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Old 04-30-2008, 04:48 PM   #1
Hadez
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Default E10 Gas 90% Gas/ 10% Ethanol

Florida is making the switch to E10. I just filled up the vette this mornng and as I was nearing full I noticed a new sticker on the pump saying E10. I searched here and on other muscle car forums but could not find a definitive answer if E10 would harm the vette since it is a 69 L46 combo with 9:1 compression and Qjet.

The only items I found were

1. E10 loosens sludge in gas lines & tanks if they are original/old? Mine are all new and the carb has been recently cleaned & rebuilt so I guess I am safe on this issue?

2. Should I reconsider jetting the carb?

3. E10 should have a higher octane reading than regular gas 93 rating according to 1 website. So does this mean E10 @ 87 octane reading on the pump is not actually 90 octane?

I read on here that E85 is crap for our cars and on other forums. I guess all the more reason to continue saving for a fuel injected LS type motor.

btw...my car was literally down to the last gallon and then I drove about 20 miles with the new E10 blend and thus far no problems with the E10 blend that I noticed. We will see when I go home tonight what happens.

Last edited by Hadez; 04-30-2008 at 04:54 PM.
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Old 04-30-2008, 05:13 PM   #2
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I don't know about the long term affects on the fuel system, but I can say that I notice a drop in my mpg using Hess gas which contains 10% ethanol. The mileage on my DD went down an average of 10-12% in a tank full. I now pay a few cents more and use Shell, Chevron or Mobil. Of course it probably won't be long until they follow with the E10.
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Old 04-30-2008, 05:17 PM   #3
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You will be fine running E10. The only real problem I know of is with paper fuel filter.
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Old 04-30-2008, 05:18 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carpedm View Post
Florida is making the switch to E10. I just filled up the vette this mornng and as I was nearing full I noticed a new sticker on the pump saying E10. I searched here and on other muscle car forums but could not find a definitive answer if E10 would harm the vette since it is a 69 L46 combo with 9:1 compression and Qjet.

The only items I found were

1. E10 loosens sludge in gas lines & tanks if they are original/old? Mine are all new and the carb has been recently cleaned & rebuilt so I guess I am safe on this issue?

2. Should I reconsider jetting the carb?

3. E10 should have a higher octane reading than regular gas 93 rating according to 1 website. So does this mean E10 @ 87 octane reading on the pump is not actually 90 octane?

I read on here that E85 is crap for our cars and on other forums. I guess all the more reason to continue saving for a fuel injected LS type motor.

btw...my car was literally down to the last gallon and then I drove about 20 miles with the new E10 blend and thus far no problems with the E10 blend that I noticed. We will see when I go home tonight what happens.
E10 will not harm the engine at all. I didn't even realize that there were states that still had pure gasoline at the pumps, WI has had E10 for years.

The blend will not have a higher octane than is listed on the pump. Pure ethanol has a much higher octane than pure gasoline, and so if you mixed ethanol with 93 octane gas (gasoline only, not a blend) the octane would go up a bit. However, the octane rating on the pump is for the blended fuel.
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Old 04-30-2008, 05:49 PM   #5
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Shell 93 in Platteville WI has 10% ethanol. My engine pings under a load after temps are up, but I think that's a different story altogether.
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Old 04-30-2008, 05:57 PM   #6
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I am avoiding the E10 gas whenever I can. It costs the same money as 100% gas here in my town. I wind up with about 10% less mileage out of a tank of gas. Which in my daily driver is about 40 miles per tank. So, now tell me where the savings is? I have to go back to the pump more often to buy more E10. That is the reason I will be hesitantly buying E10.
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Old 04-30-2008, 06:34 PM   #7
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We've had 10% ethanol in our gas here in MN for years and now they want to shove 20% down our throats. There is no other good reason to use it other than to help the corn farmers. Fortunately we can get normal gas for vintage vehicles, lawn mowers etc. Get an extra fuel filter and take it with you just in case.
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Old 04-30-2008, 07:22 PM   #8
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We've had 10% ethanol in our gas here in MN for years and now they want to shove 20% down our throats. There is no other good reason to use it other than to help the corn farmers. Fortunately we can get normal gas for vintage vehicles, lawn mowers etc. Get an extra fuel filter and take it with you just in case.
Hmmm.... help the corn farmers, or help the Arabs; what to do, what to do. Let me think on that one for a minute.

True, milage will take a small tug down. True, octane rating will go up; check out the most recent issue of Corvette Magazine and read about the 2008 Vettes running E85.

