MavsAK

Feel free to never do so, obviously you couldn't get it to work

Maybe you couldn't get it to work because you didn't use the wealth of information that's out there. Yes a mini ram will produce more power at higher RPM, no one's denying that. But on a street driven engine that's not what you need, it's not on Auto X either for that matter. And the TPI is proven to make respectable times on this forum in the 1/4.

Personally I think the mini ram is a waste of time. Yeah, makes more power.. precisely where you're never going to use it 80 percent of the time. And frankly with the work involved you could have just gotten a later model C4 and had the same intake out of the box.

Chances are, if there's a whole load of people telling you "yes it can" and you say it can't because you couldn't get it done, more than likely, it's probably NOT a case of everyone lying about it and that the fault lies somewhere in what YOU did.

MavsAK

Not my baby unfortunately. My silver bullet's not done yet. (I'm kind of up in the air about whether I should stay NA or go boost right now)

It sounds an awful lot like velvet revolver in the background.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...utt8VnrA#t=110 here's 383s car on autocross

Oh and at the end you get a nice shot under the hood. Notice...there's LTRs there. Nice big fat ones. (AS&M/TPIS)

cudamax

Really? Why is That? They do what all of us can't. They have 8 or 10 different Intakes
A fresh Short block.
All the money to spend, like it's someone else's. Because it is.
A car to thrash and drive like its Stolen.
A frick=in Dyno
All the tools and the know how and a Mag to publish it in
If you follow exactly one of the builds. I think it's a safe bet, you will get pretty close numbers.
Thats not good?

Deakins

Are you seriously suggesting that a car magazine, who is given parts by select companies to "market" with a magazine build are doing anything other than obtain the outcome prescribed by said manufacturer? Have you ever read one of those articles where the parts didn't do well? I sure haven't but I have worked with a lot of engines that didn't run as the manufacturer claimed that they should have (see, unlike both of you I have worked on a lot of performance engines over the years and we aren't talking street car TPI builds either).

I'll be frank, on the way to the grocery store I don't need diesel tq numbers at idle; if you want to play with the ricers or use the old seat of the pants dyno to convince yourself that your slow TPI ride has it all in the right places maybe you do. I personally have never experienced a car running the 1/4 mile while never exceeding 4000 RPM or run a road course for that matter. I guess it boils down to if you are looking for serious performance or if you just want it to feel fast. To each his own.

Oh and dyno's are not all that rare in the world, and really, neither are shops that can build and tune an engine. So I'm not so sure what a magazine staff has that's so special. Just my .02

MavsAK

I suggest you pour yourself a nice tall glass of shutup juice before you shove that foot farther down your own throat.

Actually I have, seen in several builds, parts that didn't perform as expected in super chevy and carcraft just to name two mags. Particularly in build off issues when they start pitting parts against parts.
If you notice in the second mag that was linked, ( http://xtremecarzone.com.au/index.php?showtopic=386 ) they even go so far as to demonstrate the differences in TPI, vs the ram intakes, and even the converted LT1. But then I suppose a master mechanic who knows everything forever, despite the fact that he can't even get results that several others in this forum (one of which was a poster in this very thread) have gotten out of their cars, wouldn't need anything like "fancy book learning" or literacy, to defend his butt hurt that he couldn't get his TPI to go fast put a mini ram on and probably still hasn't gone as fast as the "worthless TPI!" guys have.

https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...r-383-tpi.html This guy. TA, got his TPI into the 11s too. Unless you'd like to call him a liar too And he posted in this thread.

Also as for my experience? I wouldn't be calling that into question if I were you. Because you can't even get your car to repeat results that many others have. You're like that one guy that sits in the corner who just repeats what everyone else says, without the actual experience to back it up. Right Now, my TPI is making at a "Tiny" (according to you) 350 cubes, 315 chp and 428 ft lbs. I've not ported a damn thing yet and believe me buddy there's plenty of room in that Edelbrock manifold for porting, to say nothing of the heads. I've not even swapped the cam yet either. I am probably going to go with the 219 lingenfelter, or a 08-302-8. I've pretty much hit the limit of what the factory cam is able to manage at this point. And that's on a real dyno, not an engine builder program which by the way guessed within 8 hp and 7 ft lbs of torque of my current build.

I know, based on research, between this forum, youtube, and the car mags which you guessed it were the ones that help direct me in part selection on the L98 that this engine's got plenty more in it.

I'm up in the air as to if I'm going to get a 400 shortblock From Dart that comes with the mahle forged pistons, crank, 1 piece rear main, and the necessary provisions for a hyd roller cam, or if I'm just going to spend a little more money and get a procharger D1 kit, since I had great success with those in the past, on previous cars.

I built a Firebird 3.8 running on the factory five speed, running 13.20s Without Boost in the 1/4. "That's not fast!" you say. That's on a ported factory intake, heads, and with a custom ground cam, headers and a pair of mufflers (non highflow to keep it a sleeper). On a car that started out making high 14.90s and low 15s. That car was going to get an LT1 Procharger kit after I supercharged a buddy's Formula, and I found out that it can indeed work, with just a 3.8 SCs crankshaft pulley on the V6. It wound up falling through, because of a drunk newspaper guy hitting my car at 5 am when it was parked on a side street.

