Corvette + Goodyears + 23 Degrees = - Traction
01-07-2012, 10:42 AM
#1
Instructor
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Member Since: Jun 2011
Location: Clayton North Carolina
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Corvette + Goodyears + 23 Degrees = - Traction
People complain about the Goodyears in the rain, well if you like excitement drive them in the cold! 
Tuesday morning was cold, actually the frist cold weather we have had all season. I was driving in to work and coming off of I-440 on to Capital Blvd. In typical Raleigh driver fashion I had a jerk speed up and try to prevent me from merging in to traffic in front of him. So in my typical response I fall in behind, drop it in second and crack the throttle to cruise around him. Thats when I got the impression that the Goodyears didn't like the cold. Lets just say the car was spinning when I hit third! Quite funny actually and I found myself smiling the rest of the drive to work. I guess thats why they call them summer tires!
Tuesday morning was cold, actually the frist cold weather we have had all season. I was driving in to work and coming off of I-440 on to Capital Blvd. In typical Raleigh driver fashion I had a jerk speed up and try to prevent me from merging in to traffic in front of him. So in my typical response I fall in behind, drop it in second and crack the throttle to cruise around him. Thats when I got the impression that the Goodyears didn't like the cold. Lets just say the car was spinning when I hit third! Quite funny actually and I found myself smiling the rest of the drive to work. I guess thats why they call them summer tires!
01-07-2012, 12:43 PM
#3
Race Director
I've been driving mine all winter with no issues and it has been below 20 at times. I can still accelerate as quick as most cars out there, just cannot apply more than 1/2 throttle.
01-07-2012, 12:48 PM
#4
Team Owner
People complain about the Goodyears in the rain, well if you like excitement drive them in the cold!
Tuesday morning was cold, actually the frist cold weather we have had all season. I was driving in to work and coming off of I-440 on to Capital Blvd. In typical Raleigh driver fashion I had a jerk speed up and try to prevent me from merging in to traffic in front of him. So in my typical response I fall in behind, drop it in second and crack the throttle to cruise around him. Thats when I got the impression that the Goodyears didn't like the cold. Lets just say the car was spinning when I hit third! Quite funny actually and I found myself smiling the rest of the drive to work. I guess thats why they call them summer tires!
Tuesday morning was cold, actually the frist cold weather we have had all season. I was driving in to work and coming off of I-440 on to Capital Blvd. In typical Raleigh driver fashion I had a jerk speed up and try to prevent me from merging in to traffic in front of him. So in my typical response I fall in behind, drop it in second and crack the throttle to cruise around him. Thats when I got the impression that the Goodyears didn't like the cold. Lets just say the car was spinning when I hit third! Quite funny actually and I found myself smiling the rest of the drive to work. I guess thats why they call them summer tires!
01-07-2012, 04:25 PM
#5
Melting Slicks
Same issues with the GS size Goodyears. My Michelins do the same.
What I find almost embarrassing is I will pull out to pass some slopoke just after we have both made a left turn on to a two lane road. I immediately pull out and hammer it. Tires are spinning, exhaust bypass opens, so now I am making a lot of noise too, and I am bearly passing the guy. I know he is think "what is this squids problem?"
What I find almost embarrassing is I will pull out to pass some slopoke just after we have both made a left turn on to a two lane road. I immediately pull out and hammer it. Tires are spinning, exhaust bypass opens, so now I am making a lot of noise too, and I am bearly passing the guy. I know he is think "what is this squids problem?"
01-07-2012, 04:36 PM
#6
Drifting
I had the rear end step out on me last night leaving Hooters. Stone cold sober, I was giving a kid who was drooling over the Vette a quick spin down the road. Stepped on it pulling out of the side street and might have gone all the way around except the nannies saved me. Kid was unfazed and while I was surprised, I kept smiling. The rest of the ride was good but I was being careful. I had put Michelins on my 07 coupe and I can't wait to wear out the GYs and go back to them!
