[Z06] '07 z06 vs '05 z51 vs '05 subaru legacy gt wagon (220hp turbo awd)
10-12-2006, 06:39 PM
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Melting Slicks
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'07 z06 vs '05 z51 vs '05 subaru legacy gt wagon (220hp turbo awd)
Now that I've had the z for a little while, I thought I'd post my comparisons from the z51. Some of them, I'm sure, are simply '05 vs '07 issues, NOT specific to the z. Also thought it would be interesting to compare against my grocery getter for some points.
First of all, I work from home. So almost all of my driving is pleasure driving (or errand driving). Yet still I manage to put 30k+ combined mileage/yr on all the cars! Factor that in as you read my comments.
Exterior:
OK, to begin, the looks of the z are ... amazing. My gf even remarks how much she loves the look of the z, and she's not much of a car person (she's into vipers lol). We have a home gym in the garage and she was sad when I got the car cover! I told a story earlier about some little kid in town going crazy over seeing the car, but also a jeep and a civic were trying to race me through the twisties. This was all on the first day. Lucky for them I follow break-in! Or maybe not, maybe they would have loved to see me pull away.
Anyway, the subtle styling difference between the coupe and the z is just incredible. Everywhere I go, the car just gets looks. Pretty much on every outing someone talks to me about the car and loves to hear the details about it. It really gets the attention a supercar deserves. It might help that the z is black compared to the coupe being mag red. With the coupe, I think I had to imagine people checking it out just to make myself feel better.
The downside of the attention is more police attention. Got pulled over twice in the first week. And no, I'm not driving the z crazier than I did the coupe.
Everyone complains about the polished wheels. On the coupe, my polished wheels made me wonder what folks were complaining about! They were pretty damn good. Not perfect, but a lot better than just acceptable. But on the Z, I'm pretty disappointed. I'll have to get them stripped and re-polished. Also, people complain about the general fit and finish, which isn't up to the euro standards, but still it's acceptable ... just. The wheels, however, are the one area where GM really needs to step it up. They make an otherwise great car look like ***.
I like that the shark fin XM antenna is gone. I wonder where it is now.
Damn taillights still leak ... why can't GM put a simple seal there?? Easily fixed (scparts) but I shouldn't have to do this. Now that I think about it, I guess I could just blow that area out with compressed air after washing it.
Same poor visibility (limited angle of view and extremely high distortion) through the rear window.
Interior:
Steering wheel is fantastic. FAR better than the ship's wheel in the coupe ... always had to apologize for that. I wonder if the z steering wheel can be retrofitted to the coupe. The z wheel is almost as good as the factory momo wheel in the subaru. I love having the radio buttons right on the wheel. I always thought that was a gimmick in other cars, but it's really convenient. Only thing, I wish there was a 6-1 button in addition to the 1-6 button. Here's a good place to talk about the idiocy of a touch screen yet still limit presets to specific bands; i.e. 6 presets per band (xm1,xm2,fm1,fm2,am). These aren't physical presets like in 1950's radios, there's no reason I shouldn't be able to have 30 presets and I can pick and choose the band and station per preset. Why the *f* do I need 6 am presets??
Seats aren't as good as the coupe. I really miss the lumbar and bolster ... not the adjustability but the max setting. Also, the seats are in general not as comfortable. Even on short trips I am frequently adjusting my position in the chair. These seats also really need holes for a harness. The z06 stitching is nice.
Never really thought the floormats were all that bad until I got the Lloyd's. Wow.
Wow it was stupid to move the passenger air bag light to the mirror. Gonna have to figure out how to disconnect the light.
Center console is mostly unusable due to trans tunnel heat.
The touch screen operates much better. I never find myself trying over and over to hit a target, or to get a touch to register.
The nav system is about the same -- it's ok if considered on its own, but sucky compared to others I've seen. Having instructions come up on the HUD makes up for it though, and then some. I am also upset that it got me lost on the first trip. It didn't know about a traffic circle and sent me the wrong way. But when it turned me around, funny enough it knew about the circle when coming from the other direction. The best nav I've seen is in the new Audi's. Amazing. But I'll take the HUD instructions any day. Subaru didn't even have a nav option back in '05. I think they have one today.
The tuner in the radio isn't that good. hmm even more, it's actually quite bad. Maybe this has more to do with the antenna than the tuner. It was the same for the coupe. Sure, I live a little bit out in the sticks, but the Subaru doesn't have any issues.
