[Z06] Should I ever buy a Z06?
08-30-2015, 11:45 PM
#22
Safety Car
Member Since: Feb 2014
Location: Fort Worth Texas
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I would say a fair price without looking at it would be $15-17k depending on what area you are in and how clean it is. Post some pics of it. Also were you located?
08-31-2015, 12:06 AM
#24
Instructor
A well maintained LS6 can go for hundreds of thousands of miles. The Z06 and the LS6 that powers it has a great reputation. They still dominate at the track. That being said, full maintenance history is a plus.
Also, lets say the car goes 200k miles without an issue. Lets say you drive 15k miles a year as a daily driver. In this hypothetical, a car with 50k miles goes 10 years of daily driving with no issues, one with 110K miles goes 6 years without an issue. All things being equal, this a motor vehicle we are talking about, you would get longer use out of one with lower miles, hence the greater cost.
For example, I paid $26,500 for my 2002 Z06 that was in pristine shape with only 8400 miles on it. I drive it maybe 3000 miles a year. At that rate it will have 38,400 miles on it in 10 years. Say I drive it 10,000 miles a year. If I drive it for 10 years at that rate it would still have less miles than the one you are considering.
On a vehicle, anything can be fixed for some cost, except mileage. Now say the 110k mile car you are looking at lasts you 6 years without issue for 15k dollars. That would be a pretty good deal (and lots of fun) if you ask me. Don't let the mileage scare you. Have a Corvette mechanic give it a once over before you buy.
Also, lets say the car goes 200k miles without an issue. Lets say you drive 15k miles a year as a daily driver. In this hypothetical, a car with 50k miles goes 10 years of daily driving with no issues, one with 110K miles goes 6 years without an issue. All things being equal, this a motor vehicle we are talking about, you would get longer use out of one with lower miles, hence the greater cost.
For example, I paid $26,500 for my 2002 Z06 that was in pristine shape with only 8400 miles on it. I drive it maybe 3000 miles a year. At that rate it will have 38,400 miles on it in 10 years. Say I drive it 10,000 miles a year. If I drive it for 10 years at that rate it would still have less miles than the one you are considering.
On a vehicle, anything can be fixed for some cost, except mileage. Now say the 110k mile car you are looking at lasts you 6 years without issue for 15k dollars. That would be a pretty good deal (and lots of fun) if you ask me. Don't let the mileage scare you. Have a Corvette mechanic give it a once over before you buy.
Last edited by Daddie O; 08-31-2015 at 12:09 AM.
08-31-2015, 12:21 AM
#26
Instructor
Yeah my annual mileage on a car is very low. Since April last year, I have put 5k miles on my car. And in a 7 month interval it looks like I put 2k miles on it. I don't know if this means I should get a car with low or higher miles, with a low mileage car it would stay low, but on the other hand a high mileage car wouldn't go up quite that rapidly. In a given week I only drive maybe 2-3 days and generally only around 50-75 miles roundtrip.
Last edited by Daddie O; 08-31-2015 at 12:23 AM.
08-31-2015, 01:05 AM
#28
Instructor
I drove a 2001 Camaro SS not long before it that had 117k miles or so and while it was in fine shape it just didn't do it for me. It didn't feel fast so much as it was just kind of rough, I could feel the engine vibrating as I'm going down the road, it's a bit bouncy, just not that nice. Getting back in my Altima it was so different, I'm sure some people love that connected feeling but I didn't like it at all and liked the isolation and smoothness of my Altima. Every Camaro I have seen has a quiver in the engine, if you hold the door open and just put your hand on it or look at it you can see every so often it shakes a little and I never liked that. I drove the C5 though, and it was smooth, didn't feel bouncy, it seemed all around very nice.
I'm gonna revise my earlier statement, and say you probably wont like a Z06. It is the opposite of feeling isolation, you feel very connected to the car and the road. The suspension is stiff, so it will be much rougher of a ride than the Altima. If you dislike feeling the rumble of a motor, a Z06 is not for you. The Z06 is Corvette's race-ready package, it's basically a street legal race car. Ever heard of a race car driver that didn't want to feel connected to his car, or disliked the feeling the engine rumble?
Last edited by Daddie O; 08-31-2015 at 01:12 AM.
08-31-2015, 01:38 AM
#29
Melting Slicks
So after many years of wanting a Z06, specifically a C5 Z06 I actually found one. A 2003, black, with 110k miles. A two owner car. No mechanical issues per the seller. I was going to look at it, drive it, but I asked some others on another forum about if it was a good deal at $15k. I didn't expect the responses I got, that 110k miles is too much and that it is going to need thousands of dollars in work in short order. That basically I'd have spent $20k on it, so I should just spend that up front on one with low mileage.
