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I have a 1990 C4, and I'd like to get a scanner for it. I'm looking at ALDLDroid for Android. It costs $100 for the app and the bluetooth cable, but I like the wireless functionality and the UI compared to a scanner. I've seen various threads on this, but they didn't quite tell me what I wanted to know. With that said, I have a few questions.
If you have it, do you like it more than a scanner of a comparable price?
Does it have all the functionality a scanner does?
I heard something mentioned about the bluetooth plug needing a power source. Would I need to open up my dash and splice in a wire for the plug?
The app description mentions that it can be used for tuning. I'm thinking about tuning my car myself instead of paying someone else. It sounds like the learning curve is brutal, but doable, and I'm always up for a challenge. However, I'm entirely new to this so I don't know what would be required. Is ALDLDroid and the cable sufficient equipment to tune it, or would I need to buy something else?
I have a 1990 C4, and I'd like to get a scanner for it. I'm looking at ALDLDroid for Android. It costs $100 for the app and the bluetooth cable, but I like the wireless functionality and the UI compared to a scanner. I've seen various threads on this, but they didn't quite tell me what I wanted to know. With that said, I have a few questions.
If you have it, do you like it more than a scanner of a comparable price?
Scanners are limited, this offers the same functions as a scanner plus more
Originally Posted by C4ProjectCar
Does it have all the functionality a scanner does?
Yes see above, I have never used a scanner.. I used laptop programs int he past and currently, ALDLDroid is nice for tablet portability
Originally Posted by C4ProjectCar
I heard something mentioned about the bluetooth plug needing a power source. Would I need to open up my dash and splice in a wire for the plug?
I believe the one form Red Devil River uses 12v power from the ALDL plug itself, so no issues there (you can also get it to connect to the cigarette socket too)
Originally Posted by C4ProjectCar
The app description mentions that it can be used for tuning. I'm thinking about tuning my car myself instead of paying someone else. It sounds like the learning curve is brutal, but doable, and I'm always up for a challenge. However, I'm entirely new to this so I don't know what would be required. Is ALDLDroid and the cable sufficient equipment to tune it, or would I need to buy something else?
so fro this, Yes you CAN tune from the program, but I would also look at TunerPro for the PC as well, ALDL accepts the TunerPro files which makes it that much easier to bounce between the 2 if needed.. I do a lot of the Chip burning and programming on the PC and datalogging on the ALDLDroid. If I had an ostrich or the APU1 I could burn as I go.
The Moates Burn1 ( and 2) are both great, I have the Burn1 and really like it.
Never messed with the tuning part of the app, for a 90 you will still need to either burn chips or get ostrich.
The interface is great and very customizable, the datalogging works just fine and the developer of the app very helpful too. Me personally I make sure of having the car running and holding my phone connected monitoring its readings wall inspecting other elements of the car.
I have the 1320 bluetooth aldl port, its about the size of a radar detector and needs a power supply, the cord is pretty long and my plan is to run the cord backwards and mount everything under the dash and out of viewing range.
So it does take a little work to be both wireless and visually wireless
Scanners are limited, this offers the same functions as a scanner plus more
Yes see above, I have never used a scanner.. I used laptop programs int he past and currently, ALDLDroid is nice for tablet portability
I believe the one form Red Devil River uses 12v power from the ALDL plug itself, so no issues there (you can also get it to connect to the cigarette socket too)
so fro this, Yes you CAN tune from the program, but I would also look at TunerPro for the PC as well, ALDL accepts the TunerPro files which makes it that much easier to bounce between the 2 if needed.. I do a lot of the Chip burning and programming on the PC and datalogging on the ALDLDroid. If I had an ostrich or the APU1 I could burn as I go.
The Moates Burn1 ( and 2) are both great, I have the Burn1 and really like it.
Thanks for responding, Jeff! That will help a lot.
I should be able to use the bluetooth ALDL plug with TunerPro, provided I have a bluetooth adapter on my computer, right?
And to clarify, you use TunerPro (or ALDLDroid) in conjunction with BURN1/2 to tune?
