Replace Clutch Fluid - Modified Ranger Method
06-07-2012, 02:41 PM
#41
Racer
Member Since: Aug 2011
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Considering that the black material is dust from clutch wear and has worked its way up from the slave cylinder, what we see in the reservoir is just the tip of the iceberg. The real nasty stuff is between the slave and master cylinders. Unfortunately, it's not easy to flush that fluid without buying and extender for the bleeder valve.
... And the extenders have been known to leak.
... And the extenders have been known to leak.
06-15-2012, 10:51 AM
#44
Drifting
Member Since: Nov 2009
Location: Murrells Inlet, SC (formally New Windsor, NY)
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I've used the "Ranger" method for the past few years with great success. I'm going to try this updated method on my next change and see how much chit comes out. Kudos to the OP on his innovative thinking. 
This should be a sticky, attached to Ranger's.
This should be a sticky, attached to Ranger's.
06-15-2012, 10:55 AM
#45
Drifting
Member Since: Jan 2010
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Well maybe not 100% since some of it is from the seals but MOST of it is clutch material.
Here is a good read...
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-t...ur-clutch.html
Here is a good read...
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-t...ur-clutch.html
06-15-2012, 11:22 AM
#46
Racer
Here is my latest design that seems to work best for me. I replaced the needles with some tubing as it allows for better flow.
These are 60CC Syringes.
The one on the left is used to remove (suck out) bad material from the clutch reservoir. I stuck a small piece of small engine gas line into it to extend the end.
The one on the right is used to inject new fluid. I found access to some tubing that has connections that screw directly into the syringe. The short piece I use to extract good fluid from the Dot 4 Brake fluid container. Once I fill the syringe with new fluid, I change tubes to the black tube. I invert the syringe and pump material to remove air. I insert the long black tube down into the reservoir feed tube at the bottom of the clutch reservoir (small hole at the bottom). Once I insert it all the way in, I inject the good material in, it then pushes the bad fluid up into the reservoir, thus cleaning out the fluid line. I then remove the material from the reservoir, and refill with good fluid. If you can't find the tubing that screws into the syringe (medical supply), then you can try the small engine gas line.
Again, the intent is to remove as much as possible all of the clutch fluid. This basically eliminates the pumping one needs to do with Rangers original method, and for me, does a better job of changing out the fluid. The only way to better change the fluid is to have the system bled.
Steps:
1) Use syringe to suck out fluid from reservoir (just like the ranger method)
2) Fill second syringe with new fluid.
3) Install long black tube on syringe that is filled with new fluid.
4) Invert syringe and squeeze some fluid out to purge out air from the black tubing (just like the nurse before she/he jabs ya).
5) Insert long black tube down the hole located in the bottom of the reservoir
6) Inject new fluid into clutch fluid feedline. Old fluid gets pumped up into reservior.
7) Pull out the syringe and black tube.
8) Use the removal syringe to suck the bad fluid from reservoir that used to be down in the feedline.
9) Fill reservoir with fresh fluid to fill mark.
10) Clean-up
06-15-2012, 12:46 PM
#47
CF Senior Member
Member Since: Feb 2006
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I'm no expert but it seems to me, however beneficial your method may be it might not be a replacement for the 'Ranger Method' and pumping the clutch pedal is still beneficial. Pressing the clutch pedal forces a pushrod/plunger down the bore of the master cylinder forcing a seal to close (to the reservoir) and forcing fluid through the line to the actuator cylinder pushing a piston in the actuator cylinder out forcing the release bearing to disengage the pressure plate. As the clutch pedal is released the plunger moves back, fluid returns to the master cylinder and finally opens the port to the reservoir, etc.
Granted, it may take multiple 'purge/pump/fill' cycles but it seems to me pumping the pedal insures a more thorough circulation of fluid throughout the entire system, seals are opened and closed and the cleansing of the fluid might be more complete. I like what you did but personally, I would not let it be a total substitute for the Ranger pump-pedal procedure. Thanks for sharing for modified Ranger method!
I never understood why GM didn't design and make the bleed valve a little easier to get to. Having to remove the catalytic converter and the tunnel close-out plate makes what should be a simple procedure much more complicated. I know a couple Corvette racers who 'extended' the bleed valve for easier access. To the best of my knowledge it works well....no leaks.
