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$80K is too high!!! Those halo models don't sell any volume, and I doubt they make much money, if any. GM is in the business to make money. It wasn't that long ago they lost their way, and went bankrupt. They just sold Opel because it didn't make money.
Also the base price of the current car is NOT $60K. It's $56,445, including freight. Adding over $23K to the price will lose most people. Chevy needs to working their rears off to make the ME car affordable and at the price of the old car, even if they have to pull some luxury content out.
Michael
Corvette production numbers for 2016 were "A total of 40,689 Corvettes were produced. This is up by 6,449 cars or almost 19%. The highest selling model was the Stingray Coupe, garnering 52.6%, followed by the Z06 Coupe with 28.4%. Stingray Convertibles accounted for 12.4% and Z06 Convertibles trailed with 6.7%."
So 11,555 Z06 coupes and 2,726 Z06 Convertibles. That's 14,281 $100k corvettes.
I'd say they'd sell enough ME corvettes at $80k to be profitable.
Reading through the articles the case is made that we will see a C8 front engine evolution of C7 and a mid engine Zora built to compete against Ford GT, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc. Two cars with drastically different price points commensurate with technology and lightweight materials used in construction. The Corvette will move forward benefitting from bleed down of technology from Zora as Camaro has moved forward from bleed down of technology from Corvette.
At this point the mid engine mules have the appearance of a project that was mothballed when the economy crashed and GM filed bankruptcy.
Once produced the Zora will compete in IMSA series GTLM class and C8 will compete in GTD class.
Fwiw...Bob lutz said the c7 was supposed to be a mid rear engine model but the bankruptcy in 2009 constrained the money for a mid rear engine corvette and they rolled out a front mid engine c7 instead.
Supposedly the c8 will allow for a similiarly priced c8 with a rear mid engine c8.
I do believe there will first be an expensive c8 mid rear engine model and a moderately priced rear mid engine corvette both c8 s.
If the expensive c8 rear mid engine model is first..there is a possibility the c7 front mid engine model could linger for a short period of time ...until GM takes in as much money on the new c8 expensive model...with a more moderately priced rear mid engine to follow.
Last edited by JerriVette; 03-27-2017 at 12:28 PM.
Corvette production numbers for 2016 were "A total of 40,689 Corvettes were produced. This is up by 6,449 cars or almost 19%. The highest selling model was the Stingray Coupe, garnering 52.6%, followed by the Z06 Coupe with 28.4%. Stingray Convertibles accounted for 12.4% and Z06 Convertibles trailed with 6.7%."
So 11,555 Z06 coupes and 2,726 Z06 Convertibles. That's 14,281 $100k corvettes.
I'd say they'd sell enough ME corvettes at $80k to be profitable.
Yes, GM built and sold 40,689 2016 MY Corvettes to their dealers worldwide, but their dealers, worldwide, only sold a little over 33,000 Corvettes in 2016 calendar year to their retail customers. That's why there is a fire sale going on with left over 2016 Corvettes and current build 2017's.
GM way overproduced the C7, and retail sales haven't kept up.
If GM can only sell 14,281 Corvettes annually, they will be much higher than $80,000 and most likely GM would drop the Corvette because of low volume.
There will continue to be moderate and high priced rear mid engine corvettes in the c8.
The change could be in the usual rollout of corvettes. Traditionally corvettes roll out in base trim and then as the years pass...more and more powerful models follow to maintain demand.(z51 then z06 then a grand sport combining the z51 engine with z06 bodywork, then the ZR1 ..
This time around with the c8. a more powerful rear mid engine will release so GM makes the reputation and the more profitable sales for themselves. As time goes on ..GM will introduce n/a lt1 500 hp versions for those of us who don't want to spend 6 figures and that will continue sales momentum....(700 hp rear mid engine corvette model, then later on as it phases out the front mid engine c7 models, a 500 hp rear mid engine version will appear.
That's what will happen if GM releases the ultra expensive forced induction rear mid engine corvette first...imo
Last edited by JerriVette; 03-27-2017 at 12:37 PM.
Fwiw...Bob lutz said the c7 was supposed to be a mid rear engine model but the bankruptcy in 2009 constrained the money for a mid rear engine corvette and they rolled out a front mid engine c7 instead.
Supposedly the c8 will allow for a similiarly priced c8 with a rear mid engine c8.
I do believe there will first be an expensive c8 mid rear engine model and a moderately priced rear mid engine corvette both c8 s.