01-07-2012, 04:42 PM
#8
Drifting
It would be pretty slim pickens if only new topics were allowed here. And, maybe this topic will save a newbie forum member's life if he is unfamiliar with the issue and doesn't run across it in a search for something else. Please, step down from your high horse and join the discussion if you have something useful to contribute.
01-07-2012, 05:27 PM
#11
Safety Car
It would be pretty slim pickens if only new topics were allowed here. And, maybe this topic will save a newbie forum member's life if he is unfamiliar with the issue and doesn't run across it in a search for something else. Please, step down from your high horse and join the discussion if you have something useful to contribute.
here's 1 recent thread I found doing a search
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-c...-40-temps.html
Here's helpful content, since I noticed you didn't add any
http://www.mobiloil.com/usa-english/...s_in_snow.aspx
Also known as "max performance summer" tires or, more accurately, "three-season" tires, they come standard on every Porsche (except the Cayenne), all Corvettes, the Viper, all Ferraris and more. The reason: Summer tires offer more grip—on both wet and dry roads—than all-season tires, much less winter (aka "snow") tires. The only exception: When the thermometer drops below freezing or snow covers the pavement.
Tire Differences
A main difference among winter tires, all-season-tires and summer tires is the pliability and durability of their rubber at different temperatures. Tire engineers call it "glass transition temperature:" Get them cold enough and every tire will have the grip of a Formica kitchen counter. For a race tire, it might be 40° Fahrenheit. For a winter tire it could be 60° below zero. Summer tire tread starts becoming Formica-like somewhere just below freezing. Most all-season tires are still pliable below zero, but some "ultra-high-performance all-season" tires start losing grip well before that.
Grip and Sipes
Tire grip in the cold is much like oil viscosity, largely because tires contain many petroleum-based products. A 50-weight racing oil will protect an engine at temperatures approaching 260°, but at 70° it's almost as thick as Jell-o. Today, most racing oils are "multi-grade": A 20W-50 racing oil remains liquid enough to adequately lubricate the engine while it warms up but still protects at prodigious temperatures. Tires haven't advanced that far.
There are many other things that give tires grip in the snow. "Sipes"—small slices in the tread—are among the top features. But you can't put enough sipes in a summer tire to give it useful mobility in the snow.
I have personally experienced summer tires in the snow many times. Once I got stuck on a perfectly level-packed snowfield. Another time an ultra-high-performance summer tire would not go forward if the snowy road had any incline, but in reverse it could maintain about 5 mph. A third was the safest snow tire in the world: It couldn't get out of the garage.
Most recently, I drove for a video that was designed to sing the praises of a new ultra-high-performance all-season tire. We were using a snow-covered track. Air temperature hovered in the low 20s. The client supplied a BMW 3 Series, but that wasn't flashy enough for the ad agency. So, they hitched a trailer to a bright yellow Dodge Charger SRT-8 Super Bee fitted with 20-inch tires from a different tire company. I said, "Uh, those are (Brand X, Model Y)." When they looked at me as if I was wearing an aluminum foil hat to keep the CIA from reading my thoughts, I elaborated: "They're summer tires." Attempting to placate this whacko driver they replied, "Oh, you won't be able to tell the brand in the video."
"Absolutely right," I said, "because the car won't move with them on it." I attempted to explain the differences among winter, summer and all-season tires, but their California eyes quickly glazed over.
The ad guys' next bright idea was to have me borrow some all-season tires from Dodge, which was testing at the same facility. I drove the Charger over to their garage and almost crashed about 25 times in the quarter mile trip. I never exceeded 15 mph: I didn't want to go that fast, but with the brake pedal buried to the floor it picked up speed on a slight downgrade. I've run 210 mph in an Indy Car at Texas Motor Speedway but I scared myself more times on that short trip.
Dodge graciously offered to loan us some 20-inch high-performance all-season tires. But over the two-way radio came their test driver's fourth request that day to be pulled out of a snow bank. His car was fitted with the tires we would be borrowing. I said "No thanks." The Charger went back on the trailer.
