frankinvett84

with a ported intake and stock ecm. and stock tbs
http://www.jegs.com/p/Blueprint-Engi...97259/10002/-1
or
http://www.jegs.com/p/Chevrolet-Performance/Chevrolet-P
erformance-350ci-290HP-Engine-Package/755609/10002/-1

any help will be great. Need a new engine and would like to keep orig. intake. I am most concerned with the cams, Are they too big? I have ported the intake as much as I can .Evan have a spare incase for some reason I wanna go back

frankinvett84

ttt

Race Prepared

Locate and install a TPI, you won't regret it my friend.

gwbutch

You see that the Blueprint engine is higher compression, 10:1, and wants 91 octane; whereas the Chevy Performance is lower compression, 8:1. I'm not sure how either would work with the ECM, but I would rather go with the Blueprint in case someday I wanted to get an EBL Flash.

frankinvett84

My first thought was to just to put a carb on it. I'm not giving up on crossfire yet.
one more chance with brand new motor under it. I've read that the ecm doesn't "like"
too much cam but I know that it also depends on the heads. I'm just looking for the most info I can before getting a crate engine .

Phosgene

both will perform like garbage with a crossfire intake unless you seriously port it all of the way through

if you want to keep your factory wiring harness, just use a carbed intake and a 454 TBI with a baseplate adapter, you can keep the stock ECM too and it flows 670 CFM

although it still wont perform as good as an aftermarket EFI system, TPI, or even a well tuned carb

frankinvett84

define garbage. do you mean wont stay running or wont run to engines full potential. the advertised hp of 375 for the blueprint. would be great but if I end up with a nice running and sounding 300-ish engine with potential for more in future if I want to switch something like induction and or ecm.

frankinvett84

I am looking to put the best engine I can under a ported intake with stock tbs.and ecm
I like the convenience and options for future mods of a aluminum headed performance crate engine. my budget is between $3000-$4000. and that's with any replacement parts like flywheel t-conv. ect. I might run across while installing new engine

Tom400CFI

As is standard in CFI thread...the BS is flowing.

A TPI won't perform any better than a ported intake, and barely better than an unported one.

The 454 TBI on a good single plane intake will easily out perform any stock TPI.


No way you'll get 375hp through a stock CFI intake. Even a ported one won't get you there (and neither will any stock TPI). A well ported CFI intake, feeding it what it wants, can get you 300 - 320 horse. The "blueprint" engine has way too much cam for a 350. It would work but idle rough and not pass emissions w/o some kind of tune/aftermarket ECM to control it. The 290 hp engine would work fine, and you'd probably end up with around 250 hp with your stock exhaust, accessories, etc.

Phosgene

unless you seriously port your CFI intake, you will not get anywhere near 375HP or likely not even 300

at 245HP a stock TPI is far better than any crossfire intake, and even a ported crossfire intake (with the intake porting being the only mod)

and unlike crossfire, TPIs have a far larger aftermarket, respond better to mods, and instead of spending enormous amounts of time and effort porting a Crossfire intake, TPIs can easily be replaced with a converted LT1 intake which will easily flow more than any stock/near stock L98 will need

after owning both, the TPI cars are far easier to work on, cheaper to upgrade, more reliable, and produce better results and performance both when stock and modified

Tom400CFI

Well there is is some of that BS. That^ is not true.


Let's rephrase that. You could spent a ton of money replacing all the parts that make a TPI a TPI (>$1000), or you could simply spend a little time on a hobby and get some major gains for the price of a set of intake gaskets by porting the CFI intake.



Huh. I've owned both too. Opposite was true for me. CFI got better gas mileage too.

cv67

Used to run Shinobi Xs old 84 with my 89 at LACR a number of times
Both stock (ok I had a catback 3.07 gear) his a 3.54 gear stock with that top aftermarket plate (cant recall the name.

Most times dead heat if that tells you anything other than they were both slow

frankinvett84

Nice. thanks for info. I'm not necessarily looking to get 375hp out of the engine / intake
right now. I wanted to buy a crate engine (leaning towards blueprint375hp) put it under my heavily ported intake with headman 1 5/8" headers stock pipes to gutted catto dynomax mufflers I also have airpump delete. My question is why "way too much cam" I don't care about gas mileage and don't want smooth idle also no need for emission testing. just wanna put a 300 to 375 hp engine under my ported cfi to see if I can make it do a 1/4 mile less than 13 sec..if not I have a decent engine I can put some other induction system on . For over a decade I ve been "Playing "with my crossfire I love it. I need to see what I can make it do on top of a decent engine. oh and would really like to keep low end torque . am I pushing reality?

Tom400CFI

Depends on what is "reality" for you.

If you don't care about mileage, idle, emissions, that cam would work. I ran a 224/234 cam under my CFI and it ran great...but that was in a 400.

Basically, your 350 with a ~230ish cam will change the shape of the toque curve, and change the tq peak RPM. This means that your air flow requirements will not be aligned with your fueling. You can band-aid it by changing injector size, pressure, etc. and make it go pretty good, but it's not ideal. I think 12's are possible. I went low 13's with mind on low compression, crappy stock heads, and poor exhaust.

ex-x-fire

Hey Tom, didn't cfi-efi make his cfi intake work with a vortec small block? That would be a good foundation for a budget build.

frankinvett84

I knew I read that on here. I don't think there were any photos. Will the crossfire bolt up to center bolt heads 85- 87 because blueprint builds some nice ones with those heads.

Phosgene

alright, show ANY crossfire engine where the only change was the intake manifold that can make 245HP

even the renegade manifold claims to provide 15-30HP gains at best, which has never been able to have been backed up by any dyno tests

as for spending over 1K upgrading a TPI intake, thats laughably false, i converted my 87 to a LT1 intake and it cost me a grand total of $53 including the intake itself and gaskets

Tom400CFI

No problem. Look up posts by CFI-EFI. His car was good for mid 13's. Mods were FULLY ported intake, dual exhaust, converter.
^That's one.

My own '83 Trans Am which was a 305 CFI went 14.5/95. How many hp does it take to run 14.5/95 in a 3300 lb car? Takes about 230hp or so. When my car ran that, mods were:
*Edelbrock TES manifolds
*Advanced timing
*Fuel pressure
*BW T5 trans (CFI TA's never came w/a stick shift like the 'Vette did)
Notice that I didn't say "ported intake". I ran those numbers with a box-stock CFI intake...on a 305.

Next engine in that same car was a TBI Vortec 350 long block (peanut cam), stock unported intake, same exhaust...14.1x's/98. Know how many hp it takes to run 14.1x's/98 in a 3300 lb car? About 245 or so.


Then that wasn't a TPI then...was it? TPI is that intake that has 8 tubes that curve down from a plenum to a lower intake that looks suspiciously like the CFI lower. Here is a TPI intake;


LT1 intakes are short, straight runner intakes, and hvae nothing to do with "TPI". You're talking about (or confusing) two different things.

Tom400CFI

That's right. He, Ross Rossland (on this forum) and myself put his highly ported CFI intake onto a '96-'99 Vortec 350 long block. It took a little work (drilling/tapping holes in heads, more porting etc) but it wasn't bad, and it ended working great for him. I definitely wouldn't try to claim that it's a "bolt on", or that it's easy for anyone...you have to be determined to make it work.

frankinvett84

so I think Im leaning toward the blueprint. Can anyone let me know what I should expect when I put this engine under my heavily ported manifold and ect.