I've had a ZX14 stock that ran 8.80s and I'm not a particularly good rider, I'll let you guess how much faster it was after I put the 75 shot 2 stage nitrous on it. I doubt you've built anything remotely that fast. I sold that bike after someone I knew put himself in the hospital for a while wrecking his busa.

I've also helped my father on all three of his Car projects. One of which was a TPI converted 2500 Vandura. We're working on a 94 Camaro, with a 4.3 Turbo Swap, and an 86 Fiero with a Northstar swap. I'm trying to get him to sell me his extra Fiero, so I can do either a 3.8 Supercharged, or do a Northstar swap of my own (as I have the engine laying around from my First Car project which was going to be an 85 Camaro with a Northstar swapped in. I wound up putting that one in a ditch, thanks to falling asleep at the wheel at 4am)

He's also working, as his own project turbocharging his 93 1000F CBR and converting it to a 2005 1000RR's EFI. Said bike also has had the forks of a Suzuki GSXR 1000 swapped on along with the brakes, and an added stabilizer bar.

So yes, I have experience turning wrenches, and I have access to more than 40 years of experience not even five miles away.

Know what the magazine has that most of us don't? A near unlimited budget, and time on the dyno whenever they want it. Or passes down the track.

But hey if you want to believe that you're a master mechanic that knows more than others on this forum....go right ahead. Good luck with your silly "1/4 mile wonder!" miniram. I'll keep right on plugging with the TPI build, so I have a mountain carving, 'grocery getting' autocrossing, and occasional 1/4 mile hopper that does nothing but "play with the ricers"

ANTI VENOM

There is no question the cars are stiff. My 91 is a Z07 w/ FX3 as well. The rear of the 84 Z51 was very stiff but the front was not as stiff. Here's a list you may find usefull. http://vettenet.org/susp_chart.html

If you have the FX3's you can have them rebuilt. I had mine done years ago with the Morroca valving but I do not have a chipped controller, so speed still affects the damping.

The TPI is fun on the street, but NOS was the best thing I ever did to my STOCK TPI. Then I decided on something different.

l98tpi

For now, with your L98 I would suggest 3 piece under drive pulley set and remove the frisbee if you haven't already. If you still have the pre cats, junk those as well.

For your brakes, stock is fine. You just need good pad material. For street, I would suggest Hawk HPS pads.

For shocks, if you want to spend a little more get Koni Sports that are adjustable. They are only single adjustable, but a lot better shocks than the Bilstein's.

Deakins

So after reading your entire wall of text I pretty much get the impression (since you said everything in such detail) that you haven't actually rebuilt many engines (nor have you ever actually built one to go compete with...)? I guess I was expecting to hear about things that you have done (I mean, while watching some youtube videos and reading car mags is how all the major players are doing it these days....ah, well, maybe in the ricer community anyway), but instead I kept reading over and over about other people's stuff and what you read about it or watched... Sorry but you are coming off as another desktop dyno wanna be that goes out trying to find videos and posts supporting his views.

You are entitled to your opinion much as I am mine; the difference is mine comes from something like 14 years of owning and modding several vettes and F bodies for various levels of power/competition while yours seems to come from riding a motorcycle and helping your father in law on a couple of his project bikes...oh and let us not forget that 3.8L build...

If you want to have a conversation about the engines I've fielded in various cars and what they did or did not do well we can certainly have it (and others can hop in and discuss their experiences; out of respect of the OP and his thread I have and will continue to avoid posting about my equipment here but feel free to PM or start your own thread.

I get the feeling that some of this is about you feeling good about your engine; you keep bashing mine but ironically you have no idea what engines I have, running, in pieces, or otherwise. Stop, read your posts, and then think about that for a min....

cudamax

So your saying that TPI's are just not worth the Effort

Tom400CFI

I think most are saying (and have been saying for years) is that $$/HP TPI is not "worth it". $$/hp being the only criteria.

Of course, other critera comes into play for many people in different places. For people in CA, "TPI" is "worth it", b/c that is the only option that is legal (That and a Super Ram). That has lead to some very innovative work by 1989TransAm, Jerrywho, and others.

For many people, the "look" of TPI makes it "worth it" to pursue good power out of a "TPI looking" intake system. MavesAK may be one of these people; he obviously likes TPI and for him, it's "worth it" to make it work (it would seem). I love the look of TPI too, and if I had one, I MAY go down that road for the same reason; It "looks cool".

Those^ are personal decisions and anyone has a right to their personal opinions, specific criteria, etc.

While it's been proven that TPI can make some good power, typically it's doesn't turn out that way and baring other criteria than $$/hp, the fastest, cheapest way to the most power is with a shorter runner intake. If an OP is asking for the best way to make power/$$, it typically isn't the BEST advice to suggest staying w/the LTR intake to get to that goal.


.

