New Cam-only LS3 dyno results:: 517whp/462wtq 24* timing
03-10-2012, 07:12 PM
#1
Le Mans Master
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St. Jude Donor '11-'12-'13-'14
New Cam-only LS3 dyno results:: 517whp/462wtq 24* timing
**EDIT:** Track results are in. See post 141
After going back and forth on the possibility of adding another bolt-on to the car to break the 500whp mark, I finally pulled the trigger and boy, did it pay off.
With the only addition being a Bare Essentials Racing Ported LS3 intake manifold and a retune, the car picked up 24whp and 18wtq.
Previous best was 493whp and 444wtq after the cam was installed last November.
As you can see in the dyno overlays the fueling was nearly identical in the 2 passes and the entire dyno graph was essentially shifted upwards.
No dyno tricks, no gimmicks
Mod list
Halltech SBMF103
OBX 1 7/8" headers with catless 2.5" x-pipe to stock NPP mufflers
EPS 230/238 .600/.615
BER Ported LS3 intake manifold
CNC Ported throttle body
25% UDP
TR6 plugs
Here is the background story that I feel is most important to share.
I have purchased from Cajun@BER in the past and have always received top notch customer service. Anyone who knows him, also knows he provides a 100% satisfaction guarantee on any parts he sells. Being the pessimistic type, I was hesitant to buy a ported intake manifold against the recommendation of a few very reputable people. "It wont make power, you're good where you are" are a few of the responses I received.
Well, being the stubborn *** that I am, I couldn't leave well enough alone and I wanted so badly to make over 500whp cam-only so the order was placed with Cajun while the manifold was on sale about 2 weeks ago.
The manifold showed up in the middle of the week and I had it installed the same night and I hit the dyno 2 days following.
After a few pulls on the dyno, the car made 499whp and 433wtq, a gain of 6whp, but a LOSS of 11wtq.
Needless to say, I left the dyno very disappointed and I placed an email with Cajun the next morning. My first inclination was to remove the manifold and get ready to ship it back for a refund. At that point, I had spent $30 for dyno time and would have spent another $15 for shipping, but I would have at least tried it out to see how it performed.
This is where things start to get REALLY interesting.
Cajun promptly(as always) emailed me back, very concerned with the news of the cars lack of performance and unbeknownst to me, had forwarded the results onto the BER tuner, Brett.
Within a few hours, I had an email from Brett asking if I could make some adjustments to the tune in order to really get the manifold dialed in. I didn't realize how ignorant I was in the fact that the car needed a touch-up tune to really see results. I just thought I could bolt it on and see more power. Boy was I wrong.
Over the course of a week, Brett and I exchanged literally over a hundred emails about the tune, how to fix it, what it needed, what I could do to make adjustments--he basically taught me a beginners, and then advanced tuning course over the entire week, all without the hint of frustration and without ever seeing the tune. WHO DOES THAT?? He also went out of his way to give me his personal cell phone number so we could exchange texts and voice calls, to further dial in the car and get the fueling/timing right where it needed to be. I would go do some 3rd gear street pulls late at night, log the results, type them out and email them, and he would ask me to make adjustments. Brett uses EFI Live and I had HPTuners so he had to rely on my screenshots and verbal or written interpretation of the log results to make adjustments. He never had my tune in front of him and never had my logs, and he was still able to nail down the tune and intelligently communicate it to me so I could adjust the tune myself. Brett is a rockstar and I can't thank him enough
Never in my life have I had someone take so much of their own free time to help me out and be so passionate about something, expecting absolutely nothing in return. I salute you sir
Armed with my new tuning knowledge, and with the assistance of a local friend and LS guru, Chris Weber, I went to the dyno this morning to get the car dialed in. The results speak for themselves.
I could not have done this without the assistance of a great local friend, and the watchful guidance of Brett. I have the tune and the logs from the passes and the timing was 24* at peak, and a solid 12.4-12.6 air fuel.
Brett, Cajun, you guys are world-class and your attitude and customer service speaks VOLUMES for your character. I applaud you both, and only wish I lived closer so I could take you out for a beer or 3.
I can't thank you enough for all the extra time and hours that were put into this seemingly minor modification. The fact that you went so far above and beyond to help me, leaves me speechless. Thank you so much gentlemen
Now, I only wish I had 1 more day of winter to take this thing to the track and have a timeslip to backup the dyno results. My current best pre-manifold and BER tune is still 10.7@128 and is currently the fastest cam-only LS3 on the Corvette Forum.
