SCCA Racer

cross post, also in Performance results, but figured it was applicable here. Mods, if this isn't appropriate please delete.

OK, forgive the n00bness of this question, I have read up a bit, but am still in need of advice (so be gentle).

Looking for estimates and wild *** gueses here, this is what I've got so far:

'99 A4 coupe 3.42 rear, Corsa Indy exhaust, K&N "twin snorkel" intake (soon to be gone), custom tune

306.4 rwhp

stock injectors are running near 100% duty cycle, so they're on the way out in favor of a 42# Ford Racing set.

VaraRam is on the way to replace the old air filter assembly.

What I'm considering, and looking for advice/coments on, and maybe guidance (I'd like to be in the 400+ rwhp range without opening up the bottom end, and the car must be easy to live with as it's driven very regularly - no crazy cam choppy idle). Budget is a big factor as well - I'll give up a few hp here and there if I can save a grand!

Long Tubes - I'm thinking LG Streets (I wanna help Lou keep that GT2 Vette on track), but am I gonna be hurt with these if I go with heads & cam? I have been told they're nice for a bolt-ons motor but H&C really need the LG pros or Kooks. I'd like to keep cats on the car, too. Advice? Will I ge any benefit running a 3" system back to my Corsa Indy exhaust, which I'm pretty sure is a 2.5" pipe over the rear axle?

Cam- recommendations? I've been looking at the LG G5X1....

Heads- I'd love AFR 205's but for a little over half the price should I go with Patriot 243's maybe stage II or so? Street car, very little racing....

Intake - LS6 or FAST 90 w/ LS2 TB? The FAST isn't that much more than the LS6 in the grand scheme of things, but am I gonna be able to get much advantage out of the FAST if I've got stock displacement and mild cam?

I guess what I'm asking, for you guys with experience, if you had a stock LS1 bottom end and a big box with these parts in it to choose from, what kind of hp numbers could you build?

in the imaginary cardboard box:

Patriot stage II CNCed 243 heads
AFR 205's
LS6 intake
LS6 TB
FAST 78 or 90 intake
LS2 TB
LG G5X1 cam
Other cam?
LG streets
LG pro's
Kooks


OK guys, build up your best hp/$ recipe!

Thanks!

9secondflat

you have opened up pandoras box...do a search there have been many topics for builds over the years..

first thing- what is your budget? parts & labor
with out establishing this, your going to blow right through your money

bang for the buck always has been and will be the blue bottle... 600 bucks gets you 150-200 hp. that being said its not for me..

you talk with 100 people, you will get 100 different answers..

AU N EGL

Lots of money

Might be better to purchase a NEW LS6 or LS2 long block then add all those extras. Less expesive to get a create motor then add the bolt ons.

SCCA Racer

I know, I know...

My entire issue is way too broad and could result with hundreds of different combos....

I guess what I'm asking for those who may know and care to share, in an easier yes/no/maybe style:

How much more hp (roughly) will a FAST 92 w/ a LS2 TB make over an LS6 intake and TB on a mildly cammed LS1?

Will LG Streets be restrictive on a engine with a mild cam and heads or are they up to the task, especially with an exhaust bolted to them that is 2.5" into the muffler?

Are AFR 205's worth the extra grand over stage II CNC'ed 243 heads (say Livernois for example) on a mild cam engine that is mostly street driven?

I think those 3 questions are crucial.... right now my thinking is, in order that the air goes through it: VaraRam->LS6 intake & TB->LMS 243 CNC'ed heads, riding top a LG G5X1 cam->LG Streets->existing Corsa Indys.

Good for 400+ at the wheels?

Mark C5

Ls6 intake ported, LS1/6 throttle body polished and ported, 243 stage two heads and LG streets with everything else you've specified should have you at 400 if not a little more. Check my profile, with what I have I'm at 350 rwhp on a very conservative dyno.

bdiddo

Very interested in surveying the opinions that come in. I am in a similar situation.
I put a crate LS6 in a few months ago and to date have only completed the breakdown of the LS1 I yanked out. i am really anxious to get started on the bulid but simply have not fully decided what will be the end use of the engine (i'm leaning towards a street only application).

Bull_in_a_china_shop

AFR's for sure. With all the bot-ons /heads cam and an m6 you should see ?440 rwhp with m6. Thats with a top end cam 231/237. FAST has always been a tough pill to swallow, I'd probably skip that for now, use ls6.

