tequilaboy

The rules are simple: TPI based cars with MAF and 165 ecm control. Any intake, any displacement, any fuel. Power adders are welcome including nitrous if metered by MAF and fueled by ecm control only. No AIC controllers allowed--sorry Callaway. FMUs are permitted, but will be frowned upon.

1. tequilaboy......88 4+3 Code $33B: 478 rwhp 3" Blowerworks maf, 765 gm/sec tune.
2. bjankuski.......86 Auto Code $33B: 475 rwhp 4" Blowerworks maf, 510 gm/sec tune.
3. customer car..87 Auto Code $33B: 424 rwhp 3" Blowerworks maf, 765 gm/sec tune.
4. Orr89rocz......89 Auto Code $6E: 392 rwhp
5. Aardwolf........88 Auto Code $32B: 360 rwhp
6. T- Ram..............???: 276 rwhp
7. yakmastermax...89 6 speed Code $6E: 224.8 something sad/forgettable rwhp
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MAF cars only. Got dyno numbers? Post 'em up and maybe we can help you make even more hp.

tequilaboy

Datalog export: TunerPro Engine data log recorded on 06/23/2012 8:42:06
https://datazap.me/u/tequilaboy/dyno...6-504&mark=445
Dyno pull:

Datalog screenshot (end of pull):

MAF example:

As installed in car:

89L98TPI

Very nice setup. Is that the stock 48mm TB?

Aardwolf

I had mine on a Dynojet for NASA race classing. It's a budget rebuild running E85 and had the stock MAF housing tuning the stock 165 computer. It ran a best of 11.83 at 116 but not setup for drag racing.

tequilaboy

Just a reminder that there is no need to jump on the SD bandwagon with your high hp L98 TPI builds. Also updated title with more buzz-words.

Props to the Blowerworks equipped cars on the list.

We could use some more fast MAF cars to fill out the list (if there are any more out there).

Even Callaways cars are now welcome. We can do better today with better sensorics and integrated control.

Orr89rocz

My old stealth ram 383 L98 based motor made 392whp/373wtq. Heat soaked, stock maf with no screens. $6e code. Would be over 400 if not heatsoaked from 10 pulls in a row. Ran 11.47 at 118 at 3450 lbs. 700r4 trans 3600 stall

Ran 10.6 at 127 on wet shot 150 hit but wasnt fueled by maf obviously

Whats interesting to note is i did not see a gain at the track when doing a custom built cai with homemade 3.5" maf housing over the stock gutted 3" and tpi camaro intake with ram air boxes

drive it

I've been using the water injection for cooling-but really like the looks of your intercooler!
Do you have any more pics of how it fits up front? And what about overheating on a hot day in traffic with AC?
The blowerworks maf-difference from stock as far as tuning?
I did tune tune 32 then 6e before SD/then eblP4. But it's a never ending project!

tequilaboy

Here's an under the nose pic. The intercooler is a Godspeed Type X. The Aux. Fan and shrowd have been removed to make room for core.

The coolant temp does run a bit hotter than before, but it is acceptable to me. 200ish on a hot day with fan running.
At present, the AC is inop due to low pressure and needs a charge.

Tuning with new maf is done with custom xdf or tdf depending upon which editor is used and desired options for mask, range, etc.

drive it

Cool setup! Are you running a stock hood? Those three inch pipes fit over the radiator without rubbing or getting smashed by the closed hood?
Also is the intercooler tight up against the ac condenser? Or still enough room to keep a thin tranny cooler in between?

Midnight 85

tequilaboy, your pm box is full, I have a question for you.

ezobens

OK-
I gotta ask.
How do you get a 'blade' style MAF to work with a 165 ECM that came with an analog MAF?
I would love to dump the old Bosch crap.

tequilaboy

Basically: sensor + chip + hardware.

The Blowerworks method that I developed and advocate is a combination of both hardware and software changes for use with a 0-5v analog MAF sensor.