Granted, it may take multiple 'purge/pump/fill' cycles but it seems to me pumping the pedal insures a more thorough circulation of fluid throughout the entire system, seals are opened and closed and the cleansing of the fluid might be more complete. I like what you did but personally, I would not let it be a total substitute for the Ranger pump-pedal procedure. Thanks for sharing for modified Ranger method!
Considering that the black material is dust from clutch wear and has worked its way up from the slave cylinder, what we see in the reservoir is just the tip of the iceberg. The real nasty stuff is between the slave and master cylinders. Unfortunately, it's not easy to flush that fluid without buying and extender for the bleeder valve.
... And the extenders have been known to leak.
... And the extenders have been known to leak.
08-05-2012, 09:08 PM
#48
Melting Slicks
I used this method today to change the clutch fluid in my 2011 GS, 5300 miles. Fluid was very dirty, even had stuff floating in it. Never raced or anything like that. Everything went as planned, no problems at all. Very easy to do. I did it four times. Did not get any cleaner after the third time. I think it took maybe 30 minutes from start to clean up. Thanks for the info tjl5709.
08-06-2012, 04:51 PM
#51
Pro
Thread Starter
I'm glad to help contribute. I've gotten allot of info from this forum, and it's always good to give back.
I went back and read all the replies, and the bottom line for me was since the clutch system is dead headed, the original ranger method can do only so much. I am not knocking that method. When I started having problems shifting, I found his posts. It corrected my issues, but as I did it, I figured there had to be a way to make it more efficient.
Short of doing a real purge by opening the slave drain, this will get almost all the junk out of the system.
As I described, you fill the syringe with dot4 using a short length tube, then you install the long tube. Invert the syringe (just like a doctor/nurse) and purge the tube to get the air out. Then you insert the tube into the reservoir hole (remove fluid from reservoir first) and as your inserting down the tube, apply alittle pressure to start injecting the new fluid. Once you have it all the way down, inject the full syringe. It drives all the contaminated fluid down by the slave up the feed tube and back into the reservoir. Suck that stuff out as well.
PM me with comments or concerns. Always willing to help.
I went back and read all the replies, and the bottom line for me was since the clutch system is dead headed, the original ranger method can do only so much. I am not knocking that method. When I started having problems shifting, I found his posts. It corrected my issues, but as I did it, I figured there had to be a way to make it more efficient.
Short of doing a real purge by opening the slave drain, this will get almost all the junk out of the system.
As I described, you fill the syringe with dot4 using a short length tube, then you install the long tube. Invert the syringe (just like a doctor/nurse) and purge the tube to get the air out. Then you insert the tube into the reservoir hole (remove fluid from reservoir first) and as your inserting down the tube, apply alittle pressure to start injecting the new fluid. Once you have it all the way down, inject the full syringe. It drives all the contaminated fluid down by the slave up the feed tube and back into the reservoir. Suck that stuff out as well.
PM me with comments or concerns. Always willing to help.
08-06-2012, 07:23 PM
#56
Drifting
I copied your method too & it worked great. Picked up a big horse syringe & 3' of super thin tubing from Farm Supply..pushed the tubing & new fuild down into the bottom of the line & ejected it out...worked great & many thanks again!
I'm glad to help contribute. I've gotten allot of info from this forum, and it's always good to give back.
I went back and read all the replies, and the bottom line for me was since the clutch system is dead headed, the original ranger method can do only so much. I am not knocking that method. When I started having problems shifting, I found his posts. It corrected my issues, but as I did it, I figured there had to be a way to make it more efficient.
Short of doing a real purge by opening the slave drain, this will get almost all the junk out of the system.
As I described, you fill the syringe with dot4 using a short length tube, then you install the long tube. Invert the syringe (just like a doctor/nurse) and purge the tube to get the air out. Then you insert the tube into the reservoir hole (remove fluid from reservoir first) and as your inserting down the tube, apply alittle pressure to start injecting the new fluid. Once you have it all the way down, inject the full syringe. It drives all the contaminated fluid down by the slave up the feed tube and back into the reservoir. Suck that stuff out as well.
PM me with comments or concerns. Always willing to help.
