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Old 01-11-2013, 11:18 AM   #21
Mike Ward
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garys 68 View Post
That is assuming someone who know what camber is, knows enough to diagnose a bent wheel, broken trailing arm, halfshaft, u joint, etc.
Of coarse maybe the guy drives like this and the whole center camber rod mount is broken.

I'm sticking with yokes. Final answer.
A broken 'center camber rod mount' would also cause the top of the wheels to tip inwards.
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Old 01-11-2013, 11:23 AM   #22
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The question is when the wheel has weight on it and lets just forget about camber and say the wheel is perfectly vertical does it stick out too far. That would help in the diagnosis of the patient.
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Old 01-11-2013, 11:51 AM   #23
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I replaced the swing arm bushings and strut rods last year (which i was incorrectly referring to as control arms). I drove the car to work two or three times and then parked it in my garage, where it has sat for the last year while I was deployed overseas. I recently returned home and started working on the car again. The little that I did drive the car, I did not notice any strange handling issues. Im almost sure that this problem has something to do with my strut rod install. My tires are 235's which bring them right to the lip of the fender well, so any outward tilt is going to cause problems. Im praying its not the axle, as nothing on this car has gone right yet. Everything I touch reveals another costly problem. I didnt buy this car as a 'project', it was intended as a driver. Ill get under the car tonight and take some pics and you guys can tell me if you see anything askew.
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Old 01-11-2013, 12:12 PM   #24
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well.. last year was only 11 days ago..... we need pics or more info....

swap your left and right rear rim/tire and see if it follows the wheel.

set them up until they are straight up and down.. that will get you going to the alignment shop
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Old 01-12-2013, 12:48 AM   #25
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Gents, Im ready to give up.

I played with the camber tonight and got the tire perpendicular, but it still sits outside the fender. The fender will still catch the tire just where the tread ends and the sidewall starts. Also, the passenger side fender appears to be one inch higher than the driver side. End state, she slightest bumps are going to cause me to gouge my sidewalls.

I put her on jack stands tonight and pulled off the rear wheels. Everything measures up. Nothing is off. I spent 2 hours rolling around measuring. I took the strut rod down and unhooked the shock. Gave it a good pull, it was still attached to the diff. Nothing appears out of the ordinary. The tires are identical, the rims are identical. I dont understand this, but the car isnt safe to drive like this and Im really loosing my patience. What else can it be? what is the chance that my trailing arm is tweaked and Im not seeing it?

Last edited by Scottd; 01-12-2013 at 01:53 AM.
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Old 01-12-2013, 07:27 AM   #26
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Gents, Im ready to give up.

I played with the camber tonight and got the tire perpendicular, but it still sits outside the fender. The fender will still catch the tire just where the tread ends and the sidewall starts. Also, the passenger side fender appears to be one inch higher than the driver side. End state, she slightest bumps are going to cause me to gouge my sidewalls.

I put her on jack stands tonight and pulled off the rear wheels. Everything measures up. Nothing is off. I spent 2 hours rolling around measuring. I took the strut rod down and unhooked the shock. Gave it a good pull, it was still attached to the diff. Nothing appears out of the ordinary. The tires are identical, the rims are identical. I dont understand this, but the car isnt safe to drive like this and Im really loosing my patience. What else can it be? what is the chance that my trailing arm is tweaked and Im not seeing it?

What was the situation before you replaced the trailing arms?
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Old 01-12-2013, 12:08 PM   #27
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What was the situation before you replaced the trailing arms?
The car has a myriad of little problems and I replaced the bushings because they appeared original. I did not notice this problem before, but I wasnt looking. I replaced the strut rods because the bushings were worn down to almost metal and appeared almost bowed.
Im telling you, everything appears normal....but the tire still sticks out a bit and the fender rides just a little higher. Ive spent 2 solid days under this car looking.
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Old 01-12-2013, 12:11 PM   #28
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Quote:
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Ive spent 2 solid days under this car looking.
But still no pics for anyone to look at at.............
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Old 01-12-2013, 12:59 PM   #29
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But still no pics for anyone to look at at.............
Im embarrassed. I have more rust than I remembered.

Let me go take a few. Post shortly.
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Old 01-12-2013, 01:12 PM   #30
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I was still in my good clothes and couldnt really get under the car. If there are specific areas you want shots of, let me know. These are just generic undercarriage shots of the messed up side. Just wondering if anybody sees some blatant install error. I know my rear diff is leaking, like I said, Im working out a lot of issues with this car....