.
.
Why?
1. Tires (unless they have recently been replaced).
2. Shocks (again unless they have recently been replaced).
3. Plugs and wires (unless they have recently been replaced).
4. Total fluid flush (unless they have all been replaced recently ).
5. Brake pads (unless they have recently been replaced).
6. Wheel bearings (unless they have recently been replaced)
7. Control arm bushings, other suspension bushings (unless they have recently been replaced).
8. Window seals, trunk seals (may be OK, but that many miles usually indicates daily driver and weather along with age and miles( may not need it, but would check).
9. Window actuators, HVAC actuators, HVAC head unit (unless already replaced).
10. AC controls (Dyer, compressor, etc).
11. Miscellaneous items.
12. Clutch, Pressure plate, etc (unless it has been replaced).
13. Seat Covers and other interior items.
14. Tie rods ends.
15. Air Dam, flush and boil out radiator
16. Water pump
17. Fuel Pump
18, All filters
19, Seals (wheel bearing seals, valve cover seals, etc.)
Of course any used car could need any or all of the items. However, less likely with a lower mileage car. I think that is what people have been trying to tell you. If you are going to spend somewhere around 20K, why not get a 50K car, which is are usually going to be in better shape?
What I did not say is that the engine, transmission, differential, body, etc. is going to go bad. Everything I outlined is normal wear and tear that occurs once a car reaches a certain age and certain mileage. Not just applicable to a Corvette. but ANY car or truck. The largest problem with the Corvettes are electrical, not mechanical. The Corvette is a SPORTS CAR, so everything cost more than your standard coupes or sedans.
The LS-1 and LS-6 engines are pretty well bullet proof if well maintained. 200K plus is certainly possible if you are not taking it to the track and keep up with all required maintenance.
Of course a 110K car that is immaculately maintained could be as good or better than a 50K car. All depends on some of the items I outlined above, plus maintenance records. If you check everything on this list, plus look for any outstanding codes, do a compression test on the engine, and have a mechanic put it up on a lift and check trans, differential, and bushings, control arms, shocks, etc. and they all look good or looked like they have been replaced recently, could be a good deal.
The rule of thumb is always get a lower mileage car when possible. But it all depends on who owned the car and how they took care of it.
Personally, I would not pay 15.5 K for a 110,000 miles car, but that's me.
Finally, just because people are telling you to spend a couple of grand more for a lower mileage Corvette Z06 than a high mileage one does not mean there is anything inherently weak on these cars.
Corvettes are not Mini Vans, Hondas, Nissans, Impalas, Malibus, Camaros, Mustangs, etc. Finding an 10-14 year old car as previously mentioned, with less than 100K would not be common. However, finding Corvettes and Z06s with less than 60K is common. Most people do not use their Z06 as a daily driver. They are weekend cars and the mileage confirms it. There are many out there with less than 60K miles and thus more available in this mileage range. Good for the buyers out there.
Best of luck to you. Don't try to compare Corvettes and especially Z06s to other passenger cars. That's not what they are or how they are usually used. That has nothing to do with their reliability, but rather their market and use. Corvettes have a reputation of being one of the most reliable true sports cars on the planet.
Last edited by bikeriderga; 08-31-2015 at 01:56 AM.
08-31-2015, 07:43 AM
#32
I agree with Daddie O. If you want a car that is even relatively quiet with a smooth ride, you do NOT want a Z. I just traded a Cadillac CTS Coupe in on a 2004 Z and they couldn't be more different. The Z is loud and brash, but the ride is surprisingly not much worse than the caddy. But with the CTS I was isolated in comfort and with many creature comforts. With the corvette I am aware of everything going on with the car and the experience. I absolutely love it. Not so sure you will.
Shakey
Shakey
08-31-2015, 07:49 AM
#33
Drifting
"I also saw many things about how the LS1s and LS6s were not that good, and that one should try and get an LS2 instead rather than getting any of those engines. Even in the CTS-V it's the same, don't get the LS6 - get the LS2."
Clearly coming from people who have no clue what they are talking about. The LS6 is one of the most bulletproof engines GM ever made in a Corvette. I would argue it's a better motor than the LS7 and LT4. Although they make less power they are far less problematic.
Clearly coming from people who have no clue what they are talking about. The LS6 is one of the most bulletproof engines GM ever made in a Corvette. I would argue it's a better motor than the LS7 and LT4. Although they make less power they are far less problematic.
08-31-2015, 09:56 AM
#35
You cannot IMHO compare a Camaro with a Vette. The chassis are night and day. The Camaro is a flexible flyer compared to the vette chassis design.
The camaro is a price-point car with an interior to match.....just cheap.