I went back and read all the replies, and the bottom line for me was since the clutch system is dead headed, the original ranger method can do only so much. I am not knocking that method. When I started having problems shifting, I found his posts. It corrected my issues, but as I did it, I figured there had to be a way to make it more efficient.
Short of doing a real purge by opening the slave drain, this will get almost all the junk out of the system.
As I described, you fill the syringe with dot4 using a short length tube, then you install the long tube. Invert the syringe (just like a doctor/nurse) and purge the tube to get the air out. Then you insert the tube into the reservoir hole (remove fluid from reservoir first) and as your inserting down the tube, apply alittle pressure to start injecting the new fluid. Once you have it all the way down, inject the full syringe. It drives all the contaminated fluid down by the slave up the feed tube and back into the reservoir. Suck that stuff out as well.
PM me with comments or concerns. Always willing to help.
08-07-2012, 11:58 AM
#57
Pro
Thread Starter
[QUOTE=Wayne O;1581079200]I'm no expert but it seems to me, however beneficial your method may be it might not be a replacement for the 'Ranger Method' and pumping the clutch pedal is still beneficial. Pressing the clutch pedal forces a pushrod/plunger down the bore of the master cylinder forcing a seal to close (to the reservoir) and forcing fluid through the line to the actuator cylinder pushing a piston in the actuator cylinder out forcing the release bearing to disengage the pressure plate. As the clutch pedal is released the plunger moves back, fluid returns to the master cylinder and finally opens the port to the reservoir, etc.
Granted, it may take multiple 'purge/pump/fill' cycles but it seems to me pumping the pedal insures a more thorough circulation of fluid throughout the entire system, seals are opened and closed and the cleansing of the fluid might be more complete. I like what you did but personally, I would not let it be a total substitute for the Ranger pump-pedal procedure. Thanks for sharing for modified Ranger method! [Quote]
As the system is dead headed, there is no cycling of fluid from the reservoir to the cylinders. In essence, the fluid just travels back and forth in the tube. You get some mixing of good and bad in the feed tube, but no matter how much pumping you do, bad fluid remains down by the slave.
When I first did this procedure after having done the original method previously, I could not believe the amount of "bad" fluid left down in the feed tube by the slave that I pushed up and out. By injecting fluid with this method, you are creating a simple closed loop.
I now include pumping the pedal when swapping out fluid as well. Inject, pump, inject.
I know my system is cleaner with this modification over the original, and and because of this, it does not need to be done as often.
Granted, it may take multiple 'purge/pump/fill' cycles but it seems to me pumping the pedal insures a more thorough circulation of fluid throughout the entire system, seals are opened and closed and the cleansing of the fluid might be more complete. I like what you did but personally, I would not let it be a total substitute for the Ranger pump-pedal procedure. Thanks for sharing for modified Ranger method!
[Quote]As the system is dead headed, there is no cycling of fluid from the reservoir to the cylinders. In essence, the fluid just travels back and forth in the tube. You get some mixing of good and bad in the feed tube, but no matter how much pumping you do, bad fluid remains down by the slave.
When I first did this procedure after having done the original method previously, I could not believe the amount of "bad" fluid left down in the feed tube by the slave that I pushed up and out. By injecting fluid with this method, you are creating a simple closed loop.
I now include pumping the pedal when swapping out fluid as well. Inject, pump, inject.
I know my system is cleaner with this modification over the original, and and because of this, it does not need to be done as often.
08-07-2012, 01:00 PM
#58
Drifting
Question; Instead of cycling the clutch 30 times in the garage, prior to doing the ranger method, what about simply driving & using the clutch (probably 50+ clutch/shifts during a 30 minute local drive) prior to cycling out the clutch fluid via ranger method? Viable or no?
[QUOTE=tjl5709;1581508807][QUOTE=Wayne O;1581079200]I'm no expert but it seems to me, however beneficial your method may be it might not be a replacement for the 'Ranger Method' and pumping the clutch pedal is still beneficial. Pressing the clutch pedal forces a pushrod/plunger down the bore of the master cylinder forcing a seal to close (to the reservoir) and forcing fluid through the line to the actuator cylinder pushing a piston in the actuator cylinder out forcing the release bearing to disengage the pressure plate. As the clutch pedal is released the plunger moves back, fluid returns to the master cylinder and finally opens the port to the reservoir, etc.