Originally Posted by Jay7199
Never messed with the tuning part of the app, for a 90 you will still need to either burn chips or get ostrich.
The interface is great and very customizable, the datalogging works just fine and the developer of the app very helpful too. Me personally I make sure of having the car running and holding my phone connected monitoring its readings wall inspecting other elements of the car.
I have the 1320 bluetooth aldl port, its about the size of a radar detector and needs a power supply, the cord is pretty long and my plan is to run the cord backwards and mount everything under the dash and out of viewing range.
So it does take a little work to be both wireless and visually wireless
I'm still trying to figure this out - so you either can use BURN1/2 to create a new chip which you then piggyback somehow on the ECM, or you can use Ostrich to change the ECM itself?
Thanks for your opinion of the app. That's what I seem to be hearing across the board, so it sounds like a good buy.
Mounting the bluetooth receiver out of sight sounds like a good idea. It would be nice to be able to pull up ECM data at any time.
Thanks for responding, Jeff! That will help a lot.
I should be able to use the bluetooth ALDL plug with TunerPro, provided I have a bluetooth adapter on my computer, right?
And to clarify, you use TunerPro (or ALDLDroid) in conjunction with BURN1/2 to tune?
Yes to all the above
Originally Posted by C4ProjectCar
I'm still trying to figure this out - so you either can use BURN1/2 to create a new chip which you then piggyback somehow on the ECM, or you can use Ostrich to change the ECM itself?
Thanks for your opinion of the app. That's what I seem to be hearing across the board, so it sounds like a good buy.
Mounting the bluetooth receiver out of sight sounds like a good idea. It would be nice to be able to pull up ECM data at any time.
So there is a GM Adapter Moates sells, you use that and put a burnt chip in it that you made with the BURN2 OR you connect the ribbon cable of the Ostrich to it and run the Custom file out of the Ostrich.. I would suggest the Ostrich for short term.. burn a chip if you will be leaving it a lone for a bit.
I have a permanent install so I use my USB cable for datalogging
So there is a GM Adapter Moates sells, you use that and put a burnt chip in it that you made with the BURN2 OR you connect the ribbon cable of the Ostrich to it and run the Custom file out of the Ostrich.. I would suggest the Ostrich for short term.. burn a chip if you will be leaving it a lone for a bit.
I have a permanent install so I use my USB cable for datalogging
Why is the Ostrich better for short-term stuff?
Do you have to buy a new chip each time you burn it, or can you re-burn the same chip?
That setup is pretty sweet. I like it. How do you control the stereo? Do you just play music that's stored on your tablet?
Why is the Ostrich better for short-term stuff?
Do you have to buy a new chip each time you burn it, or can you re-burn the same chip?
That setup is pretty sweet. I like it. How do you control the stereo? Do you just play music that's stored on your tablet?
Well, my friend used it forever and the BIN file is not permanently stored.. so he ended up with issues.. it is not recommended for long term use (if no changes are made)
If you buy the ones you posted they are good for 10000+ reprograms so you will be fine with one
Well, my friend used it forever and the BIN file is not permanently stored.. so he ended up with issues.. it is not recommended for long term use (if no changes are made)
If you buy the ones you posted they are good for 10000+ reprograms so you will be fine with one
Don't EVER mess with the original EPROM. You always want a baseline to go back to if something goes wacko. Plus, the original chips are worth lots of dollars.
Buy some EPROMs and program away. I got 5 27C128s on eBay for future use...
You will need an ultraviolet eraser to erase the EPROMs. I did some investigation on that and unfortunately UV LEDs don't put out the correct frequency of light. You need an eraser that has UV fluorescent tubes.
A friend of mine upgraded his L98 to 383 cubic inches. He told me he went through 29 iterations on the programming to get it to run the way he wanted it to run. That's why you need an eraser -- you'll be using it a lot. Same rationale for having multiple EPROMs.
take your time and read a bunch before doing anything, make sure you understand what you are changing..
Okay, thanks.
I admittedly went into this project knowing practically nothing about working on a car so I make sure to do tons of research ahead of time. Do you have any particular resources you'd suggest?
