JmpnJckFlsh

I want to pass along something I learned today that may be helpful to those having wide body conversions, spoilers and other trim painted.

If your painter plans to use PPG, rather than the brand used at the factory (DuPont), PPG has documented all the different variations that occured on factory paint colors. Yes, I'm afraid it's true...the color code on your glove box door label is only a starting point. As I thumbed through the variation chips, I spotted four or five different variation chips for "Red Jewel Tintcoat", aka Monterey Red.

PPG dealers will have several sets of "variation" chips for all the auto manufacturer's paint colors...if the primary chip they show you for the color code doesn't look very close to your paint, you should try the variations. These variation chips are about 1.5" X 3" with a hole in the center of the chip...you place the variation chip over your paint, and compare the chip color with what you see in the hole.

I'm preparing to paint side moldings for a car that has a paint code of U929L (Malibu, not a Vette). I drove the car down to the PPG paint store, and the primary color chip appeared darker than the paint on the car. I then compared the "variation chips" to the car's paint...a couple were darker than the car, one was lighter, and another dead nuts on.

If you are using DuPont paint, then I think the supplier's relationship to the OEM has permitted them to handle this variation problem through the VIN number. I suspect other paint manufacturers will handle this problem like PPG does, or you will have to accept a compromise color match.

AORoads

interesting stuff! thanks!~

Marc V.

Thanks Hopefully a good paint shop will already know this.

SinisterC6

take your gas cap cover and use it as a demo

nwc6

I assume this means the vendors selling pre-painted door handles, spoilers, and wide body kits have just a hit or miss chance on really matching color.

JmpnJckFlsh

Mmmmm...I have thought about this since I first learned about the variations, and in my opinion, yes, it's hit or miss for a PERFECT match. Vendors surely paint everything to the primary color mix.

Keep in mind, we're talking very small differences in color. On small trim parts, it'll take a very discriminating person to see and/or complain about the variation. However, on large areas like a pre-painted wide body kit, I wouldn't assume that the color will be a perfect match, and with the larger area, it will easier for the eye to pick up the difference.

Also remember that GM has parts supplied by outside suppliers already painted ...generally the match is pretty close, and I don't know how they manage variation. I doubt they try to coordinate the assembly plant's paint variant with the supplier's paint for perfect match.

NORTY

Are the different shades of the same color attributed to fading?

JmpnJckFlsh

Before, I always thought this was the most accurate method for getting your paint to match. Actually, the technician told me, that for relatively new paint, you are better off starting with the paint color code and then using the variation chips for an exact match. He said the portable spectrographic unit they use really only finds the closest match in PPG's data base, rather than providing a custom mix to exactly match the color.

I had a good a demonstration of this fact on an older car I doing some repair painting on...the original color was called Antique Rose Metallic, which was kind of a pinkish, bluish silver. I took the gas door in, and he read the color and mixed up what the computer told him...the name was not even close to the original paint name. The mixed paint was called Platinum Metallic, but it was a VERY close match right down to the metal flake size.

JmpnJckFlsh

On new factory paint, No...there can be slight variations from one color batch to the next. My PPG technician said it was because a guy at the original paint supplier's factory decided it "needed it a little more xxxxx".

I guess that could be true, but I'm a little skeptical. You would think in an age of our technology, that mixing a batch of paint for exact color would be more sophisticated than cooking a stew or brewing a vat of beer, but it does explain the variations.

talon90

Excellent thread.

Bulitt

What Dupont product is used OEM (number?) is it water based or solvent? thanks

Swiftrider08

First, to answer another question I just saw, the paint used at the Corvette plant is solventbased. Waterbourne is not being used ... yet!

Regarding batches of paint, you have to keep in mind that what is delivered to the plant comes in anywhere from 100 to 500 gallon tanks. There is a bit more involved than mixing up a couple gallons at your local paint or autoparts store. Many colors are used at other plants also, so often just a premixed starting point is actually what is in the tank and final tinting of the color is done right in the plant by the paint manufactures. The paint manufactures have their guys in all the automotive plants everyday, all day. I have seen these guys play with tinting all day long trying to get the color just right. I have also seen them throw out a whole batch and start over. Big money! Figuring in also that the paint is being applied with electrostatics, various solvents are added to get the paint into a good resistivity range so that it will accept high voltage. The factory paint being a baked on finish also adds into what solvent mix is added to the paint. Aftermarket paints are usually setup to allow for air drying. All these different solvents do effect color. I have said this before, but what the factory applies and what you can buy over the counter are two totally different animals. The paint companies do a really good job of getting the colors of these different paints close, but the real magic resides with the aftermarket painter in getting the perfect match.

JmpnJckFlsh

As swiftrider08 said, the factory paint can not be bought in the aftermarket...what you buy at your DuPont dealer is a totally different composition than what was applied at BG. However...that only applies to chemical composition, not to color; the color, in whatever product you chose should match, and your DuPont dealer should ask your VIN number to help in that process.

DuPont's premium aftermarket BC/CC is the Chroma system...that's what I would use on a C6 Corvette. If you're painting an old junker, Nason will give you good value, but I doubt it will last as long as the Chroma.

joliett

But what about the TINTCOAT? The definition of tintcoat is not clearcoat.

So if tintcoat car needs paintwork, and it can be matched with a color (or variation) and clear coat, why didnt GM just paint it with the color they wanted and then just clearcoat it - instead of painting it and then appling a tint coat?

AORoads

I just saw this phrase (maybe again), and this should be a whole new thread by itself so that all the people who get panels, fenders, or whole cars painted understand painting. The bold and especially the underlined words are so accurate and really need to be understood by all.

JmpnJckFlsh

Tintcoat IS clearcoat, but it is a tinted clear..."clear" means transparent to light; it does not mean colorless as frequently used.

Transparent color is added to the factory clear to eliminate one step in the painting process. Factory paint operations do in two steps, what takes three steps in the aftermarket. Aftermarket tintcoat colors have a base coat (sometimes metallic; sometimes not), a transparent midcoat, and a colorless clear coat. Don't ask me why they don't tint clear in the aftermarket...I have no idea, unless they believe it would make a greater chance of color mismatch in the field.

Since the tintcoat is a transparent color that is different from the basecoat, you get different appearance effects with changes in light intensity and angle that are not possible with a single metallic base coat that is clearcoated. In some colors, however, the change in appearance made by a tintcoat is hardly discernable and is of questionable value...Wasn't it Atomic Orange that was introduced as a tintcoat color, then went to simple metallic BC/CC, and then back to tintcoat?

talon90

with everything except the last sentence. AO was a tintcoat, it is now a conventional BC/CC. It has not gone back to tintcoat and likely won't. There was new information out lately that some of the cars in the beginning of the '08 model year were assembled using tintcoat panels, probably to exhaust inventory of paint/painted panels. The switch has now been made to BC/CC completely.

joec

Even JSB?? I thought that had the tint coat??

AORoads

I'm pretty sure JSB is a tintcoat, one of three.

Sherman Fretwell

This thread is why I asked the body shop if they could match my MR rear fascia after a fender bender. There are many variables such as matching the tint, the primer, the clear, the thickness of the paint, etc. I was left with the choice of the imprint of a screw head (license plate frame) or repaint. This is a good shop but they were not sure they could get it right. I did not want the rear of the car a different hue of MR and did not want to go through four or five attempts to match the color. The buff out worked. Thanks for posting this information.