Big HP E85 Fuel system questions
04-18-2015, 09:33 PM
#21
I disagree with the magnafuel comment. My brother uses one on his 4cyl race car with a base psi of 45 and runs 50+ lbs of boost on a boost referenced system of course, however it is the bigger pump than the 4303 . Never has had any issue with unstable fuel pressures at 1200ish hp and around 100lbs of fuel pressure.
04-18-2015, 11:49 PM
#22
Drifting
Not 1200 whp 1200 hp and it's a Honda. He traps 180
After changing to the magnafuel from the aeromotive pro billet he had to reduce his WOT fuel table by 14% to lean the car out to its proper afr.
After changing to the magnafuel from the aeromotive pro billet he had to reduce his WOT fuel table by 14% to lean the car out to its proper afr.
Last edited by Shoaf85; 04-18-2015 at 11:52 PM.
04-19-2015, 12:41 AM
#24
Drifting
Yes sfwd car and no he only runs 4 injectors as he is on gas not ethanol. I was just stating our/his experience with the magnafuel pumps capacity at high pressure levels.
He is the owner of RLZ Engineering.
He is the owner of RLZ Engineering.
04-19-2015, 10:42 AM
#25
Le Mans Master
This maybe be lengthy…….Some of you know that I’m slowly working on a new setup for my 2002 C5, a new LS 408, E85 fuel, A&A YSI blower with possible of +20# of boost, guessing at +1000rwhp.
And now my latest thing is I’m trying to get a fuel system that will still work with E85, using the factory 24 tooth/GM computer, gauges etc. and would like to keep all that including having the gas gauge work. So far all I have for it is a Magnafuel EFI boost ref fuel regulator, big fuel rails, ID1300 injectors and that’s it. Other than my used non-E85 compatible Lingenfelter high-flow pump I’ve had in the car with the previous setup. Other than that it’s a stock 2002 C5 fuel system.
I originally was told about Lonnie at LPE had my all my answers but after talking with him his system had me worried it might not be enough to support my 1000rwhp on E85 goals with only using a 255 pump for normal and only one 340 pump when the boost kicks in.
A&A didn't have anything big enough to use with E85.
So then I found FORE Innovations which was great but their triple pump setups only worked with 2003 gas tanks (pump inserted from the top of tank) which super sucks considering they have exactly what I need!!! I emailed them back to find out if it’s as simple as installing the newer 2003 style tank in my car and then were good to go but heck I can’t even find a place to get a real 2003-2004 tank, Ebay shows a few but the pics actually show 97-2002 style tanks so not even sure if that’s an option……..
So then I was steered towards RSI and they basically said they haven’t done a system for a C5 in years, good luck.
So then went to Squash, they don’t have a kit for my car but maybe can put together a system for me, TBD on that.
Anyway I’m just frustrated and trying to do this right the first time but its been a struggle and hopefully you guys can help me out?
Thanks a lot in advance!
And now my latest thing is I’m trying to get a fuel system that will still work with E85, using the factory 24 tooth/GM computer, gauges etc. and would like to keep all that including having the gas gauge work. So far all I have for it is a Magnafuel EFI boost ref fuel regulator, big fuel rails, ID1300 injectors and that’s it. Other than my used non-E85 compatible Lingenfelter high-flow pump I’ve had in the car with the previous setup. Other than that it’s a stock 2002 C5 fuel system.
I originally was told about Lonnie at LPE had my all my answers but after talking with him his system had me worried it might not be enough to support my 1000rwhp on E85 goals with only using a 255 pump for normal and only one 340 pump when the boost kicks in.
A&A didn't have anything big enough to use with E85.
So then I found FORE Innovations which was great but their triple pump setups only worked with 2003 gas tanks (pump inserted from the top of tank) which super sucks considering they have exactly what I need!!! I emailed them back to find out if it’s as simple as installing the newer 2003 style tank in my car and then were good to go but heck I can’t even find a place to get a real 2003-2004 tank, Ebay shows a few but the pics actually show 97-2002 style tanks so not even sure if that’s an option……..
So then I was steered towards RSI and they basically said they haven’t done a system for a C5 in years, good luck.
So then went to Squash, they don’t have a kit for my car but maybe can put together a system for me, TBD on that.
Anyway I’m just frustrated and trying to do this right the first time but its been a struggle and hopefully you guys can help me out?
Thanks a lot in advance!
04-19-2015, 01:04 PM
#26
04-21-2015, 07:31 AM
#28
Melting Slicks
04-21-2015, 08:00 AM
#29
Le Mans Master
I've heard the comments about the magnafuel 4303 not handling high pressure too. but I don't think I'll run more than 60 base or 25 psi boost.
if the the new 450s will work (one in tank, one external booster) that would be great as they are cheaper.
need to run 1k at the wheels on e85 set on kill. I have 127 fic bosch injectors, and a bap
would 2 450s do it?
the magnafuel is 450 at least, and maybe it's not the best choice. seems to be popular.
I need something that will hold up on the street as I drive the car often.
noise is an issue too. help me pick! thanks.
if the the new 450s will work (one in tank, one external booster) that would be great as they are cheaper.
need to run 1k at the wheels on e85 set on kill. I have 127 fic bosch injectors, and a bap
would 2 450s do it?
the magnafuel is 450 at least, and maybe it's not the best choice. seems to be popular.
I need something that will hold up on the street as I drive the car often.
noise is an issue too. help me pick! thanks.
04-23-2015, 04:36 PM
#30
Someone else will need to weigh in on that. I am running a single -10 line to a y and then -8 to each rail as per aeromotive. So I have a set up with one filter, but I do have pre and post fuel pressure gauges to keep an eye on the filtering.
