tomard

I think I am on the verge to have car on the road rollin' as I like it, but have little problem with proper lockup/unlock of converter.

I had thought that using the stock vacuum switch to provide the +12v to lockup solenoid in tranny would work, but I don't think that the stock switch is in range of my modified motors vacuum range for it to work properly.

http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/g...osedWiring.jpg

I am thinking I might need a "non-stock" vacuum switch, that is adjustable, if there is such a thing ........ anyone heard of one that would work? I will take some manifold vacuum data readings during a road test in next few days to see exactly what I need, range-wise.

Has anyone else already "invented the wheel" here and have a good solution? I am all ears

Artsvette73

I know they make an adjustable vac.sw. But can't remember where I saw it.I think it was here
http://www.transmissionhead.com/#Parts

redwingvette

I bit the bullet and bought the B&M controler. It attaches to the speedo cable and you set it to lock up on miles per hour. I set mine to engage at 43mph and disengage under 40mph.

Durango_Boy

Hey Red, I have that Lockup kit and got to looking at the brake switch like you said for the extra set of contacts and I only have one set. Is there a switch I need to replace the one I have so I have two sets of contacts?

Artsvette73

If you don't have cruise control you will ony have one set of contacts "one connection"
With cruise..... Two contacts "two Connections"

The lockup can be wired with either combination

tomard

I think that with the 4th gear oil pressure switch (N.O) AND using a properly calibrated vacuum switch, it will work. I am close now with stock vacuum switch ......

also, I am wondering what the "delay" filter that sits right before vacuum connection on switch, has some effect on my 200-4r setup

Surely some of you SMART ONES out there has gotten your 200-4r to work correctly

Tomorrow, I am going to check my vacuum switch AND hook up a vacuum gauge so I can drive it and see where my vacuum readings are exactly, so I can get myself a "workable" switch!

redwingvette

Yes you need the oter switch but it is a stock item so you could get it from any parts store.

tomard

I think it would be better to find out what my motors vacuum readings are during "cruise", and again at "passing", so I can get an adjustable vacuum switch and set it for my motor, instead of a generic kit. And it being adjustable, I could make any other motor mods and adjust the switch accordingly at later date .....

But that is just me ......

mrvette

I dunno why that vacuum sw is necessary.....

just wire the +12 to the tranny, through a relay that opens contacts when the brake lights lite......Rat Shack....or parts house....the ground side is usually perma wired inside the tranny to a MINIMUM of a 4th gear switch on the valve body, 4th and closed, so lockup occurs....

then another wire can be run out off that 4th gear switch, to allow control by computer grounding at speed, OR a dash switch like I have to ground it directly for really nasty shifts all the time....

a Vacuum switch is totally not needed and a poor idea anyway....for driveability reasons....

tomard

Gene - I have it wired like that now, but with my BRF tranny & the 3000 stall converter, it chugs, grinds and hops, but I DO have the stock vac switch inline. I could jumper it, and test it w/o switch, I suppose .....

The TCC is really loose (want to get a tighter one) and see how it performs ......

PS - 1) would it make any difference IF the GROUND wire from 4th gear NO switch is just spliced into the solenoid ground wire (from console switch???) I wouldn't think so, but thought I would ask .....

2) Is the logic that when in 4th and cruising with TCC locked up, and all of a sudden you give it some throttle, to say, pass another car, that it will downshift to 3rd and unlock, or some other line of thinking ???? I ask because of what if you don't give enough throttle to downshift, and I think there is the twitch in my thinking, that the TCC stays locked up, where you would like it to slip. So then manifold vacuum would be a good indicator of where motor is at, and could unlock TCC. That is just my thinking and I could be WAY OFF

Artsvette73

2) Is the logic that when in 4th and cruising with TCC locked up, and all of a sudden you give it some throttle, to say, pass another car, that it will downshift to 3rd and unlock, or some other line of thinking ???? I ask because of what if you don't give enough throttle to downshift, and I think there is the twitch in my thinking, that the TCC stays locked up, where you would like it to slip. So then manifold vacuum would be a good indicator of where motor is at, and could unlock TCC. That is just my thinking and I could be WAY OFF [/QUOTE]

You are thinking correct. That is the purpose of the vacuum switch. To drop out of lockup and down into third

What 4th gear switch are you using?
Single terminal
Double terminal

tomard

I am using a single terminal, NORMALLY OPEN, closes at 30psi of 4th gear oil .(tested by a tranny expert friend of mine). Think it is from a 700r4 .....

My stock switch is set to Close at 7in/hg and provide 12v at that point, and open at 2.5in/hg (removes the 12v)......seems like a world away, when you look at my readings that I got off road test just completed !!!!! (MPH is little off, as I have to zero in on speedo gear one less tooth)

Gear RPM MPH VAC in/hg
OD/P 900 0 14
4th 2000 60 17 Cruise
4th 2500 70 15 Given light throttle/to "pass"

Adjustable switch, in my immediate future ?????

tomard

What is the higher vacuum readings, indication of? Just the total effects of mods (and I have lots of them), and having higher vacuum levels, is that necessarily an evil or just the nature of the beast ??

SIXFOOTER

The adjustable switch might be the best bet to dial the thing in. Your going to make the switch operate at a lower vac setting than stock, I think.
Vac drops when you goose the gas, so a set point of 14 or 15 should let it unlock

mrvette

LOOK at the tranny wiring schematics in the ATSG guide, you have 2-3 possible ways to lockup the tranny, and ONE way to emergency unlock it.....the UNlock is accomplished in the + 12 line via the brake switch.....

so that leaves the lockups to be controlled via the ground side of the lockup solenoid....which BTW I hope is NEW in your rebuild, and fresh white nylon, not some damn brown heated looking thing, and don't ask how I know this, as when building MY tranny I did not change it, and so had a hard time locking or worse yet, UNlocking the converter, and I had that herkey jerkey crap operation wether upshifting or downshifting in traffic.....put the tranny in 3rd gear via the lever, and IF you don't have a 2-3 gear lockup switch OR a computer telling it to lockup you can ground and unground that wire to the ground side of the coil...thereby locking and unlocking the solenoid....
I could tell by feel of the car that it was a problem, and when NAPA had a solenoid in stock down the street, I KNEW IT.....they don't stock dead parts not turning off the shelf....duh.....

so now to the situation with your cars.....It can vary with the internals and how many switches you have but you always have a 4th gear switch that locks the converter regardless of any computer or other input on that end of things....

so that leaves 2-3 gear lockup, first won't ever lockup as that line is hydraulically controlled by stopping flow to the valve in the first place while in 1st gear.....so grounding the point/solenoid on 2-3 will lock the converter as if it was in 4th....you want a nice slam shift .....ground it all the time, kinda hard on the clutches I understand, maybe even the converter too.......I have a switch on my console that can select wether the tranny locks in 2-3-4 solid without any unlock between shifts....as in slam gears HARD, OR the other position I have it in is the computer locking it at about 40 mph....which typically is in 3rd gear in normal driving, sometimes 4th along with the pressure sw on the valve body....

I can not recall EVER feeling the tranny in 4th and unlocked....

now with my first auto tranny in this car, it was a 700, same deal but the 700 always downshifted at speed and going WOT, a pesky bug I dearly loved to hate.....

this 200 4r has a Trans Go shift kit in it, the big one....and so it's manners are ever so much better, I can go WOT at say 80 mph and the tranny sticks in there.....Locked.....which is what I want....none of that wishey washey crap....