Rear Toe Link Grease
05-02-2012, 03:22 PM
#1
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Rear Toe Link Grease
According to the manual (09):
GM Part No. U.S. 12377985,
in Canada 88901242) or lubricant
meeting requirements of NLGI #2,
Category LB or GC-LB.
However I found a couple of websites that mention that I should be aware of incompatibility between greases, even if they are NLGI#2.
I was going to get synthetic Royal Purple but it is aluminum complex based.
Is the GM grease aluminum complex, lithium complex or something else? ugh!
who knew buying grease was going to be such a production!
I just thought I could get something better than the GM brand since it seems to thin out too quick, I didn't know there were compatibility issues between greases
GM Part No. U.S. 12377985,
in Canada 88901242) or lubricant
meeting requirements of NLGI #2,
Category LB or GC-LB.
However I found a couple of websites that mention that I should be aware of incompatibility between greases, even if they are NLGI#2.
I was going to get synthetic Royal Purple but it is aluminum complex based.
Is the GM grease aluminum complex, lithium complex or something else? ugh!
who knew buying grease was going to be such a production!I just thought I could get something better than the GM brand since it seems to thin out too quick, I didn't know there were compatibility issues between greases
Last edited by Ed32; 05-02-2012 at 03:27 PM.
05-02-2012, 03:26 PM
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St. Jude Donor '13
FWIW, Mobil 1 Synthetic Grease has a good reputation in other applications but I've been told it tends to drip out the fittings if used for the rear toe links. Messy.
I have no info at all about the compatibility issue, except that it does exist in some situtions.
I have no info at all about the compatibility issue, except that it does exist in some situtions.
05-02-2012, 05:12 PM
#3
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2021 C6 of the Year Finalist - Unmodified
I buy my grease tubes by the box from John Deere and have used it on everything for the last 40+ years and never had a problem with anything. I also use Fram oil filters, and air in my tires without problems. Just do the maintenance and things last.
05-02-2012, 05:49 PM
#4
Melting Slicks
Unless you track the car, you do not really even need to grease the rear toe link bushings. It is my understanding that the only reason those grease fittings are there is because the extreme heat from the rotors during track use will melt the grease in the toe link ends and thus they need to be regreased after hard track use. This will not happen during any degree of street use, even heavy street use... unless for some reason you find yourself trying to slow down as quickly as possible from 135mph to 55mph every 40 seconds, constantly, all day long.
If you do grease the toe link bushings, be VERY sparing with the grease or it WILL leak out and could possibly get on the brake rotors. If so, you've done more harm than good. This is why it's usually recommended to just leave the toe link ends alone unless you have a good reason to add grease.
Some years back Mobil 1 must have put out a bad batch of their synthetic grease and quite a few Z51 owners, including myself, experienced premature and excessive leaking of oil from the toe link bushings after adding this grease to the bushings. The grease would liquify excessively, it would just drip even when the car wasn't being used. I'd imagine that Mobil 1 corrected this issue long ago. The problem only went away for me after I flushed all the Mobil 1 out with some standard grease, toe links have been fine ever since. I would have been better off if I never messed with them in the first place but I didn't know any better back then.
If you really wish to grease the toe link ends, you probably can't go wrong with the correct GM grease, it's not "too thin", at least for all degrees of street use, and then just put a very small amount in there... that's all you need... just a half a squirt at best from your grease gun... just until the boots swell up ever so slightly... at least unless you're tracking the car. That would be my recommendation anyway based on my own experience with these links. If you are tracking regularly, then it's a different story and hopefully some racers here can chime in on what grease is best to handle the extreme high heat.
If you do grease the toe link bushings, be VERY sparing with the grease or it WILL leak out and could possibly get on the brake rotors. If so, you've done more harm than good. This is why it's usually recommended to just leave the toe link ends alone unless you have a good reason to add grease.
Some years back Mobil 1 must have put out a bad batch of their synthetic grease and quite a few Z51 owners, including myself, experienced premature and excessive leaking of oil from the toe link bushings after adding this grease to the bushings. The grease would liquify excessively, it would just drip even when the car wasn't being used. I'd imagine that Mobil 1 corrected this issue long ago. The problem only went away for me after I flushed all the Mobil 1 out with some standard grease, toe links have been fine ever since. I would have been better off if I never messed with them in the first place but I didn't know any better back then.
If you really wish to grease the toe link ends, you probably can't go wrong with the correct GM grease, it's not "too thin", at least for all degrees of street use, and then just put a very small amount in there... that's all you need... just a half a squirt at best from your grease gun... just until the boots swell up ever so slightly... at least unless you're tracking the car. That would be my recommendation anyway based on my own experience with these links. If you are tracking regularly, then it's a different story and hopefully some racers here can chime in on what grease is best to handle the extreme high heat.
