05 MAF delete kit?
10-01-2015, 12:00 PM
#21
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And I would bet large piles of cash that both of you have fuel trims enabled, exactly the same as me. i.e. CLOSED LOOP. Not open loop.
I'm not getting into a pissing contest over this--SD vs. MAF only defines how AIRFLOW is calculated.
Open loop vs. closed loop controls FUELING corrections. Two entirely different (and independent) things. You can have open loop or closed loop for fueling corrections, and airflow can be calculated via MAF, SD or a combination of both. You do not need a MAF for fuel corrections (i.e. "Closed loop") to be enabled.
That would be like saying you need a tire pressure sensor in order for your fuel gauge to work. It's just plain wrong.
The fact that someone that CHARGES people money for tuning doesn't know that should scare the beejesus out of everyone.
I'm not getting into a pissing contest over this--SD vs. MAF only defines how AIRFLOW is calculated.
Open loop vs. closed loop controls FUELING corrections. Two entirely different (and independent) things. You can have open loop or closed loop for fueling corrections, and airflow can be calculated via MAF, SD or a combination of both. You do not need a MAF for fuel corrections (i.e. "Closed loop") to be enabled.
That would be like saying you need a tire pressure sensor in order for your fuel gauge to work. It's just plain wrong.
The fact that someone that CHARGES people money for tuning doesn't know that should scare the beejesus out of everyone.
I am 99% sure i am running Open loop speed density. I know i was inform I can remove my MAF but i have to retain my IAT sensor, which was the reason for this posting. If I remember right he told me I am not running my o2 sensors, cause i mention something about running Cam2 every now and then and was told the its cool being the o2 were tuned out. Now I will have to confirm before anything. I actually have hptuners on the way so I can learn myself.
10-01-2015, 12:03 PM
#22
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St. Jude Donor '15
I haven't seen anyone straight up disable all the O2 sensors in a long time--it's an old way of doing it and far from ideal IMO. I still don't understand the logic behind it.
It's like.. you have these sensors that will automatically adjust fueling most of the time on the fly for you.. so let's disable them? Makes no sense.
Regardless--closed loop SD is very common and makes a lot more sense for most setups.
It's like.. you have these sensors that will automatically adjust fueling most of the time on the fly for you.. so let's disable them? Makes no sense.
Regardless--closed loop SD is very common and makes a lot more sense for most setups.
10-01-2015, 12:03 PM
#23
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I have been on Speed desnity tune for a little under 1 month now and it runs great. Only issue i have that i need to address only happens when I have the AC on when coming to a stop it will surge and settle down to idle and every now and then it will surge enough to cause a stall. I am bringing the car back into Horsepower solutions for a differential brace and he will correct the surging i am sure but it only happens when I have the AC on .
10-01-2015, 12:06 PM
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I haven't seen anyone straight up disable all the O2 sensors in a long time--it's an old way of doing it and far from ideal IMO. I still don't understand the logic behind it.
It's like.. you have these sensors that will automatically adjust fueling most of the time on the fly for you.. so let's disable them? Makes no sense.
Regardless--closed loop SD is very common and makes a lot more sense for most setups.
It's like.. you have these sensors that will automatically adjust fueling most of the time on the fly for you.. so let's disable them? Makes no sense.
Regardless--closed loop SD is very common and makes a lot more sense for most setups.
Last edited by shawnaj7731; 10-01-2015 at 12:08 PM.
10-01-2015, 12:12 PM
#25
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is there a quick way to check to see if its open or closed loop with out hptuners. It is on its way my tuner has been busy so i dont want to bother him until it goes in for the repair.
10-01-2015, 12:19 PM
#26
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St. Jude Donor '15
Just start taking a log in VCM scanner. If all fuel trims are 0 then it's in open loop. If they are changing then it's closed loop.
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showth...4-Engine-Modes
Here's some info on all the possible modes. Straight from Hpt.
And, lastly, more proof.
http://ls1tech.com/forums/pcm-diagno...l#post10474633
http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showth...4-Engine-Modes
Here's some info on all the possible modes. Straight from Hpt.
And, lastly, more proof.
http://ls1tech.com/forums/pcm-diagno...l#post10474633
Last edited by schpenxel; 10-01-2015 at 12:26 PM.
10-01-2015, 12:36 PM
#28
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St. Jude Donor '15
There's def a bit of a learning curve with it.. It's raw access to tons of tables, especially if you've never messed with tuning before.