Here's the bottom line: If you have a high performance car on summer tires, don't drive it in the snow or when it's much below freezing. Don't count on ultra-high-performance all-season tires to provide anything more than limited mobility in snow, but you can be assured of less wet and dry grip. And a BMW 335 on first-class snow tires is a blast on a snow-covered track.
About the Author
Mac Demere is a vehicle tester and race driver who competed in the NASCAR Southwest Tour and Daytona 24 Hours.
01-07-2012, 05:32 PM
#12
Drifting
Perhaps they could do some research, not just here, but on this thing called the internet about 'summer tires' or go to a tire site, since the OP acknowledged he knew about summer tires.
here's 1 recent thread I found doing a search
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-c...-40-temps.html
Here's helpful content, since I noticed you didn't add any
http://www.mobiloil.com/usa-english/...s_in_snow.aspx
Also known as "max performance summer" tires or, more accurately, "three-season" tires, they come standard on every Porsche (except the Cayenne), all Corvettes, the Viper, all Ferraris and more. The reason: Summer tires offer more grip—on both wet and dry roads—than all-season tires, much less winter (aka "snow") tires. The only exception: When the thermometer drops below freezing or snow covers the pavement.
Tire Differences
A main difference among winter tires, all-season-tires and summer tires is the pliability and durability of their rubber at different temperatures. Tire engineers call it "glass transition temperature:" Get them cold enough and every tire will have the grip of a Formica kitchen counter. For a race tire, it might be 40° Fahrenheit. For a winter tire it could be 60° below zero. Summer tire tread starts becoming Formica-like somewhere just below freezing. Most all-season tires are still pliable below zero, but some "ultra-high-performance all-season" tires start losing grip well before that.
Grip and Sipes
Tire grip in the cold is much like oil viscosity, largely because tires contain many petroleum-based products. A 50-weight racing oil will protect an engine at temperatures approaching 260°, but at 70° it's almost as thick as Jell-o. Today, most racing oils are "multi-grade": A 20W-50 racing oil remains liquid enough to adequately lubricate the engine while it warms up but still protects at prodigious temperatures. Tires haven't advanced that far.
There are many other things that give tires grip in the snow. "Sipes"—small slices in the tread—are among the top features. But you can't put enough sipes in a summer tire to give it useful mobility in the snow.
I have personally experienced summer tires in the snow many times. Once I got stuck on a perfectly level-packed snowfield. Another time an ultra-high-performance summer tire would not go forward if the snowy road had any incline, but in reverse it could maintain about 5 mph. A third was the safest snow tire in the world: It couldn't get out of the garage.
Most recently, I drove for a video that was designed to sing the praises of a new ultra-high-performance all-season tire. We were using a snow-covered track. Air temperature hovered in the low 20s. The client supplied a BMW 3 Series, but that wasn't flashy enough for the ad agency. So, they hitched a trailer to a bright yellow Dodge Charger SRT-8 Super Bee fitted with 20-inch tires from a different tire company. I said, "Uh, those are (Brand X, Model Y)." When they looked at me as if I was wearing an aluminum foil hat to keep the CIA from reading my thoughts, I elaborated: "They're summer tires." Attempting to placate this whacko driver they replied, "Oh, you won't be able to tell the brand in the video."
"Absolutely right," I said, "because the car won't move with them on it." I attempted to explain the differences among winter, summer and all-season tires, but their California eyes quickly glazed over.
The ad guys' next bright idea was to have me borrow some all-season tires from Dodge, which was testing at the same facility. I drove the Charger over to their garage and almost crashed about 25 times in the quarter mile trip. I never exceeded 15 mph: I didn't want to go that fast, but with the brake pedal buried to the floor it picked up speed on a slight downgrade. I've run 210 mph in an Indy Car at Texas Motor Speedway but I scared myself more times on that short trip.
Dodge graciously offered to loan us some 20-inch high-performance all-season tires. But over the two-way radio came their test driver's fourth request that day to be pulled out of a snow bank. His car was fitted with the tires we would be borrowing. I said "No thanks." The Charger went back on the trailer.