The Bose speakers are awful. The best thing I can say about it is that it's noticeably better than the '05 (with top on; top off I'm not sure how you're gonna help things too much). Luckily there's a place not too far from me that specializes in supercar stereo work. Hopefully the stock head unit will be ok once the speakers are improved. I'm totally amazed that there are even standalone Bose stores. Shouldn't they just sell this stuff at Wal-mart? The factory stereo in the Subaru (with subwoofer option) is better than either of the vettes.
Road noise is excessive enough that some folks might not like this car as a daily driver. The coupe was well within "normal car" limits.
The little touch of the cargo cover is fantastic.
I'd get the rear cargo organizer but I think it will interfere with backing up; I put my hand over the rear divider when backing.
I don't miss the hatch assist; it never worked for me on the coupe anyway. If I closed the hatch too slowly, it wouldn't have enough force to trigger the assist; if I closed the hatch too fast, air wouldn't have enough time to get out of the way and would act as a cushion. There should be a door switch that detects the hatch is open and indexes the windows (duh). I had to get a window valet just to address this problem. OTOH, I even with the coupe I thought it was awesome that the car was so airtight that you couldn't close the hatch.
Anyone know how to get the outside air vent to open without the fan being on? Never could figure this out on the coupe either.
I love the climate control features on both cars. Much better than the Subaru.
Handling:
No contest.
My major remark here is that the car is so stiff, many folks might not like this car as a daily driver. I remember thinking the coupe was stuck to the road but still very livable -- I never understood the reviews saying the z51 suspension was too stiff and non-race uses should stick to the F55. It would be interesting to go back and see what those reviewers wrote about the z suspension.
Drivetrain:
No contest on power.
Transmission gearing in the z could be better. (I think changing the rear gears alone would be a mistake.) The coupe with the z51 gears was really good.
It's definitely harder to drive the z in traffic. The coupe drove like a "normal" car, just one that's high performance. The z requires an easier touch with the clutch. I actually liked 1-4 CAGS on the coupe, but on the z it's a problem; at the low load that the CAGS kicks in the engine wants to give up on that 1-4 shift.
Shifter is a lot better in the z. (Please don't tell me it's the same as the coupe!)
I love the exhaust cutouts. It's also awesome how the car starts up with them open, then they close right away. I haven't tried pulling the fuse yet, I'm happy with it quiet ... for now. If I do H/C I'll probably install a switch. And I probably won't do H/C ... it'll probably be years before I'm a good enough driver to take advantage of even more power, and at that point I will probably move to radicals? Seems cheaper and more fun. Plus, without thinking, I paid for the extra warranty so I hate to have done that then go and void it.
It's interesting, the z takes longer to warm up than the coupe.
Mileage:
coupe: don't remember, but not bad.
z51: @ 75 mph, 6th gear, a/c @ 75, level road, 25 mpg. Better than the Subaru!!!
First of all, I work from home. So almost all of my driving is pleasure driving (or errand driving). Yet still I manage to put 30k+ combined mileage/yr on all the cars! Factor that in as you read my comments.
Exterior:
OK, to begin, the looks of the z are ... amazing. My gf even remarks how much she loves the look of the z, and she's not much of a car person (she's into vipers lol). We have a home gym in the garage and she was sad when I got the car cover! I told a story earlier about some little kid in town going crazy over seeing the car, but also a jeep and a civic were trying to race me through the twisties. This was all on the first day. Lucky for them I follow break-in! Or maybe not, maybe they would have loved to see me pull away.
Anyway, the subtle styling difference between the coupe and the z is just incredible. Everywhere I go, the car just gets looks. Pretty much on every outing someone talks to me about the car and loves to hear the details about it. It really gets the attention a supercar deserves. It might help that the z is black compared to the coupe being mag red. With the coupe, I think I had to imagine people checking it out just to make myself feel better.The downside of the attention is more police attention. Got pulled over twice in the first week. And no, I'm not driving the z crazier than I did the coupe.
Everyone complains about the polished wheels. On the coupe, my polished wheels made me wonder what folks were complaining about! They were pretty damn good. Not perfect, but a lot better than just acceptable. But on the Z, I'm pretty disappointed. I'll have to get them stripped and re-polished. Also, people complain about the general fit and finish, which isn't up to the euro standards, but still it's acceptable ... just. The wheels, however, are the one area where GM really needs to step it up. They make an otherwise great car look like ***.
I like that the shark fin XM antenna is gone. I wonder where it is now.
