update about my ordeal with AFR
07-16-2003, 11:49 AM
#1
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
update about my ordeal with AFR
well, i finally got my heads last week!
it took almost 6 months...
here's an account of the ordeal for those who don't already know...
i ordered my heads thru a guy named TED at AFR in january, and in march they sent me a set, but they were the wrong heads... they sent me heads for a non-LT-style motor (Gen 1 heads) and so i had to send those back. they promised that they would RUSH my LT heads and that i should have them in NO LATER than 5 weeks and they would give me the jobber price which is a little less than a 10% discount. if this would have been the only screw up, i would have been ok with that. it seemed like an appropriate answer and that they were sincerely going to try to make amends for their screw up. unfortunately they can't start on my heads until they get the wrong ones back, so a few more weeks get burned up shipping them back.
so about 8 weeks later they told me that it was going to take 2 more weeks... 2 weeks later they told me it was going to take 2 more weeks... obviously this is not cool.
so when i called to complain they practically accused me of either lying or being a dumb butt and said that they don't see anywhere in the original order where it said "LT" heads... and that they already had to eat the cost of that set of heads (not my problem, cuz it was their screw up) that their VOLUME was more than they anticipated... (doesn't sound like i'm getting a RUSH to me) and that in consideration of how long it was taking they would offer me a AFR t-shirt for free. GEE THANKS!!!!
this is when i really got pissed!!!
i had to go around and around with this guy TONY (supervisor??) who also hinted around that most people he deals with are either dumb buttes or liars (isn't that good for you guys to know??). i explain that my summer was being wasted waiting on the heads, and that everybody else i know is driving their cars and has been racing already for MONTHS and that i would have been doing all that too, if it weren't for AFR. i said it was not cool for them to promise a date and then constantly push it back for no good reason. i also told him that EVERYTHING else that i had ordered had already arrived MONTHS ago. he said that he just didn't have the $$ room in the heads to give me any more of a discount (AGAIN, not my problem) and aparently TED had not been approved to offer me the jobber price (again, not my problem). i told him at this point he shouldn't be worried about making any money off of this set of heads, or even breaking even... that he should just be trying to salvage the deal and their reputation. the best i was able to get out of him was a promise that the heads would be at my door within 2 more weeks and he finally agreed to give me a little bit more of a discount.
ultimately the total discount came to a little less than 15%, which i am still not satisfied with but this is the BEST he would do.
in the process of talking to TONY it became evident that TED (the guy who had been handling my order from the start) also did not write down that i wanted to upgrade to the pacaloy springs to accomodate my high lift cam. we got this straightened out, and i think this is one of the reasons why TONY FINALLY realized that MAYBE I wasn't the one who was a dumb butt.
of course the heads were not ready within the 2 weeks that they were promised, but i did recieve them about 5 days later.
they did charge me extra for the 2 day shipping which was supposed to be at their cost (still gotta call and get that straigtened out).
as you can tell, i am VERY dissatisfied with how the deal turned out and with their customer service. at all times i was kept on HOLD for extremely long times, and there is no excuse for any company to talk to customers the way they talked to me. not to mention they still did not offer me what i consider to be an appropriate discount for having to wait 4 MONTHS longer for a product than i should have had to wait. and i have no faith that TED would ever get an order straight... etc etc etc etc i could go on and on...
i know that all companies will screw up eventually, that is a given. the difference between the good companies and the bad ones are how those screw up's are handled. this one WAS NOT HANDLED WELL!!!
the heads appear to be very nice, and i hope that i am very satisfied with them. they may make an excellent product, but AFR gets a VERY BAD grade in the customer service area.
thanks for letting me vent, and i just wanted to help you guys be informed consumers.
now it's time to get this BEAST together and see how she runs...
:D :D :D
Sonny
it took almost 6 months...
here's an account of the ordeal for those who don't already know...
i ordered my heads thru a guy named TED at AFR in january, and in march they sent me a set, but they were the wrong heads... they sent me heads for a non-LT-style motor (Gen 1 heads) and so i had to send those back. they promised that they would RUSH my LT heads and that i should have them in NO LATER than 5 weeks and they would give me the jobber price which is a little less than a 10% discount. if this would have been the only screw up, i would have been ok with that. it seemed like an appropriate answer and that they were sincerely going to try to make amends for their screw up. unfortunately they can't start on my heads until they get the wrong ones back, so a few more weeks get burned up shipping them back.
so about 8 weeks later they told me that it was going to take 2 more weeks... 2 weeks later they told me it was going to take 2 more weeks... obviously this is not cool.
