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I didn't see this area or solution covered in any other thread so I guess it's a discovery. I would assume practically all convertibles would suffer from the same problem by now, just like all C5's should have had clogged udder leaks from gunk by now.
If you have your carpets still in, you may not even be aware you have the leaks, other than for the car reeking of mold. For the longest time, I just assumed that old cars have mold issues and it was probably AC related. This considerably dampened my enjoyment of the car and my willingness to spend a lot on upkeep.
Then recently I had to deal with a massive udder related leak flooding the floors during heavy rains. To dry the car and diagnose the leak I took all the carpets out.
After fixing the udders (see all the threads on that), I found that the floor behind the seats STILL got wet after rains. Maybe up to an ounce each side if rain was heavy, but no more
You would not see water if you still had the carpets in there. It is just enough to generate mold and the carpets would soak it up without you noticing.
So long story short I found the culprit:
Just like the udders, it is an area that was engineered to drain water that accumulates in the 'gutter' around the tonneau lid, and when it gets obstructed by gunk, it overflows into the car around the pillar areas behind the driver and passenger seats.
It is hard to describe but you can see it in the pictures (already fixed and 'cleaned' of the sealant and gunk). Put the top down. You can now grab the molded rubber at the end of the weatherstrip around the tonneau and pull it up. It's attached to the frame with a two inch strip of double sided tape that by now probably won't have much grip anyhow. Once you clean around the just revealed area below that molded rubber, you can see now that the lip the weatherstrip is mounted on makes a corner forming a gutter like area. The problem is the lip is very low in that corner, unlike further back, so if you have debris in there, there won't be enough area left to hold the water while it drains onto the outside of the pillar, so it overflows over the lip in that exact corner and between that rubber piece that fits on top of the lip. It would appear the rubber piece helps by sealing and extending the lip upwards (just like the weatherstrip), but that is not the case. It seems the factory putting the car together figured that was just the purpose, so they smeared some of that sealant they use everywhere around it. The fit of the rubber piece completely insufficient to seal that corner, but it isn't needed there because the canvas sits on top of that area. So the purpose of the rubber piece is to seal with the CANVAS top, not the lip. The applied sealant is probably mostly to
blame for the leak, because first of all doesn't seal the rubber against the metal, and second uses up a lot of the very little volume in that dish corner before the water overflows, while attracting debris around it. The fix is to clear out the dish and remove the black sealant that glues the rubber to that corner of the dish with the lip. That's it! (5 minute job). No need to re-glue, there was no need for the sealant there in the first place, the factory people screwed up. The water now can freely drain and never fills up fast enough to spill.
Mine is doing this some were too. I sat in it for awhile when it rain could not find a source anywhere. I need to check this out when I am off this week. It is only on the drivers side for me. With the seat forward around the back bolt it is all wet. I can not find a single drip anywhere.
I didn't see this area or solution covered in any other thread so I guess it's a discovery. I would assume practically all convertibles would suffer from the same problem by now, just like all C5's should have had clogged udder leaks from gunk by now.
If you have your carpets still in, you may not even be aware you have the leaks, other than for the car reeking of mold. For the longest time, I just assumed that old cars have mold issues and it was probably AC related. This considerably dampened my enjoyment of the car and my willingness to spend a lot on upkeep.
Then recently I had to deal with a massive udder related leak flooding the floors during heavy rains. To dry the car and diagnose the leak I took all the carpets out.
After fixing the udders (see all the threads on that), I found that the floor behind the seats STILL got wet after rains. Maybe up to an ounce each side if rain was heavy, but no more
You would not see water if you still had the carpets in there. It is just enough to generate mold and the carpets would soak it up without you noticing.
So long story short I found the culprit:
Just like the udders, it is an area that was engineered to drain water that accumulates in the 'gutter' around the tonneau lid, and when it gets obstructed by gunk, it overflows into the car around the pillar areas behind the driver and passenger seats.
It is hard to describe but you can see it in the pictures (already fixed and 'cleaned' of the sealant and gunk). Put the top down. You can now grab the molded rubber at the end of the weatherstrip around the tonneau and pull it up. It's attached to the frame with a two inch strip of double sided tape that by now probably won't have much grip anyhow. Once you clean around the just revealed area below that molded rubber, you can see now that the lip the weatherstrip is mounted on makes a corner forming a gutter like area. The problem is the lip is very low in that corner, unlike further back, so if you have debris in there, there won't be enough area left to hold the water while it drains onto the outside of the pillar, so it overflows over the lip in that exact corner and between that rubber piece that fits on top of the lip. It would appear the rubber piece helps by sealing and extending the lip upwards (just like the weatherstrip), but that is not the case. It seems the factory putting the car together figured that was just the purpose, so they smeared some of that sealant they use everywhere around it. The fit of the rubber piece completely insufficient to seal that corner, but it isn't needed there because the canvas sits on top of that area. So the purpose of the rubber piece is to seal with the CANVAS top, not the lip. The applied sealant is probably mostly to
blame for the leak, because first of all doesn't seal the rubber against the metal, and second uses up a lot of the very little volume in that dish corner before the water overflows, while attracting debris around it. The fix is to clear out the dish and remove the black sealant that glues the rubber to that corner of the dish with the lip. That's it! (5 minute job). No need to re-glue, there was no need for the sealant there in the first place, the factory people screwed up. The water now can freely drain and never fills up fast enough to spill.