Damn taillights still leak ... why can't GM put a simple seal there?? Easily fixed (scparts) but I shouldn't have to do this. Now that I think about it, I guess I could just blow that area out with compressed air after washing it.
Same poor visibility (limited angle of view and extremely high distortion) through the rear window.
Interior:
Steering wheel is fantastic. FAR better than the ship's wheel in the coupe ... always had to apologize for that. I wonder if the z steering wheel can be retrofitted to the coupe. The z wheel is almost as good as the factory momo wheel in the subaru. I love having the radio buttons right on the wheel. I always thought that was a gimmick in other cars, but it's really convenient. Only thing, I wish there was a 6-1 button in addition to the 1-6 button. Here's a good place to talk about the idiocy of a touch screen yet still limit presets to specific bands; i.e. 6 presets per band (xm1,xm2,fm1,fm2,am). These aren't physical presets like in 1950's radios, there's no reason I shouldn't be able to have 30 presets and I can pick and choose the band and station per preset. Why the *f* do I need 6 am presets??
Seats aren't as good as the coupe. I really miss the lumbar and bolster ... not the adjustability but the max setting. Also, the seats are in general not as comfortable. Even on short trips I am frequently adjusting my position in the chair. These seats also really need holes for a harness. The z06 stitching is nice.
Never really thought the floormats were all that bad until I got the Lloyd's. Wow.
Wow it was stupid to move the passenger air bag light to the mirror. Gonna have to figure out how to disconnect the light.
Center console is mostly unusable due to trans tunnel heat.
The touch screen operates much better. I never find myself trying over and over to hit a target, or to get a touch to register.
The nav system is about the same -- it's ok if considered on its own, but sucky compared to others I've seen. Having instructions come up on the HUD makes up for it though, and then some. I am also upset that it got me lost on the first trip. It didn't know about a traffic circle and sent me the wrong way. But when it turned me around, funny enough it knew about the circle when coming from the other direction. The best nav I've seen is in the new Audi's. Amazing. But I'll take the HUD instructions any day. Subaru didn't even have a nav option back in '05. I think they have one today.
The tuner in the radio isn't that good. hmm even more, it's actually quite bad. Maybe this has more to do with the antenna than the tuner. It was the same for the coupe. Sure, I live a little bit out in the sticks, but the Subaru doesn't have any issues.
The Bose speakers are awful. The best thing I can say about it is that it's noticeably better than the '05 (with top on; top off I'm not sure how you're gonna help things too much). Luckily there's a place not too far from me that specializes in supercar stereo work. Hopefully the stock head unit will be ok once the speakers are improved. I'm totally amazed that there are even standalone Bose stores. Shouldn't they just sell this stuff at Wal-mart? The factory stereo in the Subaru (with subwoofer option) is better than either of the vettes.
Road noise is excessive enough that some folks might not like this car as a daily driver. The coupe was well within "normal car" limits.
The little touch of the cargo cover is fantastic.
I'd get the rear cargo organizer but I think it will interfere with backing up; I put my hand over the rear divider when backing.
I don't miss the hatch assist; it never worked for me on the coupe anyway. If I closed the hatch too slowly, it wouldn't have enough force to trigger the assist; if I closed the hatch too fast, air wouldn't have enough time to get out of the way and would act as a cushion. There should be a door switch that detects the hatch is open and indexes the windows (duh). I had to get a window valet just to address this problem. OTOH, I even with the coupe I thought it was awesome that the car was so airtight that you couldn't close the hatch.
Anyone know how to get the outside air vent to open without the fan being on? Never could figure this out on the coupe either.
I love the climate control features on both cars. Much better than the Subaru.
Handling:
No contest.
My major remark here is that the car is so stiff, many folks might not like this car as a daily driver. I remember thinking the coupe was stuck to the road but still very livable -- I never understood the reviews saying the z51 suspension was too stiff and non-race uses should stick to the F55. It would be interesting to go back and see what those reviewers wrote about the z suspension.
Drivetrain:
No contest on power.
Transmission gearing in the z could be better. (I think changing the rear gears alone would be a mistake.) The coupe with the z51 gears was really good.
It's definitely harder to drive the z in traffic. The coupe drove like a "normal" car, just one that's high performance. The z requires an easier touch with the clutch. I actually liked 1-4 CAGS on the coupe, but on the z it's a problem; at the low load that the CAGS kicks in the engine wants to give up on that 1-4 shift.
Shifter is a lot better in the z. (Please don't tell me it's the same as the coupe!)
