Mpls Funk

Hi all,

I finally get time to try and work on my car and I can't even get it to start now. So frustrated. Last week I tried starting it...it took quite a bit of time, but finally got it running...the exhuast was very stinky and smokey...I let it run for a few minutes and shut it down. I then found a bunch of fuel on top of the intake, and dripping from the bottom of the carb (Holley 650 DP). I let it sit for 30 minutes or so and was going to have my wife come out and watch to see where the fuel was coming from while I sat in the car and kept it running....of course then it started immediately...and of course no fuel dripping?

So today it is turning over fine...plenty of battery charge...but just doesn't fire. I pulled the sight plug on the carb and there is fuel there. I know you are going to ask "do you have spark?"....and I don't know...I don't know how to test that. I do konw that if I let it sit for 15 minutes or so and then go out, it will get close to starting on the first attempt, but then further attempts it just cranks and cranks and cranks.

I also know that the previous owner disconnected the choke.

Very frustrated...if anyone has any suggestions, I would be happy. I do not know a lot about this stuff, but am rapidly trying to learn!

Car is 1970 small block with Holley 650 DP.

DUB

I am glad you wrote that you need help and want to learn. I am willing to help you...BUT I am not going to type for hours and hours.

PM me IF you are interested in me calling you or vice-versa.

Also....do you have some basic tools? Voltmeter, test light, timing light etc???

DUB

Big Block Dave

If you are doing this like a one man band, you can't beat something like this for testing spark:
http://www.sears.com/lisle-inline-sp...&mktRedirect=y

Mpls Funk

Just tried it again....after sitting for 30 minutes and it "fired" immediately but would not keep running...dies immediately. then, I cranked on it some more and smoke was coming out of the exhaust? Haven't seen that before! The car is not running, but smoke out of the exhaust?

AirborneSilva

Sounds to me like you have carb issues.

DUB

Did you partially close the choke plate??? Because if the choke is still wide open...it will die after it runs for a second or two.

The smoke is going to be normal if it is flooded with excessive fuel. I would not be to overly concerned about smoke coming out at this time.

DUB

Mpls Funk

Yes sir! I did partially close the choke plate.

Mpls Funk

I have had other people suggest a sticking float. But help me understand this...I pulled the sight plug out of the carb and fuel did not come spilling out. I rocked the car, and then some fuel came out. So, wouldn't this mean the float is working? Doesn't the fact that fuel did not come flooding out the second I removed the plug suggest that it is not getting too much fuel? And doesn't the fact that when I rock the car I do get some fuel coming out suggest that it is getting fuel (or that the fuel level is not way too low)?

some have suggested that they think the car is firing right away (as I mention, if I leave it sit for ~30 minutes), but only firing for a second or two and then stops...that is a sign that it is burning the fuel that is present, but that there is no more fuel coming in quick enough???

blk79nj

what color is the smoke?

Blue, White, or Black?

F22

Can you tell us exactly what your starting procedure is? I'm only asking, because if I don't start my C3, just like 'so', it becomes a real difficult car to start. I've been stuck at mall parking lots and gas stations, because I didn't follow the procedure for a hot start, pumped the gas and flooded it, when I should've not even touched the pedal. On a a hot start up. One time, it took fifteen minutes and a nearly worn out battery, to get it going. If I follow the procedure, it starts instantly! For what it's worth, I too, have a Holley DP, with mechanical secondaries.

For the cold start, two and a half pumps, on the gas pedal, release the pedal and crank the key. Instant start up. If I disobey, my mistress of the dark, she'll make me pay!

Mpls Funk

My wife said the puff of smoke that she saw was black...but then a little later, on a subsequent attempt, it seemed white...and on other attempts, no smoke.

Mpls Funk

Well, I can't say it's gospel....but generally...pump the gas 2 times, turn the key and if it doesn't start, I keep the key turned and pump the gas once or twice every ~3-4 seconds? If after ~8-10 seconds it doesn't start, I stop and wait 10 seconds and then try again...if I fail after four or five of those sequences, then I let it sit for 20 minutes or so....

doorgunner

If that method in red type doesn't work on the first time cranking the engine.........THEN---hold the gas pedal to the floor without pumping or taking your foot off of it.....then turn the key and let it crank over----it should start and rev up after 5 or 10 seconds of cranking. If not. either you or a qualified mechanic needs to repair the choke mechanism/change the fuel filter/check the tank return line for clogs/ and tune or rebuild the carb.

F22

Something's wrong, because you're doing it the right way, to begin with, but if it doesn't start in 3-4 seconds like you said, then I suspect it may be more than meets the eye. Have you tried, not pumping it at all? Because if I were to do that, (late 3-4 second pump) to my '74, it will never start!

Agree with Doorgunner, it needs to be checked out thoroughly, fire (spark), fuel (PSI) and air.

AirborneSilva

I still think there's something wrong with your carb, can you get one that you KNOW is working properly and put it on to test. I do computer troubleshooting (well I used to before I became evil management ), and if you had an issue that you suspected a part you used a "known good" part to test. To me your issue sounds like a carb issue, I'm no where near as good as most guys on this forum with engines but it really sticks out, could be wrong - it wouldn't be the first time just ask my wife

REELAV8R

What is your nose telling you? Smelling gas strongly is flooded. No smell..no gas.

Disconnect one of the plug wires at the plug. Put a philips screw driver in the plug wire like it was the spark plug, hold the metal of the screw driver within 1/8 inch of the valve cover or good metal surface, make sure it has a plastic or wood handle to hold onto, have wife turn over engine. You should see and hear the spark. Could be hard to see in bright daylight so do it indoors or shade the area your in.
If you have a timing light. Attach it to any wire and turn over the engine the light should flash.

drkness01

I havent seen it mentioned ....

How old is the gas in the tank?

DUB

BLACK SMOKE...rich due to excessive fuel. Do not be concerned at this time

WHITE SMOKE....water/condensation in the exhaust system...I would not be to overly concerned at this time also.

AS for it cranking with the choke partially closed like we talked about. It may have something to do with timing. Depending on if your vacuum advance is working inside the distributor like we also talked bout. Having a very high advance on a cold engine can make it REALLY hard to keep running when it is cranked...but when it is warmed up...it cranks and does fine.

I do not think you have a problem in your float level at this time. Seems like 'splitting hairs'...and if you did the manual test and check the squirters in the carb...that would let you know that you are ready to crank it due to the fuel is waiting right under you squirters. The odds that you suck the fuel out of the bowl in 2 seconds is highly unlikely.

DUB

Mpls Funk

Quite old (over a year)....and not a lot in it. I dumped a couple gallons of "fresh" (maybe one month old) fuel in it the other day, but not until I had been trying to start it for a while.

Unfortunately I did not get out to try starting it tonight....

augiedoggy

If the gas in the tank is that old then the gas in yourcarb likely gelled up from the ethanol.... happened to me last year just from sitting over the winter. If I were you I wouldgoogle and watch the youtube videos on giving your carb a quick cleaning.