so when i called to complain they practically accused me of either lying or being a dumb butt and said that they don't see anywhere in the original order where it said "LT" heads... and that they already had to eat the cost of that set of heads (not my problem, cuz it was their screw up) that their VOLUME was more than they anticipated... (doesn't sound like i'm getting a RUSH to me) and that in consideration of how long it was taking they would offer me a AFR t-shirt for free. GEE THANKS!!!!
this is when i really got pissed!!!
i had to go around and around with this guy TONY (supervisor??) who also hinted around that most people he deals with are either dumb buttes or liars (isn't that good for you guys to know??). i explain that my summer was being wasted waiting on the heads, and that everybody else i know is driving their cars and has been racing already for MONTHS and that i would have been doing all that too, if it weren't for AFR. i said it was not cool for them to promise a date and then constantly push it back for no good reason. i also told him that EVERYTHING else that i had ordered had already arrived MONTHS ago. he said that he just didn't have the $$ room in the heads to give me any more of a discount (AGAIN, not my problem) and aparently TED had not been approved to offer me the jobber price (again, not my problem). i told him at this point he shouldn't be worried about making any money off of this set of heads, or even breaking even... that he should just be trying to salvage the deal and their reputation. the best i was able to get out of him was a promise that the heads would be at my door within 2 more weeks and he finally agreed to give me a little bit more of a discount.
ultimately the total discount came to a little less than 15%, which i am still not satisfied with but this is the BEST he would do.
in the process of talking to TONY it became evident that TED (the guy who had been handling my order from the start) also did not write down that i wanted to upgrade to the pacaloy springs to accomodate my high lift cam. we got this straightened out, and i think this is one of the reasons why TONY FINALLY realized that MAYBE I wasn't the one who was a dumb butt.
of course the heads were not ready within the 2 weeks that they were promised, but i did recieve them about 5 days later.
they did charge me extra for the 2 day shipping which was supposed to be at their cost (still gotta call and get that straigtened out).
as you can tell, i am VERY dissatisfied with how the deal turned out and with their customer service. at all times i was kept on HOLD for extremely long times, and there is no excuse for any company to talk to customers the way they talked to me. not to mention they still did not offer me what i consider to be an appropriate discount for having to wait 4 MONTHS longer for a product than i should have had to wait. and i have no faith that TED would ever get an order straight... etc etc etc etc i could go on and on...
i know that all companies will screw up eventually, that is a given. the difference between the good companies and the bad ones are how those screw up's are handled. this one WAS NOT HANDLED WELL!!!
the heads appear to be very nice, and i hope that i am very satisfied with them. they may make an excellent product, but AFR gets a VERY BAD grade in the customer service area.
thanks for letting me vent, and i just wanted to help you guys be informed consumers.
now it's time to get this BEAST together and see how she runs...
:D :D :D
Sonny
07-16-2003, 12:15 PM
#2
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (SonnyinVA)
Wow that sucks! Got an email address so we can email them & let them know they will get no business from forum members? :smash:
07-16-2003, 12:18 PM
#3
Melting Slicks
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (yoslambo1@cs.com)
sales@airflowresearch.com
i hope my ordeal was an isolated incident...
but who knows til someone speaks out, ya know?
i hope my ordeal was an isolated incident...
but who knows til someone speaks out, ya know?
07-16-2003, 12:30 PM
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (SonnyinVA)
sales@airflowresearch.com
i hope my ordeal was an isolated incident...
but who knows til someone speaks out, ya know?
i hope my ordeal was an isolated incident...
but who knows til someone speaks out, ya know?
07-16-2003, 12:37 PM
#5
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (yoslambo1@cs.com)
i almost didn't post anything here about it, but then i decided i owe it to you guys.
like i said, i hope that it was an isolated incident, but then again if i didn't say anything, and then somewhere down the road i saw somebody else complaining about them, i would have felt like crap for not trying to save them the trouble by relaying my problems with AFR.
thanks for your support, yoslambo1!!
like i said, i hope that it was an isolated incident, but then again if i didn't say anything, and then somewhere down the road i saw somebody else complaining about them, i would have felt like crap for not trying to save them the trouble by relaying my problems with AFR.
thanks for your support, yoslambo1!!
07-16-2003, 01:16 PM
#6
Race Director
Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (SonnyinVA)
I'm hoping that the new AFR's will perform so well, that you will eventually forget about the frustration of getting them.
07-16-2003, 01:25 PM
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (SonnyinVA)
thanks for your support, yoslambo1!!
07-16-2003, 01:44 PM
#8
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (yoslambo1@cs.com)
It sounds like things certainly didn't work out as most of us would like.
I do think, however, that having a bunch of non-customers suddenly send them a bunch of hate mail is childish and completely unprofessional. That's the sort of crap I used to do in elementary school. If the rest of you aren't willing to go through the potential hassles, then fine, but to write a "neener neener neener" letter to a company is just plain silly.