05-02-2012, 08:00 PM
#5
Advanced
I've got an '08 Z51 with 36k miles on it. When I have Jiffy Lube change the oil they always spritz a couple of shots of grease onto the toe links. So far they haven't fallen off.
05-02-2012, 09:29 PM
#6
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Unless you track the car, you do not really even need to grease the rear toe link bushings. It is my understanding that the only reason those grease fittings are there is because the extreme heat from the rotors during track use will melt the grease in the toe link ends and thus they need to be regreased after hard track use. This will not happen during any degree of street use, even heavy street use... unless for some reason you find yourself trying to slow down as quickly as possible from 135mph to 55mph every 40 seconds, constantly, all day long.
If you do grease the toe link bushings, be VERY sparing with the grease or it WILL leak out and could possibly get on the brake rotors. If so, you've done more harm than good. This is why it's usually recommended to just leave the toe link ends alone unless you have a good reason to add grease.
Some years back Mobil 1 must have put out a bad batch of their synthetic grease and quite a few Z51 owners, including myself, experienced premature and excessive leaking of oil from the toe link bushings after adding this grease to the bushings. The grease would liquify excessively, it would just drip even when the car wasn't being used. I'd imagine that Mobil 1 corrected this issue long ago. The problem only went away for me after I flushed all the Mobil 1 out with some standard grease, toe links have been fine ever since. I would have been better off if I never messed with them in the first place but I didn't know any better back then.
If you really wish to grease the toe link ends, you probably can't go wrong with the correct GM grease, it's not "too thin", at least for all degrees of street use, and then just put a very small amount in there... that's all you need... just a half a squirt at best from your grease gun... just until the boots swell up ever so slightly... at least unless you're tracking the car. That would be my recommendation anyway based on my own experience with these links. If you are tracking regularly, then it's a different story and hopefully some racers here can chime in on what grease is best to handle the extreme high heat.
If you do grease the toe link bushings, be VERY sparing with the grease or it WILL leak out and could possibly get on the brake rotors. If so, you've done more harm than good. This is why it's usually recommended to just leave the toe link ends alone unless you have a good reason to add grease.
Some years back Mobil 1 must have put out a bad batch of their synthetic grease and quite a few Z51 owners, including myself, experienced premature and excessive leaking of oil from the toe link bushings after adding this grease to the bushings. The grease would liquify excessively, it would just drip even when the car wasn't being used. I'd imagine that Mobil 1 corrected this issue long ago. The problem only went away for me after I flushed all the Mobil 1 out with some standard grease, toe links have been fine ever since. I would have been better off if I never messed with them in the first place but I didn't know any better back then.
If you really wish to grease the toe link ends, you probably can't go wrong with the correct GM grease, it's not "too thin", at least for all degrees of street use, and then just put a very small amount in there... that's all you need... just a half a squirt at best from your grease gun... just until the boots swell up ever so slightly... at least unless you're tracking the car. That would be my recommendation anyway based on my own experience with these links. If you are tracking regularly, then it's a different story and hopefully some racers here can chime in on what grease is best to handle the extreme high heat.
That explains a few grease drops inside the rim right after the oil change. I was gonna get the gun for the Jeep too, that thing has a bunch of zerks in the front axle; I also found some in the riding mower. I guess I can have fun with those instead
. I'll leave the Vette alone, maybe half a squirt like you said with the GM stuff.
05-02-2012, 09:40 PM
#7
Some years back Mobil 1 must have put out a bad batch of their synthetic grease and quite a few Z51 owners, including myself, experienced premature and excessive leaking of oil from the toe link bushings after adding this grease to the bushings. The grease would liquify excessively, it would just drip even when the car wasn't being used. I'd imagine that Mobil 1 corrected this issue long ago. The problem only went away for me after I flushed all the Mobil 1 out with some standard grease, toe links have been fine ever since. I would have been better off if I never messed with them in the first place but I didn't know any better back then.
05-04-2012, 01:18 AM
#8
Burning Brakes
How did you flush the grease out?
I bought my car used and whatever brand the dealer used on the previous owners oil change is always leaking out the fittings. So much that when I park it in the garage I put towels in the wheel barrels so the drips dont sling around.
I bought my car used and whatever brand the dealer used on the previous owners oil change is always leaking out the fittings. So much that when I park it in the garage I put towels in the wheel barrels so the drips dont sling around.
Last edited by Red89gt; 05-04-2012 at 01:21 AM.
05-04-2012, 01:32 AM
#9
Race Director
The grease I use is a lithium complex NLGI #2, made by "RED-I." It's dropping point is about 580F. It's a very "sticky" grease. Been using it for 30 years in everything (except airplanes!)
That's where Aeroshell comes in...