Here's the bottom line: If you have a high performance car on summer tires, don't drive it in the snow or when it's much below freezing. Don't count on ultra-high-performance all-season tires to provide anything more than limited mobility in snow, but you can be assured of less wet and dry grip. And a BMW 335 on first-class snow tires is a blast on a snow-covered track.
About the Author
Mac Demere is a vehicle tester and race driver who competed in the NASCAR Southwest Tour and Daytona 24 Hours.
here's 1 recent thread I found doing a search
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-c...-40-temps.html
Here's helpful content, since I noticed you didn't add any
http://www.mobiloil.com/usa-english/...s_in_snow.aspx
Also known as "max performance summer" tires or, more accurately, "three-season" tires, they come standard on every Porsche (except the Cayenne), all Corvettes, the Viper, all Ferraris and more. The reason: Summer tires offer more grip—on both wet and dry roads—than all-season tires, much less winter (aka "snow") tires. The only exception: When the thermometer drops below freezing or snow covers the pavement.
Tire Differences
A main difference among winter tires, all-season-tires and summer tires is the pliability and durability of their rubber at different temperatures. Tire engineers call it "glass transition temperature:" Get them cold enough and every tire will have the grip of a Formica kitchen counter. For a race tire, it might be 40° Fahrenheit. For a winter tire it could be 60° below zero. Summer tire tread starts becoming Formica-like somewhere just below freezing. Most all-season tires are still pliable below zero, but some "ultra-high-performance all-season" tires start losing grip well before that.
Grip and Sipes
Tire grip in the cold is much like oil viscosity, largely because tires contain many petroleum-based products. A 50-weight racing oil will protect an engine at temperatures approaching 260°, but at 70° it's almost as thick as Jell-o. Today, most racing oils are "multi-grade": A 20W-50 racing oil remains liquid enough to adequately lubricate the engine while it warms up but still protects at prodigious temperatures. Tires haven't advanced that far.
There are many other things that give tires grip in the snow. "Sipes"—small slices in the tread—are among the top features. But you can't put enough sipes in a summer tire to give it useful mobility in the snow.
I have personally experienced summer tires in the snow many times. Once I got stuck on a perfectly level-packed snowfield. Another time an ultra-high-performance summer tire would not go forward if the snowy road had any incline, but in reverse it could maintain about 5 mph. A third was the safest snow tire in the world: It couldn't get out of the garage.
Most recently, I drove for a video that was designed to sing the praises of a new ultra-high-performance all-season tire. We were using a snow-covered track. Air temperature hovered in the low 20s. The client supplied a BMW 3 Series, but that wasn't flashy enough for the ad agency. So, they hitched a trailer to a bright yellow Dodge Charger SRT-8 Super Bee fitted with 20-inch tires from a different tire company. I said, "Uh, those are (Brand X, Model Y)." When they looked at me as if I was wearing an aluminum foil hat to keep the CIA from reading my thoughts, I elaborated: "They're summer tires." Attempting to placate this whacko driver they replied, "Oh, you won't be able to tell the brand in the video."
"Absolutely right," I said, "because the car won't move with them on it." I attempted to explain the differences among winter, summer and all-season tires, but their California eyes quickly glazed over.
The ad guys' next bright idea was to have me borrow some all-season tires from Dodge, which was testing at the same facility. I drove the Charger over to their garage and almost crashed about 25 times in the quarter mile trip. I never exceeded 15 mph: I didn't want to go that fast, but with the brake pedal buried to the floor it picked up speed on a slight downgrade. I've run 210 mph in an Indy Car at Texas Motor Speedway but I scared myself more times on that short trip.
Dodge graciously offered to loan us some 20-inch high-performance all-season tires. But over the two-way radio came their test driver's fourth request that day to be pulled out of a snow bank. His car was fitted with the tires we would be borrowing. I said "No thanks." The Charger went back on the trailer.