First you need a housing, sensor element and connector for the new MAF. A pin swap at the ecm is required to input the new sensor's signal to the 165 ecm. Next, appropriate programming changes are needed to read the new sensor's signal and to fit the new sensor's transfer function into the tune. From there its a matter of tuning for desired range.

Blowerworks can provide everything you need....sensor elements, housings, connectors including a plug and play adaptor for maf/harness, and any custom tuning as required.

Of course, I can help also.

ezobens

Very cool stuff!
The hardware part is easy (MAF appears to be similar to a Ford Hitachi unit?), the programming is the interesting part.
The bin from BW isn't overly cheap outright (and I can't blame them) but my question is if you purchase the bin, is it locked down or can you customize it further yourself?

SurfnSun

Why no AIC? Just curious...

tequilaboy

The point of this thread is to showcase what can be done with the 165 ecm with MAF based control and use of modern sensors and injectors. Here is a simple one-box solution to the old problem of fueling for increased horsepower and an attractive alternative to SD.

While AIC controllers are an interesting sideline, and are a viable method of supplemental fueling, they are typically SD in nature and not coordinated with the primary control system and as such, they don't really help us in the endeavor to improve upon the MAF based system.

tequilaboy

In general, bins from BW can be tuned with the appropriate tools in the usual manner. Custom range and mask dependent xdf or tdf files are provided when applicable.

tequilaboy

Here's another to add to the list:

87 Auto w-3.73. D1 Procharger 424 rwhp. Slightly detuned ~5500 rpm pull. This one could make more power with more rpm. Hot boost w-water/methanol injection, car has heads, mild cam, intake and exhaust, but stock bottom end for now. 48 lb/hr injectors are also near their limit.

Dyno data export (SuperFlow):
https://datazap.me/u/tequilaboy/test10-dyno-pull?log=0&data=1-6-11-12&solo=11-12&mark=95

TunerPro datalog export:
https://datazap.me/u/tequilaboy/test10-dyno-pull?log=1&data=67-75-83-85-105-107-109-112-113&solo=75-83-105-109-112-113&mark=214

C409

..... I see where you're going with this thread … I just don't understand WHY ? … I have a relatively mild , naturally aspirated 421 sbc on E85 that made 635hp on an engine dyno using a Holley Dominator Controller no MAF … Pushing the limits on the 165 w/Maf is like saying I don't need AFR heads if my camel hump heads are ported just so … etc, and so on … Old tech is old tech … the early factory stuff is/was never easy to hack and tune … and to my knowledge , no one has ever addressed the built-in emissions systems checks and tests that sometimes very randomly affect the performance of your rig …..

tequilaboy

Q: WHY?
A: MAF is better than S/D, of course! Plus my car is at the top of the list (and has been for 5+ years).

Brian's probably making more hp now, but racers aren't really known for making the most accurate hp claims...maybe he will provide us with an update (hint-hint).

But seriously, everything sbc and C4 related is old tech and we're all still here for some reason.

I had some recent dyno and log data from a blower car that I wanted to share, so thought this was a good place to put it. Hopefully some will find it interesting. This was an old Scan and Tune thread, so it might be a bit out of place here.

MAF is inherently more flexible than S/D and is the dominant control system in most modern factory fuel controllers that use both MAF and MAP. S/D was an economical factory solution for awhile and is well suited to the aftermarket, but I wouldn't fork out my money for an aftermarket S/D controller.

Edit/Update: I updated my initial post with an export of the old TunerPro log file made during the 478 rwhp dyno pull, if anybody is interested. I see I had some knock/knock retard present. Keep in mind that the car was never tuned on a dyno or with the benefit of a Wideband O2 sensor. This was just a $50 pull at a local dyno day. MAF air temp was running about 86 °F on drive to the dyno and before the pull. On the dyno, the external cooling fans couldn't really keep up, so the IAT was about 20 ° F hotter than would be seen on the road in a 3rd or 4th gear pull under the same condtions.

C409

….. I have an OLD Air Sensors Set-up I'd sell you real cheap … analog controller with a 4" MAF sensor and small-ish 4bbl Throttle Body Injection unit …..