MavsAK

Let's put it this way, since your entry to this thread you have 1 denied reality, 2 repeated the false assertion that it's impossible to make power with a TPI car, and 3 assumed that some how you have more knowledge than I do or anyone else on this forum.

What's the fastest you've gotten a TPI car to then Champ?

Also your reading comprehension is a complete failure. It's probably why you don't do much reading or research, I mean really it's on the level of a highschool dropout. My experience comes from several of my own cars, 2 of which were F Bodies one 85, and one 96. In addition to my 89 C4.

And hot rodding a buddy's Formula for him. And helping out my Father (not inlaw), growing up as a kid and into the present.

In addition to my own bike project which was short and sweet.

You don't want people to insult your knowledge or rather, lack there of? Don't display it for all the world to see, when you try to pass it off as "wisdom", while actively insulting other people's integrity.

Put it this way, Deaks, there's people on this forum who I'd trust to get advice from, or help from on this forum. And you? I wouldn't even trust you to tell a newbie what weight of oil to put into an engine.

TA

MavsAK

You're still looking at serious $ though to move over to a miniram. It's also certainly possible to really wake up the L98 with fairly minimal mods. Will it be a world beater? Without serious effort? No.

Can you make it faster? Certainly.

What has my ire raised is a certain moron in this thread claiming it's completely impossible, because he couldn't get his TPI into the 11s with TPI.

I think anyone with 2 functioning brain cells in their skull knows better than that, if nothing else simply because of forced induction, and how little intake flow characteristics really matter at that point above a certain minimum which TPI exceeds.

For me TPI looks cool, actually it looks great. It's also a proven platform in autocross, even against Vipers, in no small part because of the powerband TPI kicks in at. It's also a good way to keep the revs down if you do a great deal of high altitude driving. (as I'm prone to doing in the summer months)

Sure I could build a much higher hp NA car with a miniram. No one's denying that. But I'm a pretty big believer in building for what you use the car for. For me, that'll be mountain driving, autocross, and the occasional 1/4.

It's also nice having a sleeper. So the TPI is staying on there, unless I pull the trigger down the road after I get another couple projects going and swap in an LSX.

Tom400CFI

^That car is a goer. FI certainly helps (any car).

Back in "the day", there was a Vortech 'charged GTA that frequented our drag track (Epping NH). This was the late '80's and even then I was aware of the commonly understood limitations of TPI and also 305's. This GTA was (as the license plate stated) a TPI 305. It went 12's over and over and over....which was pretty awesome in the late '80's. I was in love. Under the hood it looked stock (other than the Vortech) and I absolutely loved that someone was putting down numbers like that w/a stock looking 305 GTA. FI helps.

Tom400CFI

I hear this, and I don't like that perspective either. I've seen that countless times with CFI; people who never had one claiming something LIKE: "Nothing can be done with CFI", and that is not true. Is CFI the best platform to work from? No, but something (a lot) can be done w/it w/enough effort and focus. So saying "it can't be done" is misleading and may put someone off. It CAN be done, but there will be a price to pay to make it happen. Is the "price" ($$ and/or effort) worth it? That is a personal thing.



Not sure what you're talking about here. I live at elevation too (house at 7050') and I have the "torqueless" LT1. It seems to get around these mountains just fine -even climbs Parley's canyon (3k' rise in 13 miles) in 6th gear w/no issues.

MavsAK

Yeah, and to me it sounded like the OP was after a mild wake up for the L98. Which certainly is attainable, even with the stock intake.

Unfortunately I have the 700 R 4 to work with and the 2.59 rear gear, and traffic that seems to decide that it's best to drive at speeds of 25 in the 55s and 45s, which puts me on the gas and brakes alot. (gotta get around them after all!) I'm not a big fan of it's 3rd gear that's for sure at this point. Car does it alot better than my first few trips up mountain, post mods that's for sure.

cudamax

I bought my 1985 TPI Because of the SCCA Showroom Stocker Classes it Dominated, and because of all the Big Gun, Big Name Cars that it Blow a Way. They cried so bad and for soo long, then threatened to all not even show up if any Vettes were on the Track.
That and I love the way they look and the way they work. They also prove that Torque wins races from stop light to stop light on the street and coming out of the turns. It always has been a fight between torque or HP and which is best.
I will always go with Torque as my #1 thing to work towards on my 85 TPI and anything moving it up and closer to a 5500 rpm redline, is nice.
http://www.superchevy.com/events/vem...tte-challenge/
TPI's put-out and don't need that much dough to put out big numbers.

Tom400CFI

Aw geeze....so are you suggesting that if the '85 'Vette had an LT1, it wouldn't have produced the same results in SCCA racing?

This has been hashed so many times, covered well HERE ....especially post #7. It's all relative.

cudamax

Im saying I love my Bosch TPI Injection. Don't know what it would of been like if an 1985 had an engine from 15 or 16yrs in the Future. Heck if were talk-in Twilight Zone. Let's just have me wake up in one of those cars at the starting line in 1985

Tom400CFI

7 years.

Glad you love the TPI. The way your previous post was worded, I thought you were giving credit of all the SCCA wins to the "TPI TORK". I understand you now.