That's where Aeroshell comes in...
05-04-2012, 02:15 AM
#10
Melting Slicks
Sounds like you have the Mobil 1 in there!
To "flush" the old "bad" grease out, all I did was pump new "good" grease into the fitting until the old grease started oozing out from under the boot. Then I'd squeeze the boot a bit to get even more out, then pump more new grease in, do this a few times until all that's coming out is the new grease, at that point most of the old grease will have been removed.
After doing this "flush" procedure, you still may notice a little bit of an oil film on the inside of the rims over time but it should taper off and cease being a problem. You should no longer have oil literately dripping onto the rims. Worked for me. I can't remember the exact grease I used finally but it was a dino grease (not synthetic) that matched the GM recommended spec as closely as possible.
Yeah, that Mobil 1 synthetic stuff would just drip and drip, every day, totally unacceptable, can't have that.
To "flush" the old "bad" grease out, all I did was pump new "good" grease into the fitting until the old grease started oozing out from under the boot. Then I'd squeeze the boot a bit to get even more out, then pump more new grease in, do this a few times until all that's coming out is the new grease, at that point most of the old grease will have been removed.
After doing this "flush" procedure, you still may notice a little bit of an oil film on the inside of the rims over time but it should taper off and cease being a problem. You should no longer have oil literately dripping onto the rims. Worked for me. I can't remember the exact grease I used finally but it was a dino grease (not synthetic) that matched the GM recommended spec as closely as possible.
Yeah, that Mobil 1 synthetic stuff would just drip and drip, every day, totally unacceptable, can't have that.
05-04-2012, 11:08 AM
#11
Burning Brakes
Thought that when you pushed the grease through like that it ruined the boots ability to seal at the base?
Was always told in shop back when cars had grease fittings to never over fill like that.
Are the boots made up differently now?
It has been 20+ years since in shop and it is probably showing.
Was always told in shop back when cars had grease fittings to never over fill like that.
Are the boots made up differently now?
It has been 20+ years since in shop and it is probably showing.
05-05-2012, 05:14 PM
#14
Melting Slicks
But otherwise, doing it just one time and doing it slowly and gently (as I did), I don't see how it can harm anything. Regardless I would not recommend doing it unless necessary, and in this case with the Mobil 1 grease in the Z51 toe link ends, it WAS necessary. That grease HAD to come out, can't have liquid oil dripping inside the wheel near the brakes every day. I wasn't worried about the cosmetic aspect of the wheel getting dirty, but there was a realistic concern about oil getting on the brakes.
With the Z51 toe link end boots, when I pushed some grease out the sides of the boots, nothing was harmed. And now that I have good grease in those joints (I think it was Valvoline actually), I have zero detectible leaking and it's all fine.
So, in sum, the boots are still fine even though I pushed the Mobil 1 grease out the sides of them, no harm done. I can't think of any other way to have gotten the old grease out anyway, at least not in a practical manner. You can't suck it all out through the zerk fitting and other than that you'd have to remove the link, pull off the boot, wipe the joint clean and then blast fresh grease though anyway, that's a heck of a lot more work and then by rights you'd need an alignment after putting it back together.
Have no fear, if you push the grease out past the sides of the boots slowly and carefully, you shouldn't have a problem.
Last edited by Vet; 05-05-2012 at 05:17 PM.
05-05-2012, 10:01 PM
#15
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St. Jude Donor '13
Thanks for posting your experience.
05-06-2012, 02:49 PM
#16
That is indeed what they told everyone in shop class back in the day. But, these types of boots do not actually "seal" to the part, it's not like they're bonded or adhered in any way, they just fit tight. So by pushing some grease out the sides it's not like you're tearing apart a bonded seal or anything. I suppose if you did it all the time perhaps the boot would start to loosen up prematurely as it would be getting stretched. Or perhaps if you blasted very thick grease through quickly and forcefully you might even tear the boot.
But otherwise, doing it just one time and doing it slowly and gently (as I did), I don't see how it can harm anything. Regardless I would not recommend doing it unless necessary, and in this case with the Mobil 1 grease in the Z51 toe link ends, it WAS necessary. That grease HAD to come out, can't have liquid oil dripping inside the wheel near the brakes every day. I wasn't worried about the cosmetic aspect of the wheel getting dirty, but there was a realistic concern about oil getting on the brakes.
With the Z51 toe link end boots, when I pushed some grease out the sides of the boots, nothing was harmed. And now that I have good grease in those joints (I think it was Valvoline actually), I have zero detectible leaking and it's all fine.
So, in sum, the boots are still fine even though I pushed the Mobil 1 grease out the sides of them, no harm done. I can't think of any other way to have gotten the old grease out anyway, at least not in a practical manner. You can't suck it all out through the zerk fitting and other than that you'd have to remove the link, pull off the boot, wipe the joint clean and then blast fresh grease though anyway, that's a heck of a lot more work and then by rights you'd need an alignment after putting it back together.