If the expensive c8 rear mid engine model is first..there is a possibility the c7 front mid engine model could linger for a short period of time ...until GM takes in as much money on the new c8 expensive model...with a more moderately priced rear mid engine to follow.
Bob Lutz was the man behind the Pontiac Solstice and the Saturn Sky. GM didn't make any money on them as the competition forced the MSRP and the resulting selling price to be so low, that it cost GM as much to build those two cars as what they were selling them for.
Lutz was also a strong voice behind the Volt that was supposed to sell 100,000 ANNUALLY. The Volt has never sold enough to come near what GM has spend on developing it and then building it.
He was behind bringing the Holden over as a GTO. It didn't sell that well either.
He was also behind the Viper, which has never sold well nor made any money for Dodge.
Lutz was behind many "not so great" ideas at GM before they declared bankruptcy in June, 2009. He was in a major leadership position that drove GM into bankruptcy. He retired from GM on May 2, 2010.
Bob Lutz was the man behind the Pontiac Solstice and the Saturn Sky. GM didn't make any money on them as the competition forced the MSRP and the resulting selling price to be so low, that it cost GM as much to build those two cars as what they were selling them for.
Lutz was also a strong voice behind the Volt that was supposed to sell 100,000 ANNUALLY. The Volt has never sold enough to come near what GM has spend on developing it and then building it.
He was behind bringing the Holden over as a GTO. It didn't sell that well either.
He was also behind the Viper, which has never sold well nor made any money for Dodge.
Lutz was behind many "not so great" ideas at GM before they declared bankruptcy in June, 2009. He was in a major leadership position that drove GM into bankruptcy. He retired from GM on May 2, 2010.
I don't put much faith into what Lutz says/did.
Joe you don't put much faith in what anyone says but you.
Joe you don't put much faith in what anyone says but you.
It's a constant with you.
That's a hoot coming from the person that has stated as fact over and over again what the C8 WILL be. You don't give your option as to what the C8 will be, but you make statements of fact, as if you really know as a fact what it will be. LOL
I happen to agree with Joe about Bob Lutz....he's great at writing books and talking, but he's also great at blaming EVERYONE else at GM but himself.
As far as the mid-engine car, I have no idea what's going to happen but I do have an opinion. Based on over 3/4ths of a BILLION dollars that GM has sunk into Bowling Green Assembly in the last 2 years, I think that the Corvette will continue as a front engine car WITH the addition of a Corvette mid-engine car. Certainly, it makes NO sense to do a ZR1/whatever they call it based C7 for one year. I think (again) that the C7 will continue until 2020 or so, with the mid-engine car coming out in 2018 as line addition (and priced similar to a C7 Z06). I also think the C8 will be an evolution of the C7, keeping the core Corvette values of utility/affordability in place (along with the sales of such a platform) while the ME car moves upmarket to be the Z06/ZR1.
We will all know in the next few years, but it is fun to guess.
As someone that has been on the list for 2 yrs trying to transfer none of this is good news for me. Now if they do raise the price and volume goes down it may make my dream of working there never come true. And to think I was #20 on the national hire list last yr and they hired close to 300 off the street permantly...... Union said it was allowed because of certain circumstances.
Reading through the articles the case is made that we will see a C8 front engine evolution of C7 and a mid engine Zora built to compete against Ford GT, Ferrari, Lamborghini, etc. Two cars with drastically different price points commensurate with technology and lightweight materials used in construction. The Corvette will move forward benefitting from bleed down of technology from Zora as Camaro has moved forward from bleed down of technology from Corvette.
At this point the mid engine mules have the appearance of a project that was mothballed when the economy crashed and GM filed bankruptcy.
Once produced the Zora will compete in IMSA series GTLM class and C8 will compete in GTD class.
The two-model theory is my favorite... I just don't want to see the Corvette suddenly cross the 100k barrier. I don't think GM would do it either.
That's a hoot coming from the person that has stated as fact over and over again what the C8 WILL be. You don't give your option as to what the C8 will be, but you make statements of fact, as if you really know as a fact what it will be. LOL
Joe, I'm sorry if I hurt your feelings and I have no idea what you are talking about...
I pretty much say what I hope the c8 will be...and I happen to admire Bob Lutz. The man is far from perfect but what he accomplished in his lifetime is what many would call impressive. I UN derstand you do not think Bob Lutz has had an impressive and successful career.