I do think, however, that having a bunch of non-customers suddenly send them a bunch of hate mail is childish and completely unprofessional. That's the sort of crap I used to do in elementary school. If the rest of you aren't willing to go through the potential hassles, then fine, but to write a "neener neener neener" letter to a company is just plain silly.
07-16-2003, 02:02 PM
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (Jim85IROC)
It sounds like things certainly didn't work out as most of us would like.
I do think, however, that having a bunch of non-customers suddenly send them a bunch of hate mail is childish and completely unprofessional. That's the sort of crap I used to do in elementary school. If the rest of you aren't willing to go through the potential hassles, then fine, but to write a "neener neener neener" letter to a company is just plain silly.
I do think, however, that having a bunch of non-customers suddenly send them a bunch of hate mail is childish and completely unprofessional. That's the sort of crap I used to do in elementary school. If the rest of you aren't willing to go through the potential hassles, then fine, but to write a "neener neener neener" letter to a company is just plain silly.
07-17-2003, 09:33 AM
#10
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (yoslambo1@cs.com)
personally i think they should know how many POTENTIAL customers can be lost by mistreating one actual customer... i don't think sending emails is inappropriate.
unfortuantely, there aren't that many options for heads for a LT style motor.
has anybody else had any bad experiences with AFR?
unfortuantely, there aren't that many options for heads for a LT style motor.
has anybody else had any bad experiences with AFR?
07-17-2003, 09:49 AM
#11
Melting Slicks
Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (Jim85IROC)
It sounds like things certainly didn't work out as most of us would like.
I do think, however, that having a bunch of non-customers suddenly send them a bunch of hate mail is childish and completely unprofessional....
I do think, however, that having a bunch of non-customers suddenly send them a bunch of hate mail is childish and completely unprofessional....
Count your blessings, Sonny, we've all heard much worse stories.
Eric
07-17-2003, 09:51 AM
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (SonnyinVA)
I'm sorry. I'll start drafting up my "I think you suck so I'm not buying your crap" letters right away. :rolleyes:
Writing stuff like that makes you look like a dope... especially when it's just coming from something you saw on an Internet message board. If you bought the heads and had problems, you're well within your rights to be upset and to complain all you want... but to complain to a company over somebody elses problem that you saw on the internet makes you look like a clown.
I choose to stay away from companies that have developed a bad reputation on the Internet, but I sure as hell don't send them all hate mail. :crazy:
Writing stuff like that makes you look like a dope... especially when it's just coming from something you saw on an Internet message board. If you bought the heads and had problems, you're well within your rights to be upset and to complain all you want... but to complain to a company over somebody elses problem that you saw on the internet makes you look like a clown.
I choose to stay away from companies that have developed a bad reputation on the Internet, but I sure as hell don't send them all hate mail. :crazy:
07-17-2003, 10:00 AM
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (Jim85IROC)
Noted, now I will know how to deal with them if something goes wrong with the 190s I want to order.
07-17-2003, 12:12 PM
#14
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (Jim85IROC)
hey jim,
please don't make this post into something it's not...
can we get off of that subject already?
so, everybody else, any other feedback about AFR??
please don't make this post into something it's not...
can we get off of that subject already?
so, everybody else, any other feedback about AFR??
07-17-2003, 12:30 PM
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (Jim85IROC)
I'm sorry. I'll start drafting up my "I think you suck so I'm not buying your crap" letters right away. :rolleyes:
Writing stuff like that makes you look like a dope... especially when it's just coming from something you saw on an Internet message board. If you bought the heads and had problems, you're well within your rights to be upset and to complain all you want... but to complain to a company over somebody elses problem that you saw on the internet makes you look like a clown.
I choose to stay away from companies that have developed a bad reputation on the Internet, but I sure as hell don't send them all hate mail. :crazy:
Writing stuff like that makes you look like a dope... especially when it's just coming from something you saw on an Internet message board. If you bought the heads and had problems, you're well within your rights to be upset and to complain all you want... but to complain to a company over somebody elses problem that you saw on the internet makes you look like a clown.
I choose to stay away from companies that have developed a bad reputation on the Internet, but I sure as hell don't send them all hate mail. :crazy:
07-17-2003, 03:11 PM
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (yoslambo1@cs.com)
I'm sorry. I'll start drafting up my "I think you suck so I'm not buying your crap" letters right away. :rolleyes:
Writing stuff like that makes you look like a dope... especially when it's just coming from something you saw on an Internet message board. If you bought the heads and had problems, you're well within your rights to be upset and to complain all you want... but to complain to a company over somebody elses problem that you saw on the internet makes you look like a clown.