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Last edited by Scottd; 01-12-2013 at 01:14 PM.
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Old 01-12-2013, 01:55 PM   #31
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Looks like tire rub marks up inside the right fender, how high is the fender lip from the ground when the suspension is settled and sitting on the wheels? I'm wondering if your spring is worn out and the car is sitting too low and adding to an otherwise unnoticeable problem.
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Old 01-12-2013, 02:47 PM   #32
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Any chance that somebody put a later model half shaft on the car- those are 1/4" longer IIRC.

Are your new tires the same size as your old? I ***-u-me you know that
235/70/15 or 235/60/15 are not the right size for your car...........
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Old 01-12-2013, 03:46 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottd View Post
I was still in my good clothes and couldnt really get under the car. If there are specific areas you want shots of, let me know. These are just generic undercarriage shots of the messed up side. Just wondering if anybody sees some blatant install error. I know my rear diff is leaking, like I said, Im working out a lot of issues with this car....



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OK, I'm curious...what's that "red thing" near the differential yoke. It looks like the yoke isn't completely in the diff, but if it is, as "Mike Ward" says, you might have an incorrect half shaft...
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Old 01-12-2013, 04:34 PM   #34
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Plastic tag on the diff fill plug maybe?
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Old 01-12-2013, 04:47 PM   #35
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In your picture, the camber cam bolt (the one with the eccentric cam) is in a position to have maximum positive (top-of-tire out) camber. That bolt should be nominally in the center of the camber cam bracket.
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Old 01-12-2013, 04:54 PM   #36
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In your picture, the camber cam bolt (the one with the eccentric cam) is in a position to have maximum positive (top-of-tire out) camber. That bolt should be nominally in the center of the camber cam bracket.
If its gotta be adjusted that far to get 0 camber, the side yoke is pretty worn.
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Old 01-12-2013, 05:33 PM   #37
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Let me answer several questions and ask a few more.
1) the red thing, as noted, is the fill tag.
2) yes I know the tires are grossly oversized. The tires were originally 245's when I bought the car. Due to a blowout (on the same effected side?? Coincidence??) I dropped down to the 235's, then I swapped to the current steel rims. However the driver rear fits under the fender. Its tight, but fits.
3) there is about 2 inches tire to fender clearance on the driver, and just over 3 on the pass side. That really boggles me, as the 'high' side is the one that bottoming out and causing the damage.

'75, you mentioned a worn out spring? I was considering ordering a new, stiff composite spring to lift the rear a bit and reduce chances of if bottoming out. Is there a way to check/test the spring?

Mike, you mentioned my half shaft.....I measured them and they both appeared the same size, but I was looking for a gross difference and not 1/4 inch. The drivetrain/chassis is a 72. What should the correct length be, measured from where?

Now, my time to question back. What are some things that would cause a tire to stick outside the fender? We've already discussed a missing axle clip and eliminated that possibility. Trailing arm bushings are new, shims are new (4 shims on each side of axle and equal in width) shocks and shock mounts are new, strut rods are new.
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Old 01-12-2013, 06:17 PM   #38
paul 74
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This one is a real mystery. But I can tell you that the 235-60s are not the problem. They are not grossly oversized. They are not the correct size as Mike W. noted but they do fit well and perform well. They do NOT rub anywhere. I wish that I could be of more help but I am baffled. There is "something" we are missing.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Last edited by paul 74; 01-12-2013 at 06:55 PM.
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Old 01-12-2013, 06:32 PM   #39
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Quote:
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If its gotta be adjusted that far to get 0 camber, the side yoke is pretty worn.
Actually, that's not correct...
If the side yoke is worn on the inner end, the yoke will be shifted inwards, leading to the top of the tire moving inwards (for no change to the strut rod/strut rod bushings).

Statically, the side yokes have a load of several hundred pounds pushing them INWARDS so they will be fully inwards. The only thing that can make the top of the tire be OUTWARDS is if the lower strut rod is too short or has been ADJUSTED to the inward position as shown in the photo.

When you measure the camber of the rear tires, it is important to settle the suspension by pushing the rear of the car up and down several times with the rear tires on a slip plate or on a plastic trash bag as the friction within the system will prevent full lowering to ride height. Another way is to roll the car back and forth about 20 feet - which ever is easier!

The first thing your need to do is to loosen the inner strut rod bolt on the right side and turn the cam so that the bolt is halfway between the edges of the cam channel; and then re-tighten.

Next lower the car and resettle the suspension; now measure the camber like I outlined in post #4. Then apply the correction factor of .72 degrees per tick mark to determine how far to move the cam to get your desired camber (I recommend 1/2 degree negative).

Re-raise the car, loosen the bolt, shift it as calculated, and re-tighten.

Lower the car, re-settle the suspension and you're done!

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Old 01-12-2013, 06:36 PM   #40
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Actually it is correct, think about what I said.
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Old 01-12-2013, 06:36 PM
 
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