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[Z06] For those interested...here are my testing results for the Holley High Ram w/102mm TB
C6 Corvette ZR1 & Z06General info about GM’s Corvette Supercar, LS9 Corvette Technical Info, Performance Upgrades, Suspension Setup for Street or Track
For those interested...here are my testing results for the Holley High Ram w/102mm TB
On my journey to 700+ RWHP for my NA LS7 I've actually tested 6 different intake manifold configurations in the ruthless pursuit of the magic numbers.....the OEM stock LS7 intake, Ported OEM LS7 intake, Beck Sheetmetal, MAST CNC aluminum LSX, Holley High Ram front opening and Holley High Ram top mount!
What's interesting is that there really are no surprises per se, just to recap:
......the ported OEM LS7 stock intake makes +13/0 RWHP/RWTQ more at peak than the stock manifold and I believe this would be similar to the Holley plastic LSx 102mm intake with a 90mm TB. Now with the 90mm TB on the Beck sheetmetal intake, the gains are is +21/4 RWHP/RWTQ over the stock LS7 intake set-up. The upper RPM HP gains made with a 102mm vs 90mm TB on the Beck intake vs stock OEM make a significant difference +42/4 RWHP/RWTQ!
Now here is where you have to have trust in the testing process and a little Algebra....the graph below demonstrates irrefutably that the ~$700 Holley High Ram basically performs about the same as my $2500 Beck Sheetmetal intake. I wouldn't consider +2/4 RWHP/RWTQ as statistically significant when compared to that of the Beck's performance so I HOPE that we can all agree that the Holley and Beck really perform about the same and that this small of a difference is "noise level".
If we can agree on this much, then you can reverse engineer your way backwards to compare the Holley with the Ported OEM LS7 intakes and stock LS7 intakes using the data that I have provide above and the graphs below. Of course your have to use the 680 RWHP graph as the baseline for direct comparisons because the difference is, the 706 RWHP for the Holley is with Morgan heads vs Good heads so the only way to get back to apples is to remember that your can't compare the 706 RWHP Holley against the stock OEM LS7 intake with a 90mm ported TB and say hey, the Holley is good for +66/28 RWHP/RWTQ, it's only +42/4 but still I think that this is HUGE! And yes, you likely need a motor making the power level that I am to see similar gains so please don't go bolt the Holley on your stock LS7 and then be disappointed after cutting up your C6 cowl to make it fit....this HP difference is representative for a max effort set-up!
Here is the Beck vs Holley:
I didn't talk about it much but here is where I tested the Holley with a flat top (tunnel ram style top) and mounted the TB on top vs the Holley front mount and Beck...as you can see no significant difference:
And lastly, the graph comparing the Holley to the Beck to the Ported OEM LS7 to the Stock LS7:
Couple questions.....was the same cam used ?
If so, are you at liberty to post the events ?
If not, could we agree that the results could be even greater ?
Also, didn't see the single plane cnced Mast results, did you test it ?.....which I feel with the correct cam would beat all the manifolds (depending on the TB choice).
Thanks for taking the time to post all of this.......
Yes, same cam for all tests except for stock baselines where the OEM LS7 hydraulic roller was used.
If so, are you at liberty to post the events ?
If not, could we agree that the results could be even greater ?
I am happy to share, there a lot of people that still doubt my efforts and results and have no idea how very tightly controlled these tests are performed to eliminate as many variables as possible:
The cam is a solid roller manufactured by Bullet to my spec's and here's the complete set-up:
Also, didn't see the single plane cnced Mast results, did you test it ?
Actually I have...what test would be complete without it! Here are the results of the MAST LSX Carb style vs the Beck when I was at the 680 RWHP level, the LSX actually made 10RWHP more!
When I tried the LSX with the Morgan heads it ran a bit richer than the Beck and because I knew from previous experiments that when the timing tables were dead on and when the A/F was only slightly out of whack that there was only about 3-5 HP to be gained going from low 12's A/F up to mid 12's where it was with the Beck at peak HP...since the LSX running rich was only making right at 700 for RWHP with the Morgan heads I just bagged spending the effort to finish dialing it in logically reasoning that it would at best likely equal the Beck Sheetmetal or maybe surpass it by 2 or 3 HP which again is within the repeatability margin of error anyway...not really worth my time to find out. Of course the argument could be made that the lower RPM torque was up a bit, however, the drivability isn't there unless you changeover to a 4150 or 4500 style TB and then switch to SD tune. Since I wanted to run the car at the track ASAP, I didn't plan to race it with the LSX intake but in the long run, it may likely be the best choice if hood clearance isn't an issue! Here's the graph showing this after multiple tweaks:
One question for me would be why no ported Fast w/102 tb?
Great question...I bought the Beck before the FAST came out and after dropping $2500 on the Beck the results I saw posted for the FAST 102 just weren't compelling enough to say that it would make more than the Beck set-up.
Did you measure the runner length of these intakes and if so could you share your results.
Within 1/2" of each other.
Also, did you play with the ICL? Advancing and retarding it? I seen 1 deg make significant difference.
I agree based on my previous testing but I did not this time but you can bet if I was in the mid 690 range I would have spent as much time as it would have taken moving the cam to squeeze a few more ponies out to crack 700 sometimes you get lucky!
Do you plan on testing the new "MSD" intake? Seems like a nice piece.
I've already spent ~$7k on intakes and TB's and they're sitting on the shelf....I might just sit on the sidelines and watch independent testing...if the results look very promising I might be inclined but a fellow Forum member could certainly convince me to pre-test theirs for them (free of charge of course)
What were the difference for the two cylinder heads (Good - Morgan) were they both from factory castings or was one an aftermarket one? Did the Morgan have more work done on exhaust side etc.
What were the difference for the two cylinder heads (Good - Morgan) were they both from factory castings or was one an aftermarket one? Did the Morgan have more work done on exhaust side etc.
Good heads were LS7, Morgan Heads LSX 6 bolt and the Morgan's heads just flowed more on both intake and exhaust.
wow your making me want a nw102 now, iv never seen any threads wherre guys make much power with them! did you notice a major difference in driveability or throttle response going to the 102? and what compression are you running?
wow your making me want a nw102 now, iv never seen any threads wherre guys make much power with them! did you notice a major difference in driveability or throttle response going to the 102? and what compression are you running?
Throttle response is crisp (I also have 4.11 gears) and after the head milling static compression is 12.78.
12-06-2014, 01:07 PM
For those interested...here are my testing results for the Holley High Ram w/102mm TB
sometimes you get lucky!