Granted, it may take multiple 'purge/pump/fill' cycles but it seems to me pumping the pedal insures a more thorough circulation of fluid throughout the entire system, seals are opened and closed and the cleansing of the fluid might be more complete. I like what you did but personally, I would not let it be a total substitute for the Ranger pump-pedal procedure. Thanks for sharing for modified Ranger method!
As the system is dead headed, there is no cycling of fluid from the reservoir to the cylinders. In essence, the fluid just travels back and forth in the tube. You get some mixing of good and bad in the feed tube, but no matter how much pumping you do, bad fluid remains down by the slave.
When I first did this procedure after having done the original method previously, I could not believe the amount of "bad" fluid left down in the feed tube by the slave that I pushed up and out. By injecting fluid with this method, you are creating a simple closed loop.
I now include pumping the pedal when swapping out fluid as well. Inject, pump, inject.
I know my system is cleaner with this modification over the original, and and because of this, it does not need to be done as often.
[QUOTE=tjl5709;1581508807][QUOTE=Wayne O;1581079200]I'm no expert but it seems to me, however beneficial your method may be it might not be a replacement for the 'Ranger Method' and pumping the clutch pedal is still beneficial. Pressing the clutch pedal forces a pushrod/plunger down the bore of the master cylinder forcing a seal to close (to the reservoir) and forcing fluid through the line to the actuator cylinder pushing a piston in the actuator cylinder out forcing the release bearing to disengage the pressure plate. As the clutch pedal is released the plunger moves back, fluid returns to the master cylinder and finally opens the port to the reservoir, etc.
Granted, it may take multiple 'purge/pump/fill' cycles but it seems to me pumping the pedal insures a more thorough circulation of fluid throughout the entire system, seals are opened and closed and the cleansing of the fluid might be more complete. I like what you did but personally, I would not let it be a total substitute for the Ranger pump-pedal procedure. Thanks for sharing for modified Ranger method!
As the system is dead headed, there is no cycling of fluid from the reservoir to the cylinders. In essence, the fluid just travels back and forth in the tube. You get some mixing of good and bad in the feed tube, but no matter how much pumping you do, bad fluid remains down by the slave.
When I first did this procedure after having done the original method previously, I could not believe the amount of "bad" fluid left down in the feed tube by the slave that I pushed up and out. By injecting fluid with this method, you are creating a simple closed loop.
I now include pumping the pedal when swapping out fluid as well. Inject, pump, inject.
I know my system is cleaner with this modification over the original, and and because of this, it does not need to be done as often.
08-07-2012, 06:05 PM
#59
Racer
[QUOTE=ADVBedouin;1581509374]Question; Instead of cycling the clutch 30 times in the garage, prior to doing the ranger method, what about simply driving & using the clutch (probably 50+ clutch/shifts during a 30 minute local drive) prior to cycling out the clutch fluid via ranger method? Viable or no?QUOTE]
I'd say yes, absolutely viable. Now that you have fresh fluid (I read you performed the Modified Ranger Method), normal driving with periodic fluid changes automatically becomes a strung out Ranger Method. After all, what is the Ranger Method other than frantic clutch pumping and fluid R&R? If you're not at the drag races with clutch trouble there's no reason to be in a hurry...or if you check your reservoir for the first time and find black, chunky coffee in there (like I did), then it's time to step up. And the Modified Ranger Method is the best way next to a full-on system bleed.
I'd say yes, absolutely viable. Now that you have fresh fluid (I read you performed the Modified Ranger Method), normal driving with periodic fluid changes automatically becomes a strung out Ranger Method. After all, what is the Ranger Method other than frantic clutch pumping and fluid R&R? If you're not at the drag races with clutch trouble there's no reason to be in a hurry...or if you check your reservoir for the first time and find black, chunky coffee in there (like I did), then it's time to step up. And the Modified Ranger Method is the best way next to a full-on system bleed.
08-07-2012, 08:08 PM
#60
Safety Car
Just a stupid question...what do you guys use to ''marry'' the syringe to the black plastic line? The OD of the syringe is larger than the ID of the plastic tube??? I can't locate the plastic connector that TJ used to connect the two (as pictured).
thanks
thanks