Thank you again
Manifold untuned vs cam-only tune in November
Cam-only vs intake manifold tuned
All 3 runs overlayed
After going back and forth on the possibility of adding another bolt-on to the car to break the 500whp mark, I finally pulled the trigger and boy, did it pay off.
With the only addition being a Bare Essentials Racing Ported LS3 intake manifold and a retune, the car picked up 24whp and 18wtq.
Previous best was 493whp and 444wtq after the cam was installed last November.
As you can see in the dyno overlays the fueling was nearly identical in the 2 passes and the entire dyno graph was essentially shifted upwards.
No dyno tricks, no gimmicks
Mod list
Halltech SBMF103
OBX 1 7/8" headers with catless 2.5" x-pipe to stock NPP mufflers
EPS 230/238 .600/.615
BER Ported LS3 intake manifold
CNC Ported throttle body
25% UDP
TR6 plugs
Here is the background story that I feel is most important to share.
I have purchased from Cajun@BER in the past and have always received top notch customer service. Anyone who knows him, also knows he provides a 100% satisfaction guarantee on any parts he sells. Being the pessimistic type, I was hesitant to buy a ported intake manifold against the recommendation of a few very reputable people. "It wont make power, you're good where you are" are a few of the responses I received.
Well, being the stubborn *** that I am, I couldn't leave well enough alone and I wanted so badly to make over 500whp cam-only so the order was placed with Cajun while the manifold was on sale about 2 weeks ago.
The manifold showed up in the middle of the week and I had it installed the same night and I hit the dyno 2 days following.
After a few pulls on the dyno, the car made 499whp and 433wtq, a gain of 6whp, but a LOSS of 11wtq.
Needless to say, I left the dyno very disappointed and I placed an email with Cajun the next morning. My first inclination was to remove the manifold and get ready to ship it back for a refund. At that point, I had spent $30 for dyno time and would have spent another $15 for shipping, but I would have at least tried it out to see how it performed.
This is where things start to get REALLY interesting.
Cajun promptly(as always) emailed me back, very concerned with the news of the cars lack of performance and unbeknownst to me, had forwarded the results onto the BER tuner, Brett.
Within a few hours, I had an email from Brett asking if I could make some adjustments to the tune in order to really get the manifold dialed in. I didn't realize how ignorant I was in the fact that the car needed a touch-up tune to really see results. I just thought I could bolt it on and see more power. Boy was I wrong.
Over the course of a week, Brett and I exchanged literally over a hundred emails about the tune, how to fix it, what it needed, what I could do to make adjustments--he basically taught me a beginners, and then advanced tuning course over the entire week, all without the hint of frustration and without ever seeing the tune. WHO DOES THAT?? He also went out of his way to give me his personal cell phone number so we could exchange texts and voice calls, to further dial in the car and get the fueling/timing right where it needed to be. I would go do some 3rd gear street pulls late at night, log the results, type them out and email them, and he would ask me to make adjustments. Brett uses EFI Live and I had HPTuners so he had to rely on my screenshots and verbal or written interpretation of the log results to make adjustments. He never had my tune in front of him and never had my logs, and he was still able to nail down the tune and intelligently communicate it to me so I could adjust the tune myself. Brett is a rockstar and I can't thank him enough
Never in my life have I had someone take so much of their own free time to help me out and be so passionate about something, expecting absolutely nothing in return. I salute you sir
Armed with my new tuning knowledge, and with the assistance of a local friend and LS guru, Chris Weber, I went to the dyno this morning to get the car dialed in. The results speak for themselves.
I could not have done this without the assistance of a great local friend, and the watchful guidance of Brett. I have the tune and the logs from the passes and the timing was 24* at peak, and a solid 12.4-12.6 air fuel.
Brett, Cajun, you guys are world-class and your attitude and customer service speaks VOLUMES for your character. I applaud you both, and only wish I lived closer so I could take you out for a beer or 3.
I can't thank you enough for all the extra time and hours that were put into this seemingly minor modification. The fact that you went so far above and beyond to help me, leaves me speechless. Thank you so much gentlemen
Now, I only wish I had 1 more day of winter to take this thing to the track and have a timeslip to backup the dyno results. My current best pre-manifold and BER tune is still 10.7@128 and is currently the fastest cam-only LS3 on the Corvette Forum.
Thank you again
Manifold untuned vs cam-only tune in November
Cam-only vs intake manifold tuned
All 3 runs overlayed
Last edited by JUIC3D; 03-18-2012 at 10:13 AM.
