Dantana

Hi All,
I've got a summit brand high torque starter spinning my ZZ4. In short, it sounds horrible every time I crank it over. I got under there today and I expected to find that it was binding up and I needed to shim it but I think I am seeing something else. It actually appears visually to be too far away from the ring gear on the flex plate so the teeth on the bendix gear are not engaging all the way. Lengthwise it seems to be traveling fine, engaging 2/3 of the teeth on the flexplate.

Here are a few pictures. It's a bit hard to make out but there are a few teeth on the flexplate that look damaged. I think either I am mistaken and it should be shimmed out or the crest of the teeth on the flexplate are being bitten off in some cases due to lack of engagement... Any ideas?

C3Hawk

If you put some water color paint on the starter gear and give it a slight crank, you'll might be able to get a decent contact pattern so you can see what's going on.

pltmgr

What mounting bolts are you using? Recently put a Summit high torgue starter in a F**d pickup that wouldn't engage properly until I used Summit mounting bolts.

doorgunner

It seems like the starter gear should make at least 80% engagement with the teeth on the ring gear to prevent premature wear......I also read that with the starter gear extended into the ring gear----you should be able to insert a .070" thick pin/rod in the small V-gap between the ring gear teeth and the starter gear teeth for proper clearance.

Like other member(s) said.....the correct size/knurled-shank starter bolts keep the starter housing from having a "sloppy/loose fit".

cardo0

Google: chevy starter shim specifications. U need 0.1" between pinion gear and ring gear when pinion withdrawn and not engaged. U also need 0.020 or 0.040" clearance in the tooth groove when pinion gear is engaged.

Dantana

I definitely used the bolts supplied with the Summit starter, and i found the part number - SUM-820323.

Dantana

I checked the clearance with a paperclip (~.030") and I had much more clearance than that, which is not what i was expecting.

Shark Racer

Those look like regular bolts to me (which is what I got when I ordered a Summit starter). I eventually went with a GM starter cuz I had a noise issue of my own. That ended up being a remote start solenoid that was added to the car in the 90's, solenoid was keeping the bendix engaged a bit longer than it should. Once I got rid of that, everything was great.

Anyways - the bolts you want should look something like this:


arp-430-3502

The knurling just above the threads helps keep the starter indexed in the block.

Here's the GM version:

NAL-12338064

The GM ones are 4.330 UHL, the ARP ones I referenced are 3.760. That's about a 9/16" difference. Honestly, I'm not sure of the length to use off of the top of my head and I'd compare to the bolts you have. The GM ones are cheaper ($4 for a pair vs $13.50), so hopefully you can go that route.

Dantana

Thanks for the tip. I definitely used the bolts that came with it. I'll pull one out today and check it out.

Neil B

How much more clearance do you have? Is the starter shimmed at all currently?

This is a good guide:

http://www.powermastermotorsports.co..._GMMiniSta.pdf

augiedoggy

I had the exact problem with two different new universal ministarters... finally put the original back on and its fine but I know the sidepipes may cook it so I got the factory staggarded gm mini starter to try next and heat wrap.

I tried every shim combination I could following all the videos and no luck. chewed my flywheel up pretty bad.

Dantana

Thanks Augie. I think I'm about to call on this starter. I worked my way up to 4 shims tonight just for the heck of it and also tried a new set of starter bolts with the knurl on them. No improvement.

My chevy performance mini starter was quiet as a mouse but the bendix stopped throwing out. I still have it, maybe I can do something with the solenoid to fix it...

OMF

Your ring gear looks like its well worn. I fought a problem just like yours for quite a while, then decided to change out the flex plate.....wouldn't you know it....my horrible grinding noise disappeared.
There was alot of difference between the teeth on the new ring gear compared to the old one.

cardo0

Solenoids are cheap and most starter problems can be fixed with new solenoid. Does the chev mini click but no pinion movement when u turn the key to start? I learned when i when i was a teenager the chevy solenoid has a contactor ring inside that gets burnt up from all the starts when it mates up to turn the starter motor. I would just flip the ring inside the solenoid and usually it was good to go. U can buy original chev starter solenoids at any parts store but dont know if they fit the chev mini. U can buy a solenoid rebuild kit too. U can test the bendix gear throws out with a batt charger. To throw out the bendix gear w/o turning the starter motor u have to disconnect that large (black) lead from the lower larger term stud on the solenoid to the starter motor.

Ya know if u look at my cardomain pix in my signature link u will see i couldnt get a chevy mini to fit up to my large ring flywheel of my '74 and did a comparison to an original starter in the pix with some straight edges. Dont know what was wrong but no matter how i clocked that mini it would not line up.