No hard feelings....you old coot...and I mean that in a good way..
Last edited by JerriVette; 03-28-2017 at 09:18 PM.
Lutz was also a strong voice behind the Volt that was supposed to sell 100,000 ANNUALLY. The Volt has never sold enough to come near what GM has spend on developing it and then building it.
GM marketed the Volt all wrong. They marketed it at Homosexuals, yes really, and basically stated because they were Homos, they were smarter than strait people, so therefore buy the Volt. That's what the ad said, not my words.
The illustration shows a current Z06 by appearance, but with patent applications the illustration only serves to characterize the nature of the patent. Point is, the "picture" means less than the actual system description. Just because it's shown on an FR car, doesn't mean that's where it'll end up. The patent is describing how the systems affect a car...they could've drawn a minivan as the illustration. In addition, the round taillight, I believe, is a bit of a bait joke to get the pot stirred. In other words, don't take the illustration literally. Most of this tech will be on the ME car, and/or future cars.
2. To understand what GM and Caddy want to build, you have to look at their targeted competition. Cadillac is clearly BMW and Corvette is Porsche, upper tier markets, etc. The Stingray really doesn't have any competition in the lower end...it's in its own market, filling it's own void. For 60k there is no comp to the Stingray in terms of total package...2 seat, V8, good performance, open air, etc. GM would be FOOOOLS to eliminate the base car...it aint' happenin.
GM/Corvette needs a HALO for development of future tech to trickle down into the brand (lightweight carbon panels, graphene, suspension tech, etc). That's what the "Zora" or ME car will do. IT'll also give the race team a new platform to utilize. Also, Pratt and Miller is actually doing PRODUCTION on the Camaro GT4R for customers, and I suspect it's POSSIBLE that a Corvette GT3 for private customers could come in the future, potentially built by Pratt (though Callaway does the GT3 C7, not ALLOWED to race in the US though due to non compete) The ME car will exist by using the base cars core architecture...center capsule, passenger cell, etc. THis reduces cost.
Cadillac targets BMW, so I propose we could see some Volt tech, maybe a v6 twin turbo or something to target the i8. Cadillac will be more lux, more techy, etc. Corvette more performance, more race, etc.
Beneath that the Corvette will continue to sell front engine, rear drive GT cars, as always.
3. Bowling Green: I think this was pretty clear it wasn't just a paint shop upgrade. This is the engine build facility, paint shop and assembly line expansion for a larger production output.
4. Ford collaboration? I have questions about the Ford GT getrag finding it's way into the ME Corvette or Cadillac. Ford/GM teamed up on the 9/10spd, and I have a feeling they teamed up on the mid engine transmission also. That's a guess.
5. The ME Corvette is about Bandwidth...instead of spanning the Corvette from 55k to 105k, now you can do 55k to 140k...like was attempted with the C6...but didn't fly. They realized Corvette buyers had a cap on what they'd spend to obtain a front engine, rear drive Corvette. In that current time, current market, 130k+ wasn't it. I think ACR proved that 120k, maybe even 130k is possible at this stage, but it has to be a weapon. The market above the 130k is alive and well, with abundant options that come with very high maintenance bills. If GM can produce a mid engine, reliable and fairly affordable car...you're looking at a modern era NSX. In that, the 1st gen NSX's regularly have 150k miles plus on them, because they were as reliable as their Civic and Integra brothers. In this techy era, an affordable ME supercar is again, in a category of it's own.
Last edited by KnightDriveTV; 04-08-2017 at 01:34 PM.
The illustration shows a current Z06 by appearance, but with patent applications the illustration only serves to characterize the nature of the patent. Point is, the "picture" means less than the actual system description. Just because it's shown on an FR car, doesn't mean that's where it'll end up. The patent is describing how the systems affect a car...they could've drawn a minivan as the illustration. In addition, the round taillight, I believe, is a bit of a bait joke to get the pot stirred. In other words, don't take the illustration literally. Most of this tech will be on the ME car, and/or future cars.
2. To understand what GM and Caddy want to build, you have to look at their targeted competition. Cadillac is clearly BMW and Corvette is Porsche, upper tier markets, etc. The Stingray really doesn't have any competition in the lower end...it's in its own market, filling it's own void. For 60k there is no comp to the Stingray in terms of total package...2 seat, V8, good performance, open air, etc. GM would be FOOOOLS to eliminate the base car...it aint' happenin.