03-10-2012, 07:49 PM
#2
Burning Brakes
No problem Justin. It was great dealing with you and I am just glad that it all worked out in the end. Every second on the phone and typing were worth it. You deserve a lot of credit yourself. You took all you could from me and made it happen. Most poeple would not have taken the time to actually figure out the issue and just bashed the product. So cudo's to you and I hope you are happy with the results. Now take that top spot on the drag list and all goals will have been met. Let me know if you need anything else.
03-10-2012, 08:14 PM
#4
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St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12'-'13-'14-'15
It is our pleasure Sir. At BER we place the customer above ALL else. We favor integrity, honor and trust over money. Thanks for your continued support of Bare Essentials Racing.
Cajun@BER
Cajun@BER
03-10-2012, 09:04 PM
#7
Team Owner
That should result in a solid 2/10ths reduction in ET and full 2mph gain in trap speed, 
I bet you can truly feel those kind of power gains. 
Dyno sheets are nice and all but I want to see those other 'narrower' sheets of paper as well.
10.5s at 130+mph?
I bet you can truly feel those kind of power gains. Dyno sheets are nice and all but I want to see those other 'narrower' sheets of paper as well.
10.5s at 130+mph?
03-10-2012, 09:06 PM
#8
Tech Contributor
No problem Justin. It was great dealing with you and I am just glad that it all worked out in the end. Every second on the phone and typing were worth it. You deserve a lot of credit yourself. You took all you could from me and made it happen. Most poeple would not have taken the time to actually figure out the issue and just bashed the product. So cudo's to you and I hope you are happy with the results. Now take that top spot on the drag list and all goals will have been met. Let me know if you need anything else.
Justin is a quick study, that is for sure.
I am also quite impressed with the car Justin! Way to go!!
Justin post up the change from your first run today to your best....that's all tuning related, and was really impressive.
Is that the record for LS3 cam only? Has to be close.
03-10-2012, 09:17 PM
#10
Former Vendor
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Location: Tampa FL
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St. Jude Donor '07-'08-'09-'10-'11-'12'-'13-'14-'15
03-10-2012, 10:00 PM
#12
Burning Brakes
Like Cajun said, it was our pleasure. Just want the customer to be happy in the end. I too am wondering if this is some kind of record. I have some ideas of some more things we could do if you want to stay cam only.
Joe G. Good point. I hadn't looked at what tuning really got. But 18/29rw is pretty darn good from just tuning. Good job Justin.
Joe G. Good point. I hadn't looked at what tuning really got. But 18/29rw is pretty darn good from just tuning. Good job Justin.
Last edited by PRAY; 03-10-2012 at 10:04 PM.
03-10-2012, 10:07 PM
#14
Burning Brakes
The clutch was my major concern for today considering that it gave up twice at the track two nights ago. Let Cajun get you the Mcleod RXT you were talking about and lets see what happens.
03-11-2012, 03:05 AM
#15
Le Mans Master
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St. Jude Donor '11-'12-'13-'14
Thank you everyone for the kind words.
Yes, a clutch is absolutely the next step as I can't see the stock clutch holding out for much longer. It smelled really bad even on the dyno so I know it's not in a happy place. I did a couple spirited pulls tonight and the pedal wanted to fall to the floor. I really think it has finally given up the ghost.
I didn't get Joe-esque life out of it, but all things considered, 29k street miles, 150 quarter mile passes(81 of which were with the cam), and numerous trips to Mexico-I feel like I'm on borrowed time. Everyone I speak to at the track is astonished to see it cut the 60ft times that it does consistently. It takes a lot of slipping to launch it at 5500-6000 to get the 1.5s so I'm thankful it has lasted this long.
Who knows though, it may even hold out for 1 final 10.6 or better pass if I can get lucky enough to have a cold front grace me with its presence.
Either way, while I do love the power the car put down, until I realize the gains at the track, this is all just for fun. I'm not racing dyno sheets and frankly, I'll be embarrassed and perturbed if the car doesn't take the top spot in the internal LS3 category, even if that does require a stronger clutch. It has more than enough power right now so it should just be a matter of a good track day and 500DA or better.
Thanks again for all the kind words.
Oh, just a side note--last Thursday when I tried to take it down the track after my elementary tuning skills were applied, the clutch finally held on for 1000' and I was able to go another 10.8@128. At the 1000' mark though, I felt the clutch pedal falling to the floor so I quickly reached down with my left toe and pulled it back up. I'm not sure how much, if any, effect that had on the run.
With that same tune, the first pull on the dyno made 508/443, an improvement of 9hp/10tq from the best of the back to back to back pulls after the manifold was installed.