I love the exhaust cutouts. It's also awesome how the car starts up with them open, then they close right away. I haven't tried pulling the fuse yet, I'm happy with it quiet ... for now. If I do H/C I'll probably install a switch. And I probably won't do H/C ... it'll probably be years before I'm a good enough driver to take advantage of even more power, and at that point I will probably move to radicals? Seems cheaper and more fun. Plus, without thinking, I paid for the extra warranty so I hate to have done that then go and void it.
It's interesting, the z takes longer to warm up than the coupe.
Mileage:
coupe: don't remember, but not bad.
z51: @ 75 mph, 6th gear, a/c @ 75, level road, 25 mpg. Better than the Subaru!!!
10-12-2006, 07:37 PM
#2
Heel & Toe
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I second that!
Interestingly, I had an 05 z51 and now a 06 z06 (yours is an 07?), so we have similar reviews.
I agree with just about everything you said!
A few notes:
My center console isnt very hot. It was for a short while but it got better after some break in.
I disagree about the touch screen, I cant tell the difference between the two. Is it possible your z51 had some trouble? Or maybe the 07 touch screen is improved over the 06 and I just dont know how bad I have it.
I disagree about the gearing, I think the z06 gearing is just fine as it is. I dont think gearing it down would help much. Mine's almost stock (tune, plugs, and filter) and it has traction problems in first when it's cold out. I dont mean beating on it - just rolling into the throttle at 2000, it spins the tires around 4500.
With stock tires, even on a completely stock car I think it would be a mistake to drop the gear ratio. Drag radials would be a different story, however I dont know how many corvette owners are willing to deal with rubber that soft (rocks being thrown up).
Overall though, I strongly agree with nearly all of your assessment. Especially about the steering wheel.
I agree with just about everything you said!
A few notes:
My center console isnt very hot. It was for a short while but it got better after some break in.
I disagree about the touch screen, I cant tell the difference between the two. Is it possible your z51 had some trouble? Or maybe the 07 touch screen is improved over the 06 and I just dont know how bad I have it.
I disagree about the gearing, I think the z06 gearing is just fine as it is. I dont think gearing it down would help much. Mine's almost stock (tune, plugs, and filter) and it has traction problems in first when it's cold out. I dont mean beating on it - just rolling into the throttle at 2000, it spins the tires around 4500.
With stock tires, even on a completely stock car I think it would be a mistake to drop the gear ratio. Drag radials would be a different story, however I dont know how many corvette owners are willing to deal with rubber that soft (rocks being thrown up).
Overall though, I strongly agree with nearly all of your assessment. Especially about the steering wheel.
10-12-2006, 09:39 PM
#4
Melting Slicks
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Originally Posted by Slart
I disagree about the touch screen, I cant tell the difference between the two. Is it possible your z51 had some trouble? Or maybe the 07 touch screen is improved over the 06 and I just dont know how bad I have it.
I'm wondering if you notice a difference in the speakers? Did you have the Bose option in both cars?
10-12-2006, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by mousecatcher
I like that the shark fin XM antenna is gone. I wonder where it is now.
10-13-2006, 07:34 PM
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Melting Slicks
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Originally Posted by 98Pacecar
Look at the inside of your windshield at the top of the passenger side. You'll see a black plastic box adhered to the windscreen.....I believe it's in there.
10-14-2006, 12:40 AM
#10
Melting Slicks
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forgot about the turn signals!
How could I forget this one!
On the coupe, the soft stop before "locking" the turn signal is too soft. On the z06, they fixed it to be like a normal car. I doubt this one is z06-specific, probably this is just an '07 (or maybe '06) improvement.
And of course, you don't have to shift into reverse to turn the power off in the '07. yay! (I think this was introduced in '06.)
I was referring to the oil temp. Duh, this is because of the dry sump.
On the coupe, the soft stop before "locking" the turn signal is too soft. On the z06, they fixed it to be like a normal car. I doubt this one is z06-specific, probably this is just an '07 (or maybe '06) improvement.
And of course, you don't have to shift into reverse to turn the power off in the '07. yay! (I think this was introduced in '06.)
Originally Posted by mousecatcher
It's interesting, the z takes longer to warm up than the coupe.
10-14-2006, 06:32 AM
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Why the hell is there a subaru on this board???? It has NO place here. They are not in the same league as an 02 SS camaro let alone a regular C6 or a Z! That is an insult to the Z and all Z owners, in my opinion. Why don't you compare the accord with it too?! Shheeesh!
Lets try to talk about vehicles that are at least somewhat close in comparison.
subaru...