(Btw if you know how to set up corvetteforum to ping my email when there are responses please let me know)
You only have to clean out that corner area and the 'drain' down the column. My drain part was still open so didn't have to mess with it but I assume screwdriver would work. I think I just used my hands, a screwdriver and some shop towels.
I had leaks on both sides. The driver's side still lets in a tiny bit of water to flow to the back of the seat, so I guess you're better off sealing up the area than just relying on the small dish to drain fast enough. I'm going to basically do what the factory did and replace the leaky sealant with new silicone, glueing the 'mucket' rubber to the rail/corner, but only from the outside: if you do it like factory from inside as well it will probably gum up the draining area again.
What did you use to clean it out? Mine is stuck in there good.
i got two huge globs under the body panel that is hard to get to
I'm not sure how it can be hard to get to: the mucket rubber/weatherstrip and rail are sitting on top of the tonneau/pillar. If the drainage area is blocked further down I guess that would be a problem.
I just spent an hour today looking for a leak and found the exact same thing on mine. The po. had stuck a huge amount of electrical putty on the area to seal it, which took a while to scrape off. I found that the tonneau cover seal which had a thin strip of adhesive in the groove had also come unglued halfway around the cover. I just ran a very thin bead of sealer in the bottom of the groove to stick it on again.
Good stuff
I had carpets seat and seat Belt upper connector out of the car
can see the water running down the b pillar to the floor pan
I will check as you described
I did not think it was a weather seal but for the life of me was not sure nor did not think there was another clogged utter or drain
anxious to tear into this again
so this water pass utter is between the b pillar panel and releases the water in front of the rear tires ?
Kind of hard to see from the pics but the tonnel weather strip routes the water around this small lip and out the utter
that what I think you have shown
and yes I do have clumps of s—t possible blocking the water and backing into the b pillar and running inside behind the seat belt cover and into the floor pan
so this water pass utter is between the b pillar panel and releases the water in front of the rear tires ?
Kind of hard to see from the pics but the tonnel weather strip routes the water around this small lip and out the utter
that what I think you have shown
and yes I do have clumps of s—t possible blocking the water and backing into the b pillar and running inside behind the seat belt cover and into the floor pan
sound correct?
Correct but mine also was not fully making contact at that point with the top and the seal. ( the part in picture with hole) It had a good size gap I was able to adjust out
Checking in, as my account has some handicap, I never get notifications, maybe my mail spams.
Update: this is my one contribution to the forum that is valuable as it solves a problem most convertible owners will develop. Not sure how to alert people that they have a leak when they are not aware of it because of its small size.
I want to thank everybody on this forum for the fantastic help that allowed me to keep my vette for this long.
FYI it is better to seal up again where the lip and rubber meet, after removing and cleaning up the old factory gunk. If you don't, during heavy rain you may get a tiny bit of water overflowing between the lip and the rubber. You would never notice though. I did because I have no carpets, by feeling the bottom behind the rear of the seats. The passenger side would just get a little damp. So I sealed it up with marine silicone and now it is as dry as a desert even during torrential rain.
Checking in, as my account has some handicap, I never get notifications, maybe my mail spams.
Update: this is my one contribution to the forum that is valuable as it solves a problem most convertible owners will develop. Not sure how to alert people that they have a leak when they are not aware of it because of its small size.
I want to thank everybody on this forum for the fantastic help that allowed me to keep my vette for this long.
FYI it is better to seal up again where the lip and rubber meet, after removing and cleaning up the old factory gunk. If you don't, during heavy rain you may get a tiny bit of water overflowing between the lip and the rubber. You would never notice though. I did because I have no carpets, by feeling the bottom behind the rear of the seats. The passenger side would just get a little damp. So I sealed it up with marine silicone and now it is as dry as a desert even during torrential rain.
hi,
would you be able to upload pictures and the resealed area, maybe with arrows and numbers....I have some difficulty to understand what is what. That would be great. I will have a look at my car soon, because it will probably see some rain...and it is dry for the moment....
thank you in advance,
TCFS
02-19-2017, 05:59 PM
Convertible invisible (MOLD) water leak fixed
Same here