04-23-2015, 10:54 PM
#31
Safety Car
I run an intank LPE 255 and a driver inner fenderwell mounted 4303 off a Hobbs switch. Placement of the two pumps y-ing into a -10 feed line to the rails wasnt bad at all, and the 4303 isnt that loud if you use a cushion/insulator base to mount it on compared to the 255.
04-26-2015, 10:32 PM
#32
I think the general consensus with E85 is 10 micron before the injectors.
04-28-2015, 08:48 AM
#33
Tech Contributor
04-28-2015, 07:39 PM
#34
Drifting
Is the RSI/Will you are mentioning the guy that does Vipers? If so be very careful. Lots of bad stuff out there about him not finishing cars that were paid for in advance.
04-29-2015, 02:33 PM
#35
Le Mans Master
80 base and 100 psi under boost and pumps will fall flat
I'd go the other direction
lots of flow, lower base pressure, and PLENTY of pump and injector with flow to spare.
the high pressure solution to crutch an inadequate fuel system is like hiding a brick by throwing it way up in the air!!!
I'd go the other direction
lots of flow, lower base pressure, and PLENTY of pump and injector with flow to spare.
the high pressure solution to crutch an inadequate fuel system is like hiding a brick by throwing it way up in the air!!!
05-01-2015, 01:30 AM
#36
Drifting
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No kidding Will tried ripping me for $900 injectors once. Paid him never got em, heard every excuse why not, they are on their way etc etc., finally had to let CC company handle it and get my money back. Real piece of work he was....
05-01-2015, 08:18 AM
#37
4th Gear
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The Bosch 044 is still the high pressure king, especially with a BAP to it. Those magnafuel pumps are overrated to all ****, they don't work well at high pressure.
Walbro 450 does nose over a ton at 80 psi but it still greatly outflows an LPE pump.
1600 cc injectors are not really an option because they are only good to 5 bar. 2000cc CNG injectors are less than ideal too because they swell when used with E85. That leaves the 127's with high fuel pressure.
Walbro 450 does nose over a ton at 80 psi but it still greatly outflows an LPE pump.
1600 cc injectors are not really an option because they are only good to 5 bar. 2000cc CNG injectors are less than ideal too because they swell when used with E85. That leaves the 127's with high fuel pressure.
Here is why...
As you may or may not know; when you increase fuel pressure you decrease fuel pump flow. When you reduce flow at higher engine speeds; the pump isn't going to keep up and you are going to run the motor lean. Following your advise is a good way to melt a piston in a car that makes big boy power.
05-01-2015, 08:24 AM
#38
ISIS SUCKS FAT CHOAD
Ahhhh the ole finger over the garden hose trick eh? 
It probably don't help matters being that E85 requires a ton more fuel than 91.
Sorry Milan I have to agree with Bret and AC/DC. Set base fuel pressure at 80 psi and he will easily exceede the Max differential pressure of his injectors. No Bueno!!
It probably don't help matters being that E85 requires a ton more fuel than 91.Sorry Milan I have to agree with Bret and AC/DC. Set base fuel pressure at 80 psi and he will easily exceede the Max differential pressure of his injectors. No Bueno!!
Last edited by MVP'S ZO6; 05-01-2015 at 12:31 PM.
05-01-2015, 08:30 AM
#39
Tech Contributor
80 base and 100 psi under boost and pumps will fall flat
I'd go the other direction
lots of flow, lower base pressure, and PLENTY of pump and injector with flow to spare.
the high pressure solution to crutch an inadequate fuel system is like hiding a brick by throwing it way up in the air!!!
I'd go the other direction
lots of flow, lower base pressure, and PLENTY of pump and injector with flow to spare.
the high pressure solution to crutch an inadequate fuel system is like hiding a brick by throwing it way up in the air!!!
Ummm Dude... sorry to be a dick but... NO!!! The aforementioned is not a good idea at all and pretty irresponsible on your part to even recommend something like that. You could do some damage to a person's engine doing stuff like that.
Here is why...
As you may or may not know; when you increase fuel pressure you decrease fuel pump flow. When you reduce flow at higher engine speeds; the pump isn't going to keep up and you are going to run the motor lean. Following your advice is a good way to melt a piston in a car that makes big boy power.
Here is why...
As you may or may not know; when you increase fuel pressure you decrease fuel pump flow. When you reduce flow at higher engine speeds; the pump isn't going to keep up and you are going to run the motor lean. Following your advice is a good way to melt a piston in a car that makes big boy power.
I put a lot of things in my fuel thread and I'm bringing it back, I promise. One thing that people need to know is that all injectors are not alike. My fuel thread is about taking the entire fuel system and treating it as just that, a system. You have to do your homework on your pumps AT PRESSURE and you have to do your homework on your injectors AT PRESSURE. If the OP decided to listen to the irresponsible advice given, he would quickly be wondering why his motor starts acting up at (or around) 7psi boost all the time, maybe doing that until something got hurt.
Do your homework on your injectors and you'll find this:
Maximum Differential Fuel Pressure – 6.0 Bar (87.0 psi)
OP: Now I urge you to design your whole system, taking everything into consideration.
PM me if I can help.
05-01-2015, 09:02 PM
#40
Melting Slicks
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Take a look at my home made deal. I did a lot of calculating to make sure the lines/pumps would support 1500hp without issues, even though I wouldn't be at that level. I wanted plenty of cushion should the need arise.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...el-system.html
Dual 340's, -10 supply, -8 rails, and everything should be e85 compatible. I planned to mount puns side by side, running each their own power/ground with 8-10 gauge wiring.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...el-system.html
Dual 340's, -10 supply, -8 rails, and everything should be e85 compatible. I planned to mount puns side by side, running each their own power/ground with 8-10 gauge wiring.
Last edited by sabastian458; 05-01-2015 at 09:06 PM.