GM/Corvette needs a HALO for development of future tech to trickle down into the brand (lightweight carbon panels, graphene, suspension tech, etc). That's what the "Zora" or ME car will do. IT'll also give the race team a new platform to utilize. Also, Pratt and Miller is actually doing PRODUCTION on the Camaro GT4R for customers, and I suspect it's POSSIBLE that a Corvette GT3 for private customers could come in the future, potentially built by Pratt (though Callaway does the GT3 C7, not ALLOWED to race in the US though due to non compete) The ME car will exist by using the base cars core architecture...center capsule, passenger cell, etc. THis reduces cost.
Cadillac targets BMW, so I propose we could see some Volt tech, maybe a v6 twin turbo or something to target the i8. Cadillac will be more lux, more techy, etc. Corvette more performance, more race, etc.
Beneath that the Corvette will continue to sell front engine, rear drive GT cars, as always.
3. Bowling Green: I think this was pretty clear it wasn't just a paint shop upgrade. This is the engine build facility, paint shop and assembly line expansion for a larger production output.
4. Ford collaboration? I have questions about the Ford GT getrag finding it's way into the ME Corvette or Cadillac. Ford/GM teamed up on the 9/10spd, and I have a feeling they teamed up on the mid engine transmission also. That's a guess.
5. The ME Corvette is about Bandwidth...instead of spanning the Corvette from 55k to 105k, now you can do 55k to 140k...like was attempted with the C6...but didn't fly. They realized Corvette buyers had a cap on what they'd spend to obtain a front engine, rear drive Corvette. In that current time, current market, 130k+ wasn't it. I think ACR proved that 120k, maybe even 130k is possible at this stage, but it has to be a weapon. The market above the 130k is alive and well, with abundant options that come with very high maintenance bills. If GM can produce a mid engine, reliable and fairly affordable car...you're looking at a modern era NSX. In that, the 1st gen NSX's regularly have 150k miles plus on them, because they were as reliable as their Civic and Integra brothers. In this techy era, an affordable ME supercar is again, in a category of it's own.
Well written post, but I have a few disagreements with you.
Mercedes is also a big competitor that Cadillac wants to lure over some of their customers.
Look at what M-B offers in the way of two seat sports cars, that fall within the Corvette's price range. Just because a $55,000 M-B SLC roadster(that starts out at $47,950) doesn't have the "performance" of the base Stingray, it is still a competitive model to the StingRay, otherwise, everyone would be buying the $55,000 StingRay and no one would be buying the SLC Roadster. But that's not true. People that could have spent their $55,000 on a StingRay instead purchased a $55,000 SLC Roadster.
Same goes with the $86,950 starting price SL roaster instead of the $86,950 Z06 or GS.
We Know the C7 Z06 can run up to around $122,000(as did the C6 ZR1), but instead, some people bought the competitive Mercedes GT that starts out at $111,200.
People that are willing to pay for a $175,000 Mercedes AMG GT S or GT R do so knowing they can buy a higher performance(but not the GT R) Z06, but they choose the GT S over the Z06.
A higher price Cadillac mid engine car has a better chance of winning over some of those expensive Mercedes buyers, even though it most likely won't be quite the same performance as a mid engine Corvette.
Not everyone with money to spend on a 2 seat sports car is looking to buy the "fastest" 2 seat sports car on the market. Personal choices go way beyond that.
Same goes with the Porsche Boxster and Cayman. The are competitors to the Corvette. For basically the same money that a Boxster and Cayman costs, you can buy a C7, but some people choose the Boxster/Cayman over the Corvette. The Boxster and Cayman might not be as "fast" as the Corvette, but, again, personal choices go beyond that.
The NSX doesn't seem to be selling that well and it is the "latest' in "high tech". Hybrid, AWD, intelligent aero engineering, etc.
Maybe not everyone is all that interested in a "High Tech" mid engineered sports car with hybrid and AWD, and would rather settle on an "old tech" front engine Corvette or Mercedes without being a hybrid or AWD.
>>At the bottom is attached PDF file with details of GM's application for active aero patent filing.
By now, everyone has pretty much heard that the Bowling Green Corvette Assembly Plant will be shutting down for at least a couple of months after 2017 Corvette production comes to an end in June.