I choose to stay away from companies that have developed a bad reputation on the Internet, but I sure as hell don't send them all hate mail. :crazy: :troll :troll :troll
Writing stuff like that makes you look like a dope... especially when it's just coming from something you saw on an Internet message board. If you bought the heads and had problems, you're well within your rights to be upset and to complain all you want... but to complain to a company over somebody elses problem that you saw on the internet makes you look like a clown.
I choose to stay away from companies that have developed a bad reputation on the Internet, but I sure as hell don't send them all hate mail. :crazy: :troll :troll :troll
I saw it on the Internet, so it must be true!
07-17-2003, 03:35 PM
#17
Melting Slicks
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (Jim85IROC)
ok jim,
are you implying that anything i have said is not true? or that anybody has any reason to disbelieve anything i have said, just because it is on the internet? i think posting/reading/sharing something on the forum is a little different than your usual "i saw it on the internet so it must be true" deal, and i do not like your insinuation that what i say coule be anything less than the absolute truth.
ultimately this is not yoslambo1's thread, it is mine, and i would appreciate it if you do not hijack it with your comments and if you and yoslambo1 want to argue about how to best let a company know that they are potentially costing themselves some business then please do it in a IM as yoslambo1 already suggested! it was not my suggestion to send AFR emails, but i do not disagree with it, and frankly i do think that it might have some positive effect on thier customer service. i hope they do check out the link that he sent them to this post and they will see how many people have already heard about their bad service.
this thread already has had well over 100 views, and most are probably people who are interested in AFR or their competitors and their products. so, i have already been able to reach more people than i could have thru any other easily accessible media to relate my troubles with AFR.
it boils down to this... you've said your peace... how about leaving it at that before you continue to dig yourself an even larger hole?
thanks,
sonny
are you implying that anything i have said is not true? or that anybody has any reason to disbelieve anything i have said, just because it is on the internet? i think posting/reading/sharing something on the forum is a little different than your usual "i saw it on the internet so it must be true" deal, and i do not like your insinuation that what i say coule be anything less than the absolute truth.
ultimately this is not yoslambo1's thread, it is mine, and i would appreciate it if you do not hijack it with your comments and if you and yoslambo1 want to argue about how to best let a company know that they are potentially costing themselves some business then please do it in a IM as yoslambo1 already suggested! it was not my suggestion to send AFR emails, but i do not disagree with it, and frankly i do think that it might have some positive effect on thier customer service. i hope they do check out the link that he sent them to this post and they will see how many people have already heard about their bad service.
this thread already has had well over 100 views, and most are probably people who are interested in AFR or their competitors and their products. so, i have already been able to reach more people than i could have thru any other easily accessible media to relate my troubles with AFR.
it boils down to this... you've said your peace... how about leaving it at that before you continue to dig yourself an even larger hole?
thanks,
sonny
07-17-2003, 04:13 PM
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (SonnyinVA)
Sonny... I'm not saying that any of your problems aren't true. I agree 100% that you should be upset and I don't think any of your actions are uncalled for. I just think it's obscene that so many people are jumping on a bandwagon and giving a company whom they've never dealt with "a piece of their mind".
I apologize for hijacking your thread. I wasn't aware that the only people allowed to respond were those who wanted to kiss your butt and agree with how much AFR sucks. I'll definately be more careful in the future and try harder not to have an unpopular opinion. After all, we're better than everybody else, so we should all agree that we're always right.
I apologize for hijacking your thread. I wasn't aware that the only people allowed to respond were those who wanted to kiss your butt and agree with how much AFR sucks. I'll definately be more careful in the future and try harder not to have an unpopular opinion. After all, we're better than everybody else, so we should all agree that we're always right.
07-17-2003, 04:34 PM
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Re: update about my ordeal with AFR (Jim85IROC)
Sonny... I'm not saying that any of your problems aren't true. I agree 100% that you should be upset and I don't think any of your actions are uncalled for. I just think it's obscene that so many people are jumping on a bandwagon and giving a company whom they've never dealt with "a piece of their mind".
I apologize for hijacking your thread. I wasn't aware that the only people allowed to respond were those who wanted to kiss your butt and agree with how much AFR sucks. I'll definately be more careful in the future and try harder not to have an unpopular opinion. After all, we're better than everybody else, so we should all agree that we're always right.
I apologize for hijacking your thread. I wasn't aware that the only people allowed to respond were those who wanted to kiss your butt and agree with how much AFR sucks. I'll definately be more careful in the future and try harder not to have an unpopular opinion. After all, we're better than everybody else, so we should all agree that we're always right.