Don't EVER mess with the original EPROM. You always want a baseline to go back to if something goes wacko. Plus, the original chips are worth lots of dollars.
Buy some EPROMs and program away. I got 5 27C128s on eBay for future use...
You will need an ultraviolet eraser to erase the EPROMs. I did some investigation on that and unfortunately UV LEDs don't put out the correct frequency of light. You need an eraser that has UV fluorescent tubes.
A friend of mine upgraded his L98 to 383 cubic inches. He told me he went through 29 iterations on the programming to get it to run the way he wanted it to run. That's why you need an eraser -- you'll be using it a lot. Same rationale for having multiple EPROMs.
Thanks for the advice. I'll definitely not mess with the original.
Wow, UV light? That's sure odd. I'll track one down I guess.
I have a 1990 C4, and I'd like to get a scanner for it. I'm looking at ALDLDroid for Android. It costs $100 for the app and the bluetooth cable, but I like the wireless functionality and the UI compared to a scanner. I've seen various threads on this, but they didn't quite tell me what I wanted to know. With that said, I have a few questions.
If you have it, do you like it more than a scanner of a comparable price?
Does it have all the functionality a scanner does?
I heard something mentioned about the bluetooth plug needing a power source. Would I need to open up my dash and splice in a wire for the plug?
The app description mentions that it can be used for tuning. I'm thinking about tuning my car myself instead of paying someone else. It sounds like the learning curve is brutal, but doable, and I'm always up for a challenge. However, I'm entirely new to this so I don't know what would be required. Is ALDLDroid and the cable sufficient equipment to tune it, or would I need to buy something else?
The wireless functionality was the main reason I bought mine. That way, you can install a permanent display showing live information from the ALDL data stream. It looks pretty cool, but it's useful too if you can interpret the data on-the-fly. Like everyone else has said, research will go a long way towards making things easier. The learning curve is kind of steep at first, but if you're the kind of person that's generally thirsty for knowledge, it's probably going to be worth it, especially if you plan on keeping the car indefinitely.
A lot of scanners under $100 are going lack some higher-end features, but it's mostly OBD2 stuff anyway and won't do you much good on anything older than a '94-95. I haven't explored the tuning functionality of ALDLdroid, so I'm not sure if there's any limitations in that regard. I generally use C.A.T.S. Tuner (Tunercat) for offline PROM tuning.
The only thing you might want a traditional scanner for is to read trouble codes off the ECM, as this is something ALDLdroid doesn't do. I have a '93, so I'm not sure if you can use the paperclip method to pull codes off a '90.
As far as the adapter goes, it is very possible that you'll have to wire a switched 12v circuit to it using the terminal lead that Timm sends you with the adapter. It's hard to say, because I don't know what the ALDL pinout on the '90 looks like. Maybe it's the same as the '93, but I'm not sure. I think the adapter comes pre-wired to accept power on pins G or L, so you'll have to look at the ALDL pinout for your year and see if either of those 2 pins will work. I know that on the '93, neither of them do. I had to have Timm re-wire mine to accept power on pin D, as it's one of the only pins not being used for something else. If you do need the adapter wired to accept power from a different pin, then be sure to let Timm know before you buy it, or you may end up having to ship it back so he can fix it. Ask me how I know.
Last edited by cousinit99; 09-03-2014 at 07:34 AM.
The wireless functionality was the main reason I bought mine. That way, you can install a permanent display showing live information from the ALDL data stream. It looks pretty cool, but it's useful too if you can interpret the data on-the-fly. Like everyone else has said, research will go a long way towards making things easier. The learning curve is kind of steep at first, but if you're the kind of person that's generally thirsty for knowledge, it's probably going to be worth it, especially if you plan on keeping the car indefinitely.
A lot of scanners under $100 are going lack some higher-end features, but it's mostly OBD2 stuff anyway and won't do you much good on anything older than a '94-95. I haven't explored the tuning functionality of ALDLdroid, so I'm not sure if there's any limitations in that regard. I generally use C.A.T.S. Tuner (Tunercat) for offline PROM tuning.