In January, GM announced that it would be temporarily shutting down 15 of its assembly plants due to a glut of cars on dealer lots and increasing demand for SUVs over cars. The Bowling Green Assembly Plant was one of those Assembly Plants, however, the shutdown was only from Jan. 1 to Jan. 6, said Monica Williams, president of UAW Local 2164. According to Lauren Langille, spokeswoman for the Corvette plant, “We had the regular shutdown for the holidays and there needed to be construction done on the paint shop,” Langille said. “There are also maintenance needs.”
Around that same time, a spokeswoman for the Assembly Plant stated that the plant would be shutting down later this year in order to install equipment for a new build process and make some assembly line upgrades. Although exact dates and times had not been determined, the temporary shut down would cover parts of the summer and fall.
Bowling Green Corvette Assembly Plant Expansion
In May of 2015, GM announced that it was investing $439 million for a new paint shop and facility upgrades followed by an announcement by GM on December 9, 2015 that it was investing an additional $44 million in the Bowling Green Assembly plant to support increased capacity in its Performance Build Center, adding 36 new jobs.
On June 24, 2016, General Motors announced it will invest $290 million into the Bowling Green Assembly plant to upgrade and modify the plant’s vehicle assembly operations with new technologies and processes. The official press release stated “This investment continues GM’s drive for flexible manufacturing systems. These changes are being made in conjunction with and in addition to the construction and startup of the previously announced $439 million paint shop investment.”
The new “paint shop” was under construction at the Assembly Plant all last year, but it’s hard to believe that just a paint shop could cost $439 million.
In looking at recent satellite photography, we can see the enormous scale of the new “paint shop”. Below is an aerial view of the Bowling Green Corvette Assembly Plant prior to the new “paint shop”:
For perspective, the red box indicates the main entrance in front of the Assembly Plant. Below is an aerial photo of the Assembly Plant showing the new “paint shop”:
Again, the red box indicates the main entrance in front of the Assembly Plant. As you can see, that is one ENORMOUS paint shop! Or is it?
Enter the Much Anticipated Mid-Engine Corvette
For a couple of years now, we’ve been hearing all the rumors of a mid-engine Corvette in development and spy photographers have wasted no time in capturing prototypes undergoing track and cold weather testing.
Code-named Zora, the mid-engine Corvette is expected to usher in the new C8 Corvette generation for the 2019 model year.
Some Corvette enthusiasts believe that the mid-engine Corvette is nothing but a myth and would never see the light of day. Some believe it’s actually a mid-engine Cadillac that will serve as a halo car for Cadillac much like the 2004 – 2009 Cadillac XLR was supposed to do. However, when you take a look at the enormous revolutionary change that the Cadillac brand is currently experiencing under the watchful eye of Cadillac President, Johan de Nysschen, a mid-engine Cadillac just doesn’t make sense.
In the past, Corvette Chief Engineer, Tadge Juechter has stated to the automotive media that in light of the current Z06 putting out 650 hp and 650 lb-ft of torque, GM has taken the current front-engine Corvette platform as far as it can possibly go.
Assuming that what we see above winter testing along side of a 2018 Corvette ZR1 is in fact, a mid-engine Corvette, it certainly looks like it’s on track for a late 2018 release as the new C8 Corvette…or is it?
On May 16, 2016, we published an article here at the Corvette Action Center stating: To throw more fuel on the mid-engine fire, the Corvette Action Center has recently heard rumors that the mid-engine Corvette could be built along side of the C7 Corvette and will continue into the C8 generation as C7 Corvette production winds down.
here seems to be two trains of thought out there. On the one hand, the mid-engine Corvette will usher in the start of C8 production as a 2019 model year, while on the other hand, mid-engine Corvette production could bleed into the current C7 Corvette production with the 2018 Corvette model year being the last of the front-engined Corvettes.
So Why the Extended Shut-Down for “Assembly Line Upgrades” Now?
Let’s take a minute and look at the facts.
Over the last couple of years, GM has invested a grand total of $773 million into the Bowling Green Corvette Assembly Plant. $439 million of that is for a new “paint shop” and other upgrades. When you compare the two satellite images of the Assembly Plant above showing the expansion, it’s really kind of hard to believe that the addition, which looks like it’s the size of the original Assembly Plant, is nothing more than a “paint shop”.
Whether you want to believe that a mid-engine Corvette is coming or not is up to you, however, we have the spy photos above and Corvette Engineering feels that they have reached the performance limits of a front-engine platform with the current Z06 Corvette.