Have no fear, if you push the grease out past the sides of the boots slowly and carefully, you shouldn't have a problem.
But otherwise, doing it just one time and doing it slowly and gently (as I did), I don't see how it can harm anything. Regardless I would not recommend doing it unless necessary, and in this case with the Mobil 1 grease in the Z51 toe link ends, it WAS necessary. That grease HAD to come out, can't have liquid oil dripping inside the wheel near the brakes every day. I wasn't worried about the cosmetic aspect of the wheel getting dirty, but there was a realistic concern about oil getting on the brakes.
With the Z51 toe link end boots, when I pushed some grease out the sides of the boots, nothing was harmed. And now that I have good grease in those joints (I think it was Valvoline actually), I have zero detectible leaking and it's all fine.
So, in sum, the boots are still fine even though I pushed the Mobil 1 grease out the sides of them, no harm done. I can't think of any other way to have gotten the old grease out anyway, at least not in a practical manner. You can't suck it all out through the zerk fitting and other than that you'd have to remove the link, pull off the boot, wipe the joint clean and then blast fresh grease though anyway, that's a heck of a lot more work and then by rights you'd need an alignment after putting it back together.
Have no fear, if you push the grease out past the sides of the boots slowly and carefully, you shouldn't have a problem.
To understand, oem tie rod/ball joint seals are mfg'ed with metal ring impregnated in the bottom. When installed, bottom portion has to be press fitted and the top port is stretched over the large taper shank of tie rod/ball joint to seal out water and contaminates.
So...to violate the designed limits and apply pressure enough to have grease coming out thru the seal is not a good idea!
You do not have to "flush" out Mobil 1, it is not an contamination! Just pump in new grease per spec. It is a good simple practice, however, to install rubber cap over grease zerk, to keep zerk clean and avoid drips onto wheel barrel. No need to worry about grease on brake, that is unwarrented imaginations!
By the way, there is no subsituates presently available that can equal oem. And if you have ever use the subsituates, you know what I mean!
05-07-2012, 04:34 PM
#17
Instructor
I had to get rid of the Mobil 1 in my grease gun for that exact reason. What a mess. Seriously I hung my grease gun up and put a plastic cup under it to catch all the drippings from the Mobil 1.
05-07-2012, 09:58 PM
#18
Melting Slicks
Ball joints are a different story, ball joint boots DO fit tight and do seal so indeed you never want to try to force too much grease into them or you could possibly rupture the boot.
As for the Z51 toe link ends... not sure if these boots have rings, do you know for sure? The grease did come out of the sides of my boots without a fuss, no pops or splits in the boot, no damage.... though I did push the grease very slowly and carefully. The boots are still sealing fine now, no grease or oil leaking out.
I do agree to not recommend that anyone force grease out the sides of any boots... unless necessary.
...You do not have to "flush" out Mobil 1, it is not an contamination! Just pump in new grease per spec.
It's not reasonable to have to wipe fresh oil from your wheel barrels almost everyday. And while the oil wasn't dripping directly onto the brakes, it's surely not a good idea to have fresh oil sitting around in close proximity to brake rotors / calipers. If not cleaned often enough, a good deal of oil would accumulate in each wheel barrel and might even drip from the top of the barrel onto the brakes when the car is parked, etc. In a car that you might sometimes take up to triple digit speeds, you really can't have oil dripping around near your brakes, I definitely did not feel too comfortable with that and decided to put an end to it.
If the Mobil 1 wasn't entirely removed from the joint, it only makes sense that it would keep on dripping. Just adding a bit of good fresh grease to the existing Mobil 1 inside the joint would not cause the Mobil 1 to stop liquifying and dripping. It would seem necessary to flush out the Mobil 1, remove it from the joint, to end the dripping. It worked for me in any case. Once I flushed out the Mobil 1, the dripping stopped immediately, there was a bit of mild slow seepage for a while after that but nothing to be concerned about, now it seems dry and clean. The current grease is not liquifying prematurely and the seals are holding the grease in just fine.
I'm really shocked to hear that even current Mobil 1 synthetic grease still drips (as reported by some). I really thought that it was just a bad batch I had. I suppose in some applications the quick and excessive liquifying would not be a problem or might even be a good thing, but in THIS application (Z51 toe link ends), constant dripping of oil is not acceptable.
05-08-2012, 08:55 AM
#20
Instructor
Yes I bought the tube about 3 months ago and had my grease gun on a shelf. When I went to pick it up there was liquified grease all over the place. I had hoped it would have stopped but just in case I hung it over a cup and grease still leaked. Got rid of the tube after that.