The only thing you might want a traditional scanner for is to read trouble codes off the ECM, as this is something ALDLdroid doesn't do. I have a '93, so I'm not sure if you can use the paperclip method to pull codes off a '90.
As far as the adapter goes, it is very possible that you'll have to wire a switched 12v circuit to it using the terminal lead that Timm sends you with the adapter. It's hard to say, because I don't know what the ALDL pinout on the '90 looks like. Maybe it's the same as the '93, but I'm not sure. I think the adapter comes pre-wired to accept power on pins G or L, so you'll have to look at the ALDL pinout for your year and see if either of those 2 pins will work. I know that on the '93, neither of them do. I had to have Timm re-wire mine to accept power on pin D, as it's one of the only pins not being used for something else. If you do need the adapter wired to accept power from a different pin, then be sure to let Timm know before you buy it, or you may end up having to ship it back so he can fix it. Ask me how I know.
Yeah, finals can be a bear. Hope yours go well!
The purpose of this car is for me to learn as much as possible, so it sounds like this app is just what I'm looking for.
I can pull the codes with the whole "jump pins A and B, then watch the speedometer" routine, so I don't need a scanner for that.
I'll check to see if it has power on one of those pins. If not, I'll work it out like you did. Thanks for the heads-up.
Like they say, lessons learned the hard way... I got my share of those too.
As far as chips are concerned, see if Moates still has the 27SF512 chips. They are EEPROM based so you don't need the UV eraser. EEPROM - electrically erasable programmable read only memory. They are compatible with the programmer he sells; probably many other programmers.
I've got the ALDL Bluetooth adapter from 1320 Electronics. It powers off the cigarette lighter, or if you email them they can power it from any pin you want on the ALDL connector.
ALDLDroid is worth every penny. I've never used the programming features. I just log and review the logs later.
As far as chips are concerned, see if Moates still has the 27SF512 chips. They are EEPROM based so you don't need the UV eraser. EEPROM - electrically erasable programmable read only memory. They are compatible with the programmer he sells; probably many other programmers.
I've got the ALDL Bluetooth adapter from 1320 Electronics. It powers off the cigarette lighter, or if you email them they can power it from any pin you want on the ALDL connector.
ALDLDroid is worth every penny. I've never used the programming features. I just log and review the logs later.
Unfortunately it looks like those chips are no longer in production. I'll see if I can find a different EEPROM chip for my car. So far I haven't been able to find one.
Wow, ALDLDroid sure gets glowing reviews! I'm definitely going to get it.
There is also the atmel AT29C256 I think. Try looking for those on ebay. People over there are yanking them out of old computers and reselling. Just verify by looking at the data sheet for 27C256 (what I think you have for an EPROM) versus AT29C256.
There is also the atmel AT29C256 I think. Try looking for those on ebay. People over there are yanking them out of old computers and reselling. Just verify by looking at the data sheet for 27C256 (what I think you have for an EPROM) versus AT29C256.
Moates BURN2 programmer looks to do both.
Wow, my bad. All I found when I Googled it was this which says they're no longer in production. I took that to mean they weren't for sale any more, but it looks like Moates just has a stockpile which they are apparently still selling.
Thanks for correcting me.
I'll check out that other chip too.
I think the adapter comes pre-wired to accept power on pins G or L, so you'll have to look at the ALDL pinout for your year and see if either of those 2 pins will work.
I looked it up online, and pin G on mine is described as "12v Fuel Pump Test". I checked it with a multimeter, and voltage from that pin to ground is in fact 12v. This leads me to believe it can be used to power the bluetooth adapter, but the "fuel pump test" description seems a little odd.
EDIT: I checked the FSM, and it describes pin G as "CCM Diagnostic", so I suspect "12v Fuel Pump Test" is for a different year. Nonetheless, there is still a 12v current from that to ground. Pins D and E are empty, so if pin G can't be used I guess I'll have to wire one of those for 12v. I'm hoping I will be able to use pin G so I won't have to.
Last edited by C4ProjectCar; 09-07-2014 at 04:58 PM.
09-01-2014, 08:26 PM
ALDLDroid Info?
