TheCorvetteKid

According to the new rules on the Drive Clean webwsite, that holds true only if it's 1987 and older. 1988 and new cars will still need to be emissions tested every two years 'til they are 30 years old.

Which is ballz because because there's virtually no difference (from an emissions point of view) in our cars from '87 to '91. But because some yahoo at the ministry decided '87 "sounds good", the rest of us get the shaft!

TheCorvetteKid

There are no restrictions for 'Hot Rod" but there are restrictions for "Historic" or "Classic" vehicles. As a "Historic" vehicle, you are exempt from emissions testing, but much like Maryland, you are supposed to only use the car for parades, and shows, and very limited driving.

So following that logic, just as my car reaches the point when it's exempt from emissions testing, it'll be treated like a geriatic by our government. Nice. Maybe I can get the Ministry to issue the car a Senior Citizen certificate so I can get a discount when I renew the registration ever two years!

TheCorvetteKid

I failed the e-test twice due to a bad EGR valve last year. I tested the EGR valve itself (tried to pull a vacuum and it wouldn't hold) and replaced it. The NOx came WAY down and the car passed. But there were no codes at that time, so I had no idea the EGR was bad 'til I e-tested it.

I really doubt my EGR valve isn't working becuase it's new, but Code 32 doesn't mean it's the EGR valve per se... it means the entire EGR circuit. So it could be anything from the EGR temperature diagnostic switch to the EGR solenoid to a simple vacuum leak... I won't know until I diagnose the entire system, which doesn't require a e-test.

If you scroll back through this thread (I believe it's on the first page) forum member Agent 86 was kind enough to post the diagnostic test for checking the entire EGR circuit.

There is a forth option...

When I failed last year, the technician testing the car (a very experienced GM mechanic) suggested setting the ignition timing to zero (0) and retesting the car. At that time, the car was so close to passing that he said it would have passed easily if I had zeroed the timing (just for the test, obviously).

Probably true, however I didn't want to do that. The fact it was failing signalled a serious problem and I'd rather fix the problem then mask it, which is what I did.

My current problem with the car throwing a code probably has a simple solution (like I said, either a vaccum leak or the EGR diagnostic switch - both inexpensive repairs to make), but it's begged the question of whether or not these cars could pass emissions if the EGR was removed and the chip was retuned to account for it's absense.

GM has discontinued the EGR solenoid, so if that fails on any of our cars we're screwed with respect to emissions (unless you find one at a wrecker or used). Plus, with a lot of eary C4 owners looking for more power - coupled with the fact that the Super-Ram is no longer available - the Mini-Ram is becoming a poplular upgrade. The Mini-Ram doesn't have provisions for an EGR, so in Ontario if may be impossible to ever use one if you can't reprogram the computer to allow the car to pass the e-test without the EGR.

The EGR valve itself is not hard to change at all. The part is about $100 (in fact, I think it was $92 if I remember correctly), and it's only two bolts that hold it in place. You will have to remove the upper plenum and runners to access it, but that's not hard at all. In fact, you may not even need to take the runners off! You can even leave the throttlebody alone too (just remove the 4 bolts that hold it to the plenum - the throttle cable and all the vacuum and coolant hoses that connect to it will hold it place). It shouldn't take more than an hour to do the whole job. Just make sure you have a 1/4" drive "wobble" extension, some Permatex hi-temp sealant for the gasket (comes with the EGR valve), and take some digital photos of the vacuum lines to help aid reassembly.

KeyWestJack

Do you recall whether the egr valve was a Delco of some other after market. I replace one in my 90. It was an aftermarket and as I found out the wrong type (positive vs. negative back pressure). (check some of the other threads on this site) Additionally, I got a 92 solinoid and adapted it to work for my car. The difference is in mounting and hose connection but nothing major.

TheCorvetteKid

The one I installed was a genuine Delco part, not aftermarket. In fact, if I'm not mistaken, I pulled a vaccuum on it just to make sure it worked the same way, and it did. but you make a good point - some GM EGR valves work opposte to the ones in our cars.

I was going to see if a solenoid from an F-Body TPI car would work (either Camaro or Firebird T/A). Of course, that's assuming the General hasn't discontinued the one on those cars too...

But your idea of adapting a '92 solenoid sounds good. I just ordered up a new EGR diagnostic switch today (should be here tomorrow), but if I need the solenoid, I may try your idea.

Thanks!

Canam

wow, I'll have to check that one out. I was under the understanding that it advanced every year so my 93 would not need one after 5 more years or two more tests.

Canam

I'm looking at swapping out the valve myself. On my 92 lt1 car, the EGR is at the back of the engine at the top held on by two very visable bolts. Its a 6 speed car. I found out that the two different valve listings are for an auto or a manual trans.
Is that all there is to it? From what it looks like I won't have to remove anything except the left side plastic valve cover to get at it. If its that simple I'll do it myself. Comments?

TheCorvetteKid

Yeah, that caught me by surprise too. Fortunately, the ministry is actually seeking comments from the public regarding this, and I for one plan to voice my opinion. If you look at all the vehicles built during the mid to late eighties, many were the same year-to-year so there's little logic behind picking 1987 as the cutoff other than the fact that it's exactly 20 years ago. Following that logic, if these changes were being proposed two years from now, I'd be be fine and anyone with a 1990 Corvette - which has virtually the exact same L98 engine - would be S.O.L... make sense to me .

Personally, I urge every Ontarian to write the ministry regarding this.

I didn't realize you had an LT1 (for some reason I thought you had a '91, which was the last year for the L98 engine (same as in my '89).

I've never replaced the EGR valve on an LT1 but I'm sure it's easier than on the L98. You don't have to deal with removing the plenum and/or runners. It's just two bolts that hold it place and a single vacuum line that runs to the diaphram housing. That's it. For the effort, I'd definitely do it myself.

Hopefully one or more of the forum's LT1 owners can add their comments on this though...

Canam

your dead right. Its really easy as long as I don't drop a bolt. I'm going to order the part tomorrow. Its 94 bucks at Part source.

NHRalph

I had a bad EGR reading on my Chrysler Sebring and I cleaned it by squirting carb cleaner in it and getting a lot of carbon out of it. I could work the plunger with my finger and once it was all clean, the car ran great and no more codes.

Canam

That was pretty easy. A tight fit but a few rags underneath and an extra set of hands holding the valve in place while threading the inside bolt helps. I cleaned the old valve out with carb cleaner. It was pretty grungy but the plunger was still operating manually.
Now we'll see how an Etest goes.

TheCorvetteKid

Did you replace the EGR valve or just clean the old one? Just because the plunger moves freely doesn't necessarily mean the EGR valve is working properly. Remember, it's a diaphram that moves when vacuum is applied. The diaphram itself may be punctured or damaged so if that's the case, the plunger would still move up and down by hand but the EGR valve won't work when on the car. The only way to test this is to attach a vacuum pump to the EGR valve and pull a vaccum, watching to see if the diapham moves.

Either way, good luck with the eTest!

Canam

Nope its a brand new one. Made in USA and not korea thank god lol. We shall see. I did clean the old one and will probably test it at a later date.

Canam

Well the car blew clean, it was the EGR valve. The old one I replaced would not hold vaccum at all. The other numbers went up and Nox went down. Tech says this is normal as the engine is recompensating for the new valve. He says next time it will blow even better