vettes and that list would be the benchmark that gets published in all of the rags forever and forever instead of the trash lists that exists. The one list that was linked to in this thread is a good solid list. It has merit and I have looked it over for years and added to it, subtracted from it. etc. It has race cars, it has Vectors that really weren't tested until recently so that could be corrected greatly. I give the author credit for at least getting it together and the bottom line is that I am not looking for any type of fame. I would just like to see an accurate list put together. Year after year after year, when a feature article is published in a magazine, the beginning of the story is as boring about the car types history until you get to the individual's car story. I wish the magazines would skip the glory story of the particular model of car and focus more on the Owner's modifications, specs of the car, and unique stories than a rehash of boring history. Hope you all see my point so I will end here. Now the ignorant can tune in to slam me. The ignorant should just ride the bus. Let's put it this way, if you don't change your own parts, or tune your own car then don't speak! HA! HA!
PS. Factory AFX or SOHC Mustangs with the big bubbled hood, the one super snake, Bill Cosby special Carrol Shelby built Cobra one off, Hurst Hemi Darts & Cuda's, Altered wheelbases, factory altered Plymouth's and Dodges, lightweights, swiss cheese pontiacs or Bobcat. The Grand spaulding or Dana stuff, this or that or COPO are cool, super cool and do make the lists and should be published more accurately because they existed. Agree, Agree, Agree! I have them plugged in on my data, but this is supposed to be a Corvette Forum!
Therefore the 1969 ZL1 rules. I have both 1964 and a 1968 car so I like both styles but the 1966 L72 should not stay on top. The ZL1 is passed on because of only 2 built. But why I keep it on the list is because two individuals got them through the dealership. Therefore it counts as a production car (limited production naturally). The L89 I think could beat the L88 in the 1/4 mile just as a 440-6 pack Mopar could whip a 426 hemi. Launched better, more streetable torque etc.. but those L88 and 426 hemi's were catching up quick and would blow by the others. If guys truly aren't interested in this discussion. Then I will happily die having my list and just keep it to myself. With enough support, logical thought and input. I originally thought that the Corvette Forum could gather up the most accurate definitely list of the actual fastest vettes and that list would be the benchmark that gets published in all of the rags forever and forever instead of the trash lists that exists. The one list that was linked to in this thread is a good solid list. It has merit and I have looked it over for years and added to it, subtracted from it. etc. It has race cars, it has Vectors that really weren't tested until recently so that could be corrected greatly. I give the author credit for at least getting it together and the bottom line is that I am not looking for any type of fame. I would just like to see an accurate list put together. Year after year after year, when a feature article is published in a magazine, the beginning of the story is as boring about the car types history until you get to the individual's car story. I wish the magazines would skip the glory story of the particular model of car and focus more on the Owner's modifications, specs of the car, and unique stories than a rehash of boring history. Hope you all see my point so I will end here. Now the ignorant can tune in to slam me. The ignorant should just ride the bus. Let's put it this way, if you don't change your own parts, or tune your own car then don't speak! HA! HA!
PS. Factory AFX or SOHC Mustangs with the big bubbled hood, the one super snake, Bill Cosby special Carrol Shelby built Cobra one off, Hurst Hemi Darts & Cuda's, Altered wheelbases, factory altered Plymouth's and Dodges, lightweights, swiss cheese pontiacs or Bobcat. The Grand spaulding or Dana stuff, this or that or COPO are cool, super cool and do make the lists and should be published more accurately because they existed. Agree, Agree, Agree! I have them plugged in on my data, but this is supposed to be a Corvette Forum!
Last edited by TCracingCA; 09-30-2006 at 03:47 PM.
09-30-2006, 04:13 PM
#11
Team Owner
As with any list like this it's hard to get a good judgment on each category listed.
As the list posted stated, and I quote:
"Accurate? Not necessarily. That largely depends on possibly hundreds of factors that need to be taken into account during testing, including weather, altitude, drivers, traction, etc."
Those are just a few factors but you could include in the "etc." headers, timing, traction control devices (suspension mods) and the list goes on.
As for the Corvette times the '69 ZL1 427V8 is the king of the Corvette world as far as factory production goes IMO. I guess if you take into account there are only 2 then the '66 L72 427 takes it according to that list posted. This is for vintage muscle car era Corvettes only as there are a lot of late model Corvettes that really motor in the 1/4.
There are many Callaway’s and tuner houses that can really make a factory cars fly in the 1/4 but there are those pesky "etc." again.
Lets just all be glad that the car manufacturers have made factory cars that will satisfy the race car driver in all of us over the years.
As the list posted stated, and I quote:
"Accurate? Not necessarily. That largely depends on possibly hundreds of factors that need to be taken into account during testing, including weather, altitude, drivers, traction, etc."
Those are just a few factors but you could include in the "etc." headers, timing, traction control devices (suspension mods) and the list goes on.
As for the Corvette times the '69 ZL1 427V8 is the king of the Corvette world as far as factory production goes IMO. I guess if you take into account there are only 2 then the '66 L72 427 takes it according to that list posted. This is for vintage muscle car era Corvettes only as there are a lot of late model Corvettes that really motor in the 1/4.
There are many Callaway’s and tuner houses that can really make a factory cars fly in the 1/4 but there are those pesky "etc." again.
Lets just all be glad that the car manufacturers have made factory cars that will satisfy the race car driver in all of us over the years.