You really need to go drive a Z06 and compare. The Z06 is a drivers car that can be raced.
It has a Nurburgring tuned chassis/suspension that is still very good by today's standard.
LS6 is the pinnacle of the push-rod small block. 04 had the springs upgraded and is as solid as a chevy small-block can be.
LS6 is not the same as LS1.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_small-block_engine
The LS6 shares its basic block architecture with the GM LS1 engine, but other changes were made to the design such as windows cast into the block between cylinders, improved main web strength and bay to bay breathing, an intake manifold and MAF-sensor with higher flow, a camshaft with higher lift and more duration, a higher compression ratio of 10.5:1, sodium filled valves, and a revised oiling system better suited to high lateral acceleration.[8] LS6 intake manifolds were also used on all 2001+ LS1/6 engines. The casting number, located on the top rear edge of the block, is 12561168. Applications:
2001-2004 Corvette Z06
2004–2005 Cadillac CTS V-Series
2007 SSC Ultimate Aero TT
The camaro is a price-point car with an interior to match.....just cheap.
You really need to go drive a Z06 and compare. The Z06 is a drivers car that can be raced.
It has a Nurburgring tuned chassis/suspension that is still very good by today's standard.
LS6 is the pinnacle of the push-rod small block. 04 had the springs upgraded and is as solid as a chevy small-block can be.
LS6 is not the same as LS1.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_small-block_engine
The LS6 shares its basic block architecture with the GM LS1 engine, but other changes were made to the design such as windows cast into the block between cylinders, improved main web strength and bay to bay breathing, an intake manifold and MAF-sensor with higher flow, a camshaft with higher lift and more duration, a higher compression ratio of 10.5:1, sodium filled valves, and a revised oiling system better suited to high lateral acceleration.[8] LS6 intake manifolds were also used on all 2001+ LS1/6 engines. The casting number, located on the top rear edge of the block, is 12561168. Applications:
2001-2004 Corvette Z06
2004–2005 Cadillac CTS V-Series
2007 SSC Ultimate Aero TT
08-31-2015, 10:21 AM
#36
Instructor
I'm not sure if you want us to talk you out of it, or want us to talk you into it, but you need to make a decision of your own eventually.
I have owned 2x c5 z06's and 1x c6 z06. I actually sold my C6z to go back to a C5z.
If you have always wanted the car then go for it, buy the car that you have always wanted, just dont over pay for what you are getting and make sure it's never been in an accident and you will be fine.
If you dont like the car, guess what? you can sell it.
STOP worrying about what a bunch of internet commandos are saying about LS6 vs LS2, of course most people will say you should buy a regular C6 cause it has the NEW this and the NEW that, doesnt mean it's better or most importantly, what YOU want.
STOP worrying about the way it will drive and whether you will like it, go find one and drive it before you buy it, simple fix. We cannot put into words exactly how the car drives or feels and it feels and drives different to each and every one of us.
STOP worrying about a sub 5 second 0-60. This car with mild mods can crush 1/4 mile times, autocross events, and its a SUB 8:00 min nurburgring car.
The C5 Z06 is a PROVEN performer time and time again, the only reason people are telling you to stay away from 100+K cars are because there are so many out there with less miles, most people are always scared of high miles.
I just turned over 79k miles on my 850 rwhp C5 z06 with the stock trans, stock rear end, and stock half shafts 23K of that has been at its current power level.
If you throw Heads/Cam/Intake on a C5 Z06 with about 410-450 rwhp it will more than likely far outlast you as the driver. These motors only begin to fail when people get more and more power hungry and start putting forced induction on them, upping the compression to crazy amounts etc etc, the LS6/LS1 as well as the LS2/LS3 are about as bulletproof as they come for N/A setups.
Bottom line, if you do your due dilligence in checking the car over and you want it, buy it.
And ask yourself this:
Later on in life will I ever regret not owning at C5 z06?
By the way, I have daily driven all 3 of my z06's and wouldnt have ever done it different.
Cars are meant to driven.
Nobody on this forum can decide for you, and we can only tell you so many times that the C5 z06 is THE most solid performer of it's time in its class and is a PROVEN performance car.
I have owned 2x c5 z06's and 1x c6 z06. I actually sold my C6z to go back to a C5z.
If you have always wanted the car then go for it, buy the car that you have always wanted, just dont over pay for what you are getting and make sure it's never been in an accident and you will be fine.
If you dont like the car, guess what? you can sell it.
STOP worrying about what a bunch of internet commandos are saying about LS6 vs LS2, of course most people will say you should buy a regular C6 cause it has the NEW this and the NEW that, doesnt mean it's better or most importantly, what YOU want.
