sircrashalot

COnsidering buying a Diablosport tuner and I called my dealer to see what impact an altered tune would have on the remaining warranty on my 06 c6 a6. I really just wanted to know for sure if he would let me slide on any warranty work if I brought the car in with an altered tune, or if I should put the stock tune back before bringing the car in for any service.

His response was that as soon as you alter the stock tune, an electronic stamp is left behind that voids warranty on driveability, emissions, and transmission issues. He explained it as an electronic 'stamp' left behind even if you replace the stock tune....and that electronic stamp tells GM that factory tune had been removed at some point...and bango, no more warranty.

Is this true???

06MonteSS

hahaha... with SOME programmers, maybe...

but not with the Diablo units... restore original backup before you take it in for any service work, and you'll be fine...

plus, there is no "counter" or "history" tracking on the 06's anyway...

garytucker

The question should be "can I afford to repair what breaks in my powertrain if I choose to modify my tune" versus can I sneak by. Some companies have even gone so far as to say their tune is "invisible" to GM systems. Do you really want to take a chance on what a salesperson tells you? Let's be real...we all love to bash car dealerships for their sales tactics...aren't the tuners in the same boat?

I can't say for sure whether GM would ever find that you tuned and went back to stock...and neither can the aftermarket tune seller as they are not current GM employees. You have to make a personal decision when you modify as to whether you are willing to accept the risk that you may have to foot the bill for any item you have modified.

This should be the "gut check" question for all of us considering modifications as GM and other manufacturers are working to reduce their warranty costs. Whether it is "fair" or not doesn't matter, they will do everything their attorney's say is legal to accomplish that.

sircrashalot

I get that heavy mods and increasing hp can put strain on parts that rightly shouldnt be warrantied...but the dealer said no problem with a bolt on exhaust and air intake...but the tune voids everything...the tune gets the car to run properly with the other bolt ons....

I'm gonna trust 06 Monte mostly and do some more research to find out if putting the stock tune back leaves a bread crumb trail somehow. I am going down to SLP Thursday so I'll pick their brains some.

sircrashalot

I just called Diablo.....they assure me 100% that since their programmer does not come with a generic 'factory' tune but instead actually downloads what is in your car and saves it, then puts it back when you want to, there is no trace left behind whatsoever. THey way they explained it is that when you reinstall the downloaded, saved original tune from your vehicle that the diablo stores at first hookup, it is the same as going back in time as far as the computer is concerned.

Apparently some other programmers don't download and store the original tune from your car..they have a generic factory tune that may be different, which is going to be noticed in the same manner as any other non-stock tune would be.

06MonteSS

correct ^ ^ ^...

no worries man...

the first thing the predator or trinity does before anything else, is to save a backup copy of your original stock GM tune from the pcm...

then you can install a diablo tune, modify the tune, get a custom tune, etc etc...

and then once you do the "restore original backup" process, the predator restores that original stock GM tune to your car that it made the copy of before, thus leaving your cars pcm exactly how it was before you every did anything with the predator.

garytucker

So you believed everything the car salesman told you too I'm sure. You have to remember that the seller always has something to gain by getting you to buy.

Make the decision based on research and understanding of the risks you take (not that a certain tune is bad or not...not making judgments there) financially by utilizing something that could potentially void your warranty. Your dealer has indicated it is a no-go, so that's a pretty big hint that they are actively looking at this type of thing.

Just because an outside supplier says it won't void your warranty doesn't mean it can't happen. Ask the person selling the tune what kind of back up they have if you do get caught and your powertrain warranty is voided. Most will simply say "sorry" or they will send you the price you paid for the tune back...nothing more.

redzone

Well said......

The only thing I'll add is that I find it despicable to do someting you KNOW IN ADVANCE will void your warranty & then try to hide it to get said warranty work done.

And before anyone tells me to mind my own business,it is my business. GM takes into account every $$ spent for warranty repairs when deciding how much the MSRP will go up on next years model.

sircrashalot

You make a good point about the cost....nothing is free....but I'll just guess that when you are speeding and see a cop running radar, you slow down to avoid the ticket and don't just continue ripping by or voluntarily pull over and ask for the ticket for what you did wrong that you knew in advance was wrong. Just a hunch....and oh so despicable....not really.
I am talking about installing a tune that improves on what GM programmed into the car. If I break something due to a mod or I did, or at the track (which is why I don't go to the track) I wouldn't seek warranty coverage. If my passenger side window switch or hatch release fails and they tell me that it wont be replaced under warranty because I have an altered tune I have a major problem with that. The thing I can't get past is that they allow the bolt on mods like exhaust and intake, which could potentially lean things out and cause damage, but they don't allow you to make the changes to ensure that those bolt ons DO NOT cause damage and that keep things running within spec in concert with those changes.
There is nothing inherently harmful in installing a different from factory tune. It does not cause harm to any warrantied part by simply being there. If I had a problem that was CAUSED by the tune, I would not seek or expect warranty coverage....but voiding the warranty just because its there regardless if it was a factor in the problem is arbitrary and stupid. I fight stupid wherever I find it....however I must.
Therefore, if I want to be sure that I can replace my stock tune in a fashion that does not cause an arbitrary voidance of warranty coverage for items completely unrelated to the tune by using a programmer that replaces the stock tune with no trace of it having ever been removed an altered I feel that I am simply working around a flawed policy in the same manner that you would detour around a traffic jam but still arrive at the same destination.

redzone

A tune has waaaay more potential to cause damage than either an exhaust or CAI. When you start messing with air/fuel ratios it doesn't take much to lean it too much and cause a burnt piston.