In order to switch to a mid-engine layout for the Corvette, the C7 Corvette would have to undergo a major overhaul. Almost no parts of the current Corvette could be carried over. A mid-engine Corvette would require engineering a whole new chassis, creating a new transaxle, a new body and new air-conditioning and suspension systems.
The Corvette Assembly Plant usually shuts down for only two weeks in between model year changes and longer when it comes to changing between generations. So, if the C7 model year is expected to end with the 2018 Corvette and the 2019 Corvette starts the new C8 generation, why would the Assembly Plant be undergoing a potential four month shut down now?
Our prediction? The front-engine Corvette platform will not end. It will continue well into the C8 generation. The mid-engine Corvette is a reality. It’s coming whether you want to believe it or not. The mid-engine Corvette will be built along side the front-engine Corvette platform. Because of the differences between front and mid-engine platforms, both cars can’t be built on the same assembly line and require two separate lines.
What we’re seeing above as a “new paint shop”, is not just a paint shop, but rather space to build the new mid-engine Corvette. The front-engine Corvette will continue to be built on the same assembly line as it is now.
What’s that you say? You still still think the mid-engine Corvette is total bull? Take a look at Ferrari.
Ferrari has been successfully building both front and mid-engine cars for years now. The business model works – the company is extremely profitable – and production numbers increase each year. While still expensive in comparison to the cost of a top of the line Corvette, Ferrari recognizes the value in offering both front and mid-engine platforms and offers a variety of models for different wallets and different driving goals.
So is it really out of the question that GM could be trying to move the Corvette towards a similar business model, while continuing to try to keep the Corvette well below the cost of a Ferrari or Lamborghini? We don’t think so. The Corvette has always been considered the “poor-man’s Ferrari” and GM has always tried to make the Corvette as a affordable as possible while offering exotic supercar performance.
Only time will tell, but I think it’s going to be extremely interesting to see what transpires over the course of this year, and whether or not any of our predictions come true! Stay tuned!!!
Cadillac building new Mid Engine car at Bowling Green. A second level assembly line will be the new addition to the Bowling Green plant as i stated in my post that was bashed by many DISBELIEVERS!!!!!!!
Cadillac building new Mid Engine car at Bowling Green. A second level assembly line will be the new addition to the Bowling Green plant as i stated in my post that was bashed by many DISBELIEVERS!!!!!!!
I cannot agree or disagree on the Caddy ME however I've posted that there will be a C8 and an ME for many months. This is the only business case that makes sense without a huge risk and the downside of said risk being too large to contemplate. It was obvious when announced the 'paint shop expansion and upgrades' would entail far more than GM ready to announce since many details still being sorted on all cars part of the master plan.
Well written post, but I have a few disagreements with you.
Mercedes is also a big competitor that Cadillac wants to lure over some of their customers.
Look at what M-B offers in the way of two seat sports cars, that fall within the Corvette's price range. Just because a $55,000 M-B SLC roadster(that starts out at $47,950) doesn't have the "performance" of the base Stingray, it is still a competitive model to the StingRay, otherwise, everyone would be buying the $55,000 StingRay and no one would be buying the SLC Roadster. But that's not true. People that could have spent their $55,000 on a StingRay instead purchased a $55,000 SLC Roadster.
Same goes with the $86,950 starting price SL roaster instead of the $86,950 Z06 or GS.
We Know the C7 Z06 can run up to around $122,000(as did the C6 ZR1), but instead, some people bought the competitive Mercedes GT that starts out at $111,200.
People that are willing to pay for a $175,000 Mercedes AMG GT S or GT R do so knowing they can buy a higher performance(but not the GT R) Z06, but they choose the GT S over the Z06.
A higher price Cadillac mid engine car has a better chance of winning over some of those expensive Mercedes buyers, even though it most likely won't be quite the same performance as a mid engine Corvette.
Not everyone with money to spend on a 2 seat sports car is looking to buy the "fastest" 2 seat sports car on the market. Personal choices go way beyond that.
Same goes with the Porsche Boxster and Cayman. The are competitors to the Corvette. For basically the same money that a Boxster and Cayman costs, you can buy a C7, but some people choose the Boxster/Cayman over the Corvette. The Boxster and Cayman might not be as "fast" as the Corvette, but, again, personal choices go beyond that.
The NSX doesn't seem to be selling that well and it is the "latest' in "high tech". Hybrid, AWD, intelligent aero engineering, etc.