Thanks again everyone.
Yes, a clutch is absolutely the next step as I can't see the stock clutch holding out for much longer. It smelled really bad even on the dyno so I know it's not in a happy place. I did a couple spirited pulls tonight and the pedal wanted to fall to the floor. I really think it has finally given up the ghost.
I didn't get Joe-esque life out of it, but all things considered, 29k street miles, 150 quarter mile passes(81 of which were with the cam), and numerous trips to Mexico-I feel like I'm on borrowed time. Everyone I speak to at the track is astonished to see it cut the 60ft times that it does consistently. It takes a lot of slipping to launch it at 5500-6000 to get the 1.5s so I'm thankful it has lasted this long.
Who knows though, it may even hold out for 1 final 10.6 or better pass if I can get lucky enough to have a cold front grace me with its presence.
Either way, while I do love the power the car put down, until I realize the gains at the track, this is all just for fun. I'm not racing dyno sheets and frankly, I'll be embarrassed and perturbed if the car doesn't take the top spot in the internal LS3 category, even if that does require a stronger clutch. It has more than enough power right now so it should just be a matter of a good track day and 500DA or better.
Thanks again for all the kind words.
Oh, just a side note--last Thursday when I tried to take it down the track after my elementary tuning skills were applied, the clutch finally held on for 1000' and I was able to go another 10.8@128. At the 1000' mark though, I felt the clutch pedal falling to the floor so I quickly reached down with my left toe and pulled it back up. I'm not sure how much, if any, effect that had on the run.
With that same tune, the first pull on the dyno made 508/443, an improvement of 9hp/10tq from the best of the back to back to back pulls after the manifold was installed.
Thanks again everyone.
03-11-2012, 03:21 AM
#16
Le Mans Master
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St. Jude Donor '11-'12-'13-'14
I think it's fairly obvious that I recommend them
Log showed 81% at 6600rpm(end of the pull) so I'd say it's doing really well. I'm not sure if that will change on the street versus the dyno but I feel like I remember seeing closer to 90% or higher when I was doing my street pulls. Perhaps the additional load requires more fuel, ceteris paribus?
I'm still new to this stuff so maybe someone can chime in and confirm.
Log showed 81% at 6600rpm(end of the pull) so I'd say it's doing really well. I'm not sure if that will change on the street versus the dyno but I feel like I remember seeing closer to 90% or higher when I was doing my street pulls. Perhaps the additional load requires more fuel, ceteris paribus?
I'm still new to this stuff so maybe someone can chime in and confirm.
03-11-2012, 04:16 AM
#17
Melting Slicks
Nice pick up.
..and If I'm not mistaken, if you save your tune as a .tun file instead of an .hpt file, your tuner using EFI Live should be able to open it.
..and If I'm not mistaken, if you save your tune as a .tun file instead of an .hpt file, your tuner using EFI Live should be able to open it.
03-11-2012, 07:43 AM
#18
Burning Brakes
If you were smelling the clutch on the dyno then it was slipping IMHO. If there is no friction there is no smell. Since the pull is done with the clutch already applied I would say it would need to be slipping to smell.
I know the dyno drum is only around 2,000lbs so that is all you are accelerating. Unlike on the street where you have the full weight of the car. I am not sure if that is what requires more fuel or if it the air being ramed into the engine on the street vs. the static air on the dyno. Were the three tables I had you originally check the same for the street and dyno pulls? I would assume they were lower on the dyno. Either way, most of the time the fueling will change a little bit on the street. I believe it has more to do new peramaters being hit on the street that were previously untuned on the dyno than anything.
I know the dyno drum is only around 2,000lbs so that is all you are accelerating. Unlike on the street where you have the full weight of the car. I am not sure if that is what requires more fuel or if it the air being ramed into the engine on the street vs. the static air on the dyno. Were the three tables I had you originally check the same for the street and dyno pulls? I would assume they were lower on the dyno. Either way, most of the time the fueling will change a little bit on the street. I believe it has more to do new peramaters being hit on the street that were previously untuned on the dyno than anything.
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03-11-2012, 07:45 AM
#19
Burning Brakes
That would be great. I know if a car is tuned with HPT I can plug into the car and read the tune. It would make sense that if the tunes were saved as a .tun file I would be able to read them.
03-11-2012, 09:25 AM
#20
Drifting
Justin...Amazing HP and torque results! I believe you made more power than anyone else from that combination. Can't wait to see track results. We are having a challenge race on March 17th at PBIR...Any chance your coming?