Do you want great mid range power or top end or? You usually need to trade one for the other unless you go to big cubes

AFTRBRNR

The goal is 400 RWHP while maintaining streetability and cost effectiveness. I went with the AFR 205 with G5X3 - streetable but barely!

*The G5X1 with 114 LSA = perfect
*LG Streets are cheaper and will help
*Don't get the FAST 78 (waste of money); get a FAST 92 with LS2 ported TB or just get an LS6 manifold and TB for cost effectiveness.
*Heads will be great. AFR is the best but costs boucup $$.

I would bet that if you are pulling 306 RWHP now: With LS6 manifold, TB, stock heads, LG streets, injectors, G5X1, tune...you'll probably pull about 360-375 RWHP for a cost of about 2500-3000 plus installation.

My recipe for a A4 with 3.73 rear end is in my signature. Total cost of my project after two motor builds plus a new engine was 12,000 est. That took me from 330/330 to 460/419.

If you want a sweet ride with excellent power, and someone who has done this could start fresh...

AFR 205 - 2200
G5X1 114 LSA - 500
LG Pros with Cats - 1500
Callaway Honker intake (scrap that twin cone, this unit is a solid performer) - 500
FAST 92/92 - 1500

Prices are just guesses off the top of my head...

400+ RWHP in a N/A car is awesome but a Vette with 375 would be plenty satisfying.

dixonk

I think if 20 people chime in you are going to get 20 different opinions on this one. 400 is pretty easy to obtain. My setup would be:

ETP 215
GT11 for a smooth quite cam
SLP Underdrive pulley
and a callaway intake

save your money and stay away from the fast 92 and put it towards something else. Just my opinion though.

SCCA Racer

Thanks guys, this is a lot more what I'm looking to hear from people who know.

I'm thinking at this point LS6 intake & TB, G5X1 cam (or similar), Patriot Stage II heads, and LG Streets. I've already scrapped the twin cone filters for a Vararam.

I'm thinking that'll get it at or near 400 to the wheels with a good tune, and if so I'll be grinnin' like a baby in a strip club!

B-Vette

Comp Cam LS1-GT2-3, 207/220 Duration, 0.571"/0.578" Lift and 1.7 Rocker is a solid choice.

I kept my stock cats, cut out the pups and installed Kook Long Tubes. I would up grade the timing chain while your at it and you will also need a good catch can. The set ups suggested by the other posts are good advice.

zeevette

One factor that hasn't been addressed, is your tranny. Having an A4 changes things somewhat, and from what I've read from the AT guys, a stall, and higher gears, like 3.73s give you more SOTP than engine mods. You also have to be a little more cam conservative for streetability issues.

99 vett babycar

see my sig for my modded A4 with 400+ rwhp, 390+ rwlbft.figure $8ooo complete with tune. those ford injectors would be WAY over kill.

SCCA Racer

I went with the ford injectors on the advice of my "tuner" - my stock injectors are running at or near 100% duty cycle at WOT and we've basically gotten all the power out of it we can. They're gonna be a lot more than I'll ever need but at leas I won't have to worry about 'em again!

You're in Pawleys, eh? I'm just north of ya just outside of Myrtle Beach, Conway actually.

SCCA Racer

I plan on doing a 2000 stall but I'll likely keep the 3.42 rear since I'd like to not hurt mileage too much.

I hear ya on the cam... I like to hear a big cam but not live with one. I drive the car 3-4 times a week when I'm not hauling clients around.

B-Vette

If all you want is roughly 400 horsepower (and change), a tranny wouldn't be too high on my priority list. I'd stay focused on the engine now if your on a budget. Then again if you've got money to burn, why **** around with only 400 HP?

SCCA Racer

heehee...if I had $$$ to burn I'd be putting on a maggie and AFR 215's and LG Pros.... and going 400+ cubes.

But I don't...


the 2000 stall was a recommendation based on the thought that I'd like to end up with 400+ at the wheels, and the different converter would make the car respond better. I've talked to many people who have way more hp than that on a stock converter, no problems... and for sure if I do the tq converter at all it will be a later addition....

zeevette

What's a trans upgrade have to do with HP? Two different areas to achieve the same goal of increasing performance.

08 ATOMIC-Z

Check my profile. I have 420 to the wheels with an A4 starting with a LS1. It still drives like a dream and if you nail it you had better be ready. Its my daily driver.

B-Vette

Exactly and his original question stated nothing about a tranny upgrade and also noted that he was on a budget (who here isn't these days ).