True, if you're running a carbureter you will be prone to vapor lock in the summer; switch back to gas at brand name stations. I'm running a stroked 454 with a Demon carb and have run in ten degree temps up through 110 degrees for three years with not problems except for marginal vapor lock in the city above 85 degrees. (Years ago we used to run stockers with clothes pins on the fuel line to keep the fuel cool--I'm too embarrassed to try it on my Vette).
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Old 04-30-2008, 08:03 PM   #9
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California has had even higher blends for years, and as stated the mileage is a bit lower, but detonation is less. My main concern is the effect it has on rubber parts of the fuel system, and leaks. The hoses on my BOSS and the Vette turn to rock and needed to be replaced anually befor I switched over to the much pricier barrier (hard plastic lined) FI fuel hose. Also, the fuel pump diaphrams go sooner and the accelerator pump diaphrams have died if I parked them for extended periods, like 6 months. Also, after a period of running time, some of the carb fittings will start to weep fuel and I have to tighten everything up to fix it. REALLY irritating!

So, if you still have a choice, stick to the real stuff! Besides, it's a bad idea to use your food to fuel your transportation.

Hans
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Old 04-30-2008, 11:13 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Wrencher View Post
California has had even higher blends for years, and as stated the mileage is a bit lower, but detonation is less. My main concern is the effect it has on rubber parts of the fuel system, and leaks. The hoses on my BOSS and the Vette turn to rock and needed to be replaced anually befor I switched over to the much pricier barrier (hard plastic lined) FI fuel hose. Also, the fuel pump diaphrams go sooner and the accelerator pump diaphrams have died if I parked them for extended periods, like 6 months. Also, after a period of running time, some of the carb fittings will start to weep fuel and I have to tighten everything up to fix it. REALLY irritating!

So, if you still have a choice, stick to the real stuff! Besides, it's a bad idea to use your food to fuel your transportation.

Hans
Several good points there. I first noticed the "10% Ethanol" sticker on my favorite Chevron stations pumps yesterday. My first thought was, "Alcohol ruins rubber."
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Old 05-01-2008, 12:20 AM   #11
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Ditto to all the above. California Air Resources Board ("CARB") published a paper in the mid-90's (CA was switched to E10 in 1994) indicating that vehicle fires had nearly tripled in California since its implementation as a motor fuel. The smog police insist that it reduces emissions, which in a left-handed way might be true, but I myself repeatedly observed a 1:1 reduction in mileage with it vs. straight gasoline, i.e., 10% ethanol=10% less mpg, so you actually burn MORE fuel to go the same distance. "Hi, we're from the government, and we're here to help you!"
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Old 05-01-2008, 12:26 AM   #12
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I saw my local Hess station had 10% Ethanol stickers on all the pumps now. Gas price wasn't any cheaper than the station across the street. Until or unless they change over all gas here to part Ethanol I'm going to avoid it. Why take a chance? Or pay the same price for a product that gives lower mileage? The more I read about Ethanol, the less I'm impressed with it.
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Old 05-01-2008, 03:31 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by birdsmith View Post
Ditto to all the above. California Air Resources Board ("CARB") published a paper in the mid-90's (CA was switched to E10 in 1994) indicating that vehicle fires had nearly tripled in California since its implementation as a motor fuel. The smog police insist that it reduces emissions, which in a left-handed way might be true, but I myself repeatedly observed a 1:1 reduction in mileage with it vs. straight gasoline, i.e., 10% ethanol=10% less mpg, so you actually burn MORE fuel to go the same distance. "Hi, we're from the government, and we're here to help you!"
Ethanol, while having a lower amount of energy for the same volume as gasoline, has a much higher octane rating. An engine is only going to run efficiently on ethanol fuels if it can take advantage of that.
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Old 05-01-2008, 07:19 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Fuelie74 View Post
You will be fine running E10. The only real problem I know of is with paper fuel filter.
What will the 10% ethanol do to paper elements?

Here in Australia the 10% ethanol is about 10% cheaper than regular fuel of the same octane. Ive been using it on my smallblock with no problems and plan to use it on my new 540.

Technically one would have to richen up by about 5%.
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Old 05-01-2008, 04:46 PM   #15
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After reading the e85 thread in C1/C2, I'm seriously considering building my new EFI 400 as an e85-only engine running 11:1-12:1 compression. Even at the slightly lower fuel economy, the idea of running 103 octane gas sounds like fun.
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Old 05-01-2008, 05:04 PM   #16
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With more ethanol in the fuel, the octane level goes up, so you could up your CR, adjust your timing accordingly. The mpg will suffer less that way.

For the rest you could slightly adjust the jetting.
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Old 05-01-2008, 05:04 PM
 
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