If you really want to get a tune,that is of course your business. But I'd strongly recommend getting a tuner you trust to dyno & road tune your car. They can set the tune for your areas conditions(weather/temp wise) vs the canned tune that is the same if you live in Death Valley or Fairbanks,Alaska. Not to mention a custom tune will make more power than a canned one.

And if your warranty is voided,it's only the powetrain warranty. If your radio stops working or your wipers go on the fritz it's still covered.

Best of luck to you,whatever you decide.

sircrashalot

This whole thread began because I am looking at SLP's zl435 package which is an exhaust, cai, tstat and diablosport predator tuner with a pre-loaded SLP dyno developed tune specific to the exact parts that come in the performance pac. Given that I live in the same state as SLP's R&D facility it should be dead on. A web search for SLP zl435 will produce an article where this package was installed including the tune and brought wheel hp from 327 to 367, and torque at the wheels from 318 to 335....so the gains are significant, and the tune is a dyno tweaked, part specific version, not just a '93 octane high performance' kinda deal.

I didn't realize the debate my post would spark- it seems that most people on the C6 forum have vehicles in warranty and have altered the tune in the pcm one way or another.
Truth is I am still on the fence in installing the tune before my warranty is up. I may wait and see how she runs/feels without it first.

The debate and different points of view are why we are all here after all...and I certainly appreciate even those opinions I may not agree with 100%

0SP Motorsports,Inc

Ok, let me throw a monkey wrench into the GM "No Altered Tuning" argument with a for-instance that could practically happen with bolt on parts:

You change the gears out in your A6 car from the stockers to a 3.42 which comes stock on a manual transmission car. And for sake of argument, the dealership installs the gears as well. You HAVE to alter the tune or the transmission will be shifting improperly. Now what since GM most likely does not have an OEM calibration to fit this combination that they can simply download into the ECM/TCM?

garytucker

The dealer would either do something they knew could result in a voided warranty (and face that legal mess) or they would turn down the work in the first place (it does happen...the dealership I worked at turned down work like that...doesn't mean one of the "hacks" who was an "aspiring tuner millionaire" didn't do the work on the side...but that's one of the reasons that shop has a strict no side-work policy now).

I would think the dealership would be taking on quite a bit of liability in modifying a tune in light of GM's new stricter stance on tuning.

res0n0xg

First of all, your warranty CAN NOT be voided unless the tune, or any modification is proven to have caused the failure, so keep that in mind. Obviously if you're trying to tune the car yourself with little experience be careful.

Thousands of corvette's are tuned all the time and it's a great modification any person who is looking at modding there car should do. I would highly recommend a full dyno tune, not a purchased (canned) tune online, although there are some reputable people who do that as well.

Chemdawg99

If you are going to tune, do it and don't worry about the warranty. Don't worry about "going back to stock" if you have to go in for warranty work. If you want, just keep your mouth shut and see if the dealership says anything about your tune or any other modification you have.

garytucker

And how much are you willing to spend to try and keep GM from voiding a powertrain warranty? The reason being is that the tuner sure isn't going to come to your rescue.

I can tell you that GM has cracked down on tuning in relation to the Camaro as I've seen the bulletin that specifically addresses it. If a powertrain failure occurs in a Camaro, the dealer has to upload the ECM information to GM BEFORE they can replace the component. IF the tune is seen (not going down that rabbit trail...) GM has stated that the powertrain warranty is voided...regardless of whether the tune caused the problem or not.

As has been stated...don't modify if you can't afford to pay for what breaks in your powertrain regardless of what caused it. It is that simple...

C6LSx

Would this work as well on a 2008 LS3 A6?

My LS3 is bone stock and I want to install a Halltech CAI and LG LT headers and I know that it will need a retune to run the way it should.

My concern is that I don't want to toast my current and extended powertrain warranty for the sake of picking up an additional 30rwhp.

Thanks for your reply.

BRCC

There has been many answers to the OPs question but none actually answering the question except from a Diablo vendor. Do we have a 3rd party that can answer the exact question relative to 06(LS2) to 09(LS3) also (LS7s) vettes. "Can the original tune be replaced by the DS and not be detected"

garytucker

I can't speak for the Corvette as I haven't seen any information, but here is what has come out about the global A platform...

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=79922

Honestly, this has realistically got to be a cost/benefit analysis for everyone doing modifications. In all "legality" your powertrain warranty is toast once you modify whether you go back to stock or not...that's just sensible thinking. I really think the issue we get into with tuning is that it is so easy to do and realitively inexpensive and that causes us to treat it differently than say a turbo or supercharger setup.

If you put on an aftermarket supercharger, would you expect GM to warranty the transmission? The answer should be no, as you have modified a direct link to its continued survival potential...the same goes for a tune whether we like it or not.

GARYFINN

Ouch !! I think that answers it. If you tune you are on your own.