GeneSch

I'm on your side. If you were not told up front what you should use and what you cant use then its a failure not a miss use.

Call mast or who ever specked the heads and said "This will work great!!" If no one will stand behind them then your better off with your stock heads.

Mark2009

Mounting anecdotal evidence indicates that lash caps should be used, not inserts.

Again, unneeded mods can = unforseen problems.

Unreal

How is this an unneeded mod? He is building a 1000+hp crazy car. Doing some high end 6 bolt heads isn't an unneeded mod at that point IMO.

But yes, building anything had plenty of unforseen problems.

harveyjl

Next step? not real sure I have my builder calling and doing what he can, Ferrea is apparently no help, I am not upgrading the rockers, way to many people run stock with no problems. no need in spending 2K for rockers on the cam that I am using.

Unreal You are absolutely correct and this is exactly what I told my builder when we called then and told them what we wanted and this is what we had they should of said wait, we would recommend this, or this. They had also told my builder that they have been working on a bulletin to post stating the failures they have seen like this. (I haven't ever heard of another case like this one using ferrea valves). The point is they dont state it anywhere and that was my big bitch.


1200+rwhp car, with room to grow and plans to run the new 6870 turbo, every mod I have put in this car is needed.

harveyjl

Unforseen problems, are unseen because manufactures hind the reason the parts failed or point the finger somewhere else. If more people would make the problems known and share the experience this would happen a lot less, but that is just my opinion I could be wrong.

Michael_D

That's bullshiit..... Tip inserts are there so you don't need to run lash caps. I Guarantee that lash is harder on tips than those pesky oem rockers. Ferrea can pound sand. I'll be calling my contact with them and sending him to this thread.

harveyjl

Maybe I wasnt clear but they recommended running the ferrea titanium valves with out hardened tips, and since we wouldn't have the hardened tips they said the lash caps would be better since I am still running stock rockers.

And yes please send him this thread, we have been talking to John, hopefully your guy can get more out of them than we are. Its doubtful but a possibility....


If he wants any additional info on this he can contact me at Joshua.harvey@rocketmail.com, I will be glad to talk to anyone that can help.

Unreal

Who did you buy the heads from? If ferrara won't stand by them will Mast?

GeneSch

No warranty on race parts, sorry. Could you please send us your bad parts so our RD department can learn from this. Have a great day. Oh and could you please take this survey at the end and tell us how great we are doing. Thanks.

meinersk

Lol ....he should send parts back at $92 each ..

Unreal

One reason I like Jason@TSP, if this happened to me with <5k miles, he would back his product up and replace them. Going on 22k miles on my PRC285s with TI intakes and no issues. One of the best mods I've done to my z06.

Z06_1

Not completely relevant, but this was (one of) the factors in my decision to not go with Ti exhausts (no lash caps).

Mark2009

In the OP he says 7200 RPM @ .650 lift. That is generally with the guidelines of the stock valves, making the aftermarket intakes an unnecessary mod.

If he was previously throwing lash caps then he probably had valve float or bounce (which could also break the inserts). The OEM lash cap is only 0.117" 'deep' so it wouldn't take too much valvetrain instability to get loose.

Unreal

But he isn't using stock heads, so you are saying he should have ordered MAST heads, then ordered some stock GM valves to put in them? I get what you are saying, but when he purchased a $4500+ set of "badass" mast heads, they shouldn't fall apart like this, and he shouldn't be sourcing his own parts to put in them when he is ordering complete heads.

harveyjl

I bought them from Mast and they came with Trick Titanium valves with hardened tips, but due to the issue with the Trick Titanium valves I chose to upgrade to ferrea.

Pretty sure stock valves will not fit Mast heads, which are also listed in the first post.....

harveyjl

And just for confirmation stock head take a 2.20 intake valve and MAST heads take a 2.250, so yes an aftermarket intake valve is a necessary mod, but thanks for your input.

Mark2009

According to post #27, Ferrea recommended lash caps, as I did in post #22, so I presume they offer valves that can accommodate them.

So, the tip insert was an unnecessary mod.


.

harveyjl

Well being that the stock heads had been converted over to hardened tips with no issues at all, we didnt see an issue with continuing to use a titanium valve with hardened tips, but switched vendors, apparently that is where we messed up. I and others have ran the hardened tip with stock rockers for a while with out a single failure, until now. I dont see why ferrea valves with hardened tips cant hold a stock rocker when plenty of other companies including Victory, xceldyne, del west all use a hardened tip with stock rockers with no tips. The part that was unnecessary was switching vendors not the mod.....

Mark2009

I've seen several such broken valves (Ti w/insert) posted here.... wouldn't touch 'em with a 10' pole (design looks dodgy as well).

I'd suggest sending one to a lab for failure analysis.

harveyjl

They are at ferrea's engineering department. Going to try and work something out with them if its possible, if they dont want to work something out I will be going to another vendor. Regardless of which vendor we go with we will be using lash caps