Maybe not everyone is all that interested in a "High Tech" mid engineered sports car with hybrid and AWD, and would rather settle on an "old tech" front engine Corvette or Mercedes without being a hybrid or AWD.
Well, in fairness the Corvette has many competitors, just none that are as completely defined, such as Camaro/Mustang. Yes, AMG GT...definitely, as is the Porsche 911. Cayman to me is a tougher sell as a legit comp but....from a price standpoint sure. GT4 is legit if you can get one. There's a different kind of buyer in discussion for those cars though. Not only are those cars carrying a higher price of entry, but also a higher cost of ownership. Merc and Porsche resale drops like a rock without legit maintenance. Corvettes still don't carry that pressure on a resale level.
In addition, the current Corvette buyer pool is still dominated by folks who really still see the Corvette as a pinnacle sports car. Many 50 and 60 somethings want the Americana aspect and with that said, there is no competition for the Corvette. At best maybe the Hellcats and Vipers and side bets displaced a few sales but...not many.
GM recognizes the growth of Porsche in this country. Not to mention, Porsche makes more profit per vehicle than any major manufacturer, go figure. It's a legit threat, and with C7's inception it was clear that the 911 was the target for them. The AMG GT's, Vipers, Hellcats...pretty much a non factor. For Corvette...it's more of a "who is the buyer in 20 yrs" problem.
2020 Corvette of the Year Finalist (appearance mods)
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Originally Posted by jyounger74
Cadillac building new Mid Engine car at Bowling Green. A second level assembly line will be the new addition to the Bowling Green plant as i stated in my post that was bashed by many DISBELIEVERS!!!!!!!
No one bashed you for saying that the ME would be a Cadillac. Your use of an article from 1999 as evidence was the part that made your claim amusing. For the last year I've said it could be either a Cadillac or a Chevrolet. Until GM tells us, it's pure speculation.
No one bashed you for saying that the ME would be a Cadillac. Your use of an article from 1999 as evidence was the part that made your claim amusing. For the last year I've said it could be either a Cadillac or a Chevrolet. Until GM tells us, it's pure speculation.
Agreed that it's all speculation, but, in 2000 Cadillac returned to racing(LMP) and then in 2004, Cadillac then released their own "sports" car(XLR). The 2004 XLR was based on the C6 chassis that would not be released until 2005 in the Corvette(a year later).
Now, for 2017, Cadillac has returned to racing(DPI-V.R) so it's likely possible that it is in preparation for another Cadillac "sports" car to be released in the near future. A mid engine model to compete with the NSX, etc. More luxury orientated with a much higher price tag than a Corvette mid engine, but with respectable performance, so it's not in direct competition with the Corvette.
A lot has been said about a mid engine Corvette being only $5,000 more expensive to produce than a front engine Corvette, but GM isn't going to sell a mid engine Corvette for what it costs to build them. That additional $5,000 to build will be more like $20,000-$25,000 added to the car's MSRP*.
GM is not going to have a base entry level Corvette with a starting price of $75,000 to $80,000, so, at least to me, the next generation will still be a front engine car starting at ~$60,000, then a mid engine version starting at ~$80,000 and a high performance mid engine starting at ~$110,000. I don't believe their will be a high performance front engine C8 available(Z06) as that will be covered with an equivalent mid engine model.
The top performing end mid engine Corvette will be priced at the starting price of the base level mid engine Cadillac(~$135,000), which will also have a higher horsepower version added a little later(like the supercharged version of the XLR). The high horsepower Cadillac will not offer more performance than the high performance mid engine Corvette(whether it's called a Z06, ZR1, Zora, etc).
I also speculate that the mid engine Cadillac will only last four or five years(as did the XLR), as it still won't be a Mercedes class car.
Now the question is....when will the first mid engine car be released? I predict that it will be first released as a Cadillac, and then a year or two later as a Corvette, followed up a year or two later with the front engine C8.
All speculation on my part, of course, but based on what GM has done in the past. Cadillac isn't going racing with the DPI-V.R with the direct intention being to lure 70 year old grandmothers out of their Mercedes E or S class luxury cars and into a CT6. GM isn't going to get younger customers into a Cadillac showroom by offering a mid engine Corvette in a Chevrolet showroom down the street, and not a mid engine Cadillac in their showrooms.
* Does anyone really believe that the 2018 Corvette 65 Edition Package, that is an $15,000 option, really costs GM $15,000 to build?
03-27-2017, 12:00 PM