STOP worrying about the way it will drive and whether you will like it, go find one and drive it before you buy it, simple fix. We cannot put into words exactly how the car drives or feels and it feels and drives different to each and every one of us.
STOP worrying about a sub 5 second 0-60. This car with mild mods can crush 1/4 mile times, autocross events, and its a SUB 8:00 min nurburgring car.
The C5 Z06 is a PROVEN performer time and time again, the only reason people are telling you to stay away from 100+K cars are because there are so many out there with less miles, most people are always scared of high miles.
I just turned over 79k miles on my 850 rwhp C5 z06 with the stock trans, stock rear end, and stock half shafts 23K of that has been at its current power level.
If you throw Heads/Cam/Intake on a C5 Z06 with about 410-450 rwhp it will more than likely far outlast you as the driver. These motors only begin to fail when people get more and more power hungry and start putting forced induction on them, upping the compression to crazy amounts etc etc, the LS6/LS1 as well as the LS2/LS3 are about as bulletproof as they come for N/A setups.
Bottom line, if you do your due dilligence in checking the car over and you want it, buy it.
And ask yourself this:
Later on in life will I ever regret not owning at C5 z06?
By the way, I have daily driven all 3 of my z06's and wouldnt have ever done it different.
Cars are meant to driven.
Nobody on this forum can decide for you, and we can only tell you so many times that the C5 z06 is THE most solid performer of it's time in its class and is a PROVEN performance car.
08-31-2015, 10:37 AM
#37
Moderator
I just picked up an 04 Z in July. 66k miles and very clean. $21k. I say get it. I have wanted one all my life and this thing is a total blast. Way better than I could have imagined. You may want to up your budget to get lower miles. 20k buys a lot. There was a silver 04 Z going for $18k recently. Like 60 k miles. What a deal. It might still be for sale.
08-31-2015, 11:08 AM
#39
Let me tell you my Z06 purchase story and maybe that will help you out.
I bought my 2002 Z06 in 2012. It had 84K miles and already had LG LT headers, Xpipe but stock axleback and vararam intake. It was a two owner car at the time and everything seemed to be in good shape, so I immediately put it to the test. Started doing autox on a regular basis. First major issue (around 98K miles) I had was one of the lifters going bad, which ended up damaging the cam.
I ended up replacing the cam for a larger one and sent out the heads to TEA for porting. But unfortunately the extra power was to much for the stock clutch and after a couple of months, the clutch slipping led to damaging the trans, so now I need to take care of that.
IMO these cars are good, but it depends alot on how they are used and how they are maintained. Also they arn't very expensive to work on as long as you do the work yourself, which for you would be facilitated if you have a second car as I do. Right now my Z06 is sitting on 103k miles and I still run autox and HPDE with it and it runs strong for the most part. You can't hold the trans against it since that is mostly my fault for not upgrading the clutch.
If you have any question on LS1/LS6 reliability, my daily is a 98 Z28 that I have had through college and up until now. Back when that was my only car, I still raced it on a weekly basis. That car has 180K miles and is still running strong with over 350rwhp with just boltons.
as others said, change the valvesprings on it, which isnt hard at all with the right tools, and shouldn't be expensive if you take it to someone. Also, depending on what you want out of the car, I personally wouldn't do the cam if you dont need to. My stock one was damaged with the bad lifter, but I wouldn't do it again.
I bought my 2002 Z06 in 2012. It had 84K miles and already had LG LT headers, Xpipe but stock axleback and vararam intake. It was a two owner car at the time and everything seemed to be in good shape, so I immediately put it to the test. Started doing autox on a regular basis. First major issue (around 98K miles) I had was one of the lifters going bad, which ended up damaging the cam.
I ended up replacing the cam for a larger one and sent out the heads to TEA for porting. But unfortunately the extra power was to much for the stock clutch and after a couple of months, the clutch slipping led to damaging the trans, so now I need to take care of that.
IMO these cars are good, but it depends alot on how they are used and how they are maintained. Also they arn't very expensive to work on as long as you do the work yourself, which for you would be facilitated if you have a second car as I do. Right now my Z06 is sitting on 103k miles and I still run autox and HPDE with it and it runs strong for the most part. You can't hold the trans against it since that is mostly my fault for not upgrading the clutch.
If you have any question on LS1/LS6 reliability, my daily is a 98 Z28 that I have had through college and up until now. Back when that was my only car, I still raced it on a weekly basis. That car has 180K miles and is still running strong with over 350rwhp with just boltons.
as others said, change the valvesprings on it, which isnt hard at all with the right tools, and shouldn't be expensive if you take it to someone. Also, depending on what you want out of the car, I personally wouldn't do the cam if you dont need to. My stock one was damaged with the bad lifter, but I wouldn't do it again.