Greg banish has some good dvd's and books to get you started if needed
Greg banish has some good dvd's and books to get you started if needed
10-01-2015, 10:08 PM
#29
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St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
Why ?? Because the poster asked if there was a way to get around the IAT deducts on his application without re-tuning--- This is a common fix for those with relocated IAT sensors or MAFLESS tunes -More suited for a race only car -- Unless you live in the desert it is a viable good option even for a D/D
10-01-2015, 10:12 PM
#30
Melting Slicks
Now im questioning my tune, I didnt even got that much info out out of him, he just told me he had to tune in sd since the maf maxed out, he did tell me the same thing about iat in the maf, etc. I dont think he turned all 4 O2 sensors off, I think he mentioned only the rear ones. I also have to bring it back because I have no ac now...
10-01-2015, 10:17 PM
#31
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St. Jude Donor '13-'14-'15
I have been on Speed desnity tune for a little under 1 month now and it runs great. Only issue i have that i need to address only happens when I have the AC on when coming to a stop it will surge and settle down to idle and every now and then it will surge enough to cause a stall. I am bringing the car back into Horsepower solutions for a differential brace and he will correct the surging i am sure but it only happens when I have the AC on .
A true SD tune is neither closed loop or open loop---
10-01-2015, 10:28 PM
#32
Melting Slicks
Open loop SD sounds like a horrible idea. Closed loop SD sounds like a much better one. Yes, you need the IAT sensor if running SD for airflow calcs.
You can either just not use the airflow portion of the MAF, and keep it in place and use the IAT that is built into it, or you can remove it entirely and use a separate IAT sensor
There are three main options for using a separate IAT sensor--one is using a borg warner WT382 style sensor. You can either have a bung welded on to the new intake tube and the sensor will screw in, or you can install the sensor in the intake manifold (Passenger side, right after throttle body there's a nice flat place that works great to drill/tap), or.. you can use a GTO style sensor which uses a rubber grommet. Drill a hole in your new intake pipe and pop it in.
There are two wires on the current MAF connector--they will be the same color and right beside each other . That's what the IAT connects to. You can either use a break out harness or cut the wires/run new wires to the new IAT sensor.
Regardless of what option is used--make sure you copy the IAT sensor curve out of a car that uses whatever sensor you go with.
You can either just not use the airflow portion of the MAF, and keep it in place and use the IAT that is built into it, or you can remove it entirely and use a separate IAT sensor
There are three main options for using a separate IAT sensor--one is using a borg warner WT382 style sensor. You can either have a bung welded on to the new intake tube and the sensor will screw in, or you can install the sensor in the intake manifold (Passenger side, right after throttle body there's a nice flat place that works great to drill/tap), or.. you can use a GTO style sensor which uses a rubber grommet. Drill a hole in your new intake pipe and pop it in.
There are two wires on the current MAF connector--they will be the same color and right beside each other . That's what the IAT connects to. You can either use a break out harness or cut the wires/run new wires to the new IAT sensor.
Regardless of what option is used--make sure you copy the IAT sensor curve out of a car that uses whatever sensor you go with.
10-01-2015, 10:40 PM
#33
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St. Jude Donor '15
I wouldn't call it a "retune".. will you need some updates? Probably. But nothing huge
That is assuming you were already SD and the MAF isn't being used aside from for IAT info
That is assuming you were already SD and the MAF isn't being used aside from for IAT info
Last edited by schpenxel; 10-01-2015 at 10:45 PM.
10-01-2015, 10:44 PM
#34
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St. Jude Donor '15
Why ?? Because the poster asked if there was a way to get around the IAT deducts on his application without re-tuning--- This is a common fix for those with relocated IAT sensors or MAFLESS tunes -More suited for a race only car -- Unless you live in the desert it is a viable good option even for a D/D
Never mind, I know you don't have a clue how that actually works.
You've been spouting this ******** about how "speed density" tunes can't be closed loop for 7 years now. Guess what? You were wrong then. You're still wrong now. Even HP Tuners STAFF stated clear as day that you are wrong. If they don't know, then who does?
At this point I think you're just trolling. I guess I'm just HOPING that's the case.
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UmX (10-09-2017)
10-01-2015, 11:22 PM
#35
Melting Slicks
Cant believe that I'm learning more about my car in here than talking to the tuner....might as well follow suit and start reading about tuning 101, etc.
10-02-2015, 08:33 AM
#36
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St. Jude Donor '15
Pick up some of Greg Banish's books if you want some more theory 
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RicardoFors68 (10-02-2015)