Here's the bottom line: If you have a high performance car on summer tires, don't drive it in the snow or when it's much below freezing. Don't count on ultra-high-performance all-season tires to provide anything more than limited mobility in snow, but you can be assured of less wet and dry grip. And a BMW 335 on first-class snow tires is a blast on a snow-covered track.
About the Author
Mac Demere is a vehicle tester and race driver who competed in the NASCAR Southwest Tour and Daytona 24 Hours.
01-07-2012, 05:37 PM
#13
Team Owner
Reminds me of one of my recent threads about finding weird plastic pillows in my rear wheel wells, some guy comes on with a matter of fact "been posted here before".
He was right, OVER A YEAR AGO!
But I don't see him in the Zaino, XM, Onstar and V1 threads bitch-in' 
01-07-2012, 06:31 PM
#14
Safety Car
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My '09 coupe equipped with Michelin Pilot Sport All-Season Plus Runflats provided excellent traction in our recent cold spell at wide open throttle; too bad they don't make them for the G/S.
01-07-2012, 06:34 PM
#15
Instructor
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Well, I hope you go into all the Zaino, XM, Onstar and V1 threads and make your beefs there as well (you don't, I know, which makes no sense, seems you had such trouble with this post), as they pop up at least three a week. Give the guy a break.
Reminds me of one of my recent threads about finding weird plastic pillows in my rear wheel wells, some guy comes on with a matter of fact "been posted here before".
He was right, OVER A YEAR AGO! But I don't see him in the Zaino, XM, Onstar and V1 threads bitch-in'
Reminds me of one of my recent threads about finding weird plastic pillows in my rear wheel wells, some guy comes on with a matter of fact "been posted here before".
He was right, OVER A YEAR AGO!
But I don't see him in the Zaino, XM, Onstar and V1 threads bitch-in'
01-07-2012, 06:43 PM
#16
Team Owner
01-07-2012, 06:54 PM
#17
Isn't it amazing, that first time driving a high performance car with summer tires on a cold day? You're used to having great grip, and suddenly it feels like you have stone blocks for tires! A buddy of mine (was a newbie Porche driver) ran his brand new 911 into a jersey wall because he thought he could drive the same way as on a warm day.
01-07-2012, 07:08 PM
#19
Weird, I was only thinking the other day how much more traction I am getting from the GY's at the moment? They were appalling all summer but now seem to be more how I would expect?
In the height of summer any throttle at all with anything but straight ahead direction would have the back end out? Great fun but a wee bit silly for a supposed sports car.
Currently I can get on it a bit and the back end seems to squat and dig in, much more like other sporty cars I've driven in the past.
Maybe I am being unfair as down here in Vegas it is like a summers day for lots of places currently!
Strange though my experience seems 180 out to the mainstream crowd?
In the height of summer any throttle at all with anything but straight ahead direction would have the back end out? Great fun but a wee bit silly for a supposed sports car.
Currently I can get on it a bit and the back end seems to squat and dig in, much more like other sporty cars I've driven in the past.
Maybe I am being unfair as down here in Vegas it is like a summers day for lots of places currently!
Strange though my experience seems 180 out to the mainstream crowd?
01-07-2012, 07:09 PM
#20
Instructor
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Your not kidding. When I came back I was grinning from ear to ear but the wife said not no, but h@ll no! According to her I have too many hobbies. I admit it, I do, and she is right on the money about me. Let's see, I collect guns, love hunting, love offshore fishing and just got a brand new boat, love Harleys, love photography, and really love the Corvette! If I got the ZR-1 I would have to make a sacrifice and give up something else. I couldn't do it so I settled on the GS which she was ok with.
Besides, in my opinion since I wanted a daily driver I don't feel bad about my decision. If I had bought the ZR-1 I know that I would never want to drive it every day because quite honestly, it is just to nice of a car for that purpose!
Besides, in my opinion since I wanted a daily driver I don't feel bad about my decision. If I had bought the ZR-1 I know that I would never want to drive it every day because quite honestly, it is just to nice of a car for that purpose!