ScottC95ZR1

I have a high-end set of wheels that were damaged due to use of an acidic wheel cleaner. The clearcoat on the centers was destroyed and the polished outer rim has a white, milky look to them.

I have removed the FM5 centers and have been concentrating on them first. I stripped the clear off of them and wet-sanded with 600 then 1200 grit, then hit them with six progressive steps using micro-mesh with water.

The last micro-mesh cloth was MX1200, which is probably equivilent to 2,300 paper.

So with the sanding done, I have hand polished twice with NUVITE grade S. The finish is very nice and although it has quite a shine, it is not the mirror-like shine I hoped for.

The NUVITE S is claimed to me professional grade polish but I also have Mothers billet polish and WENOL, but I have stayed with the NUVITE for now. So for my questions to anyone that has experiance polishing aluminum:

1) If I repeatedly hand polish using the NUVITE S (or any other high-grade polish) can I expect a progressively deeper shine, or after a couple of applications would you think it's as good as it's going to get?

If continued, repeated polishing will pay off I will press on. Just don't want to waste my time - and don't know when it's "as good as it gets".

2) I have read of alot of people applying clearcoat to the centers after polishing for ease of maintenance. My first thought is I would rather not do so and try to keep up with the polishing. The car is basically a sunny weekend car and stays garaged and covered. Will the polish finish constantly degrade even kept waxed and dry?

I am afraid that after all this work an off-the-shelf- clear product might yellow on me. If a little preventative effort will keep those polished finish nice I would like to go that route.

3) Lastly, to the outer rims. I have hit them twice with WENOL and have not been able to buff that white, milky look off of them. Should I put them through the same sanding regimen as the centers or is there something easier that would bring them back as new?

I appreciate your time and any feedback from the experts here.

Jim D.

Photos would be really helpful.

I would consult the Nuvite website for their polishing procedures, such as this PDF I found. It appears you may have missed a step prior to S.

You may need to polish out the sanding scratches before jumping to a finishing polish, and this pretty much holds with any such process, no matter the brand.

You might try Mothers Mag & Aluminum or one of the coarser Nuvite polishes. Mothers also has a PowerMetal Scratch Removing Polish in a can, and that can remove acid wheel stains on polished aluminum when used with the PowerBall Mini MD (both available online).

I am also familiar with the Mothers Billet Metal Polish, and you certainly don't have anything to lose but it may be close to what you're using now -- but if you don't have a good base, you may be wasting your time.

Wenol has both a red (to remove oxidation and stains) and a soft blue polish (finishing), so whichever one you have would have to fit within the progressively-finer scale of polishing.

ScottC95ZR1

Thanks for your time Jim, I appreciate it.

I switched to the Mothers Billet Polish and found that made a big difference. I've hit them four times and each time seems to have helped a bit. The Nuvite seemed to leave the finish much duller and it really took more effort to buff it out. I think my first couple of applications were too liberal as well.

I only have the red Wenol and think perhaps that might be a step backwards at this point? I didn't realize there was a blue Wenol for finishing polish and will have to get some of it.

I have alot of work to do on the outer rims. Started with the red wenol without much luck getting the oxidization or white, milky appearance off. I was hoping to avoid the progressive sanding steps but guess I may not have a choice.

Here are a few pics of one center:

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Jim D.

If the centers were actually painted a color, that could explain the satin finish -- painted wheel surfaces aren't generally as smooth as clearcoated surfaces. I see some indications of imperfections in picture #2 between the lug holes at about 1 o'clock and 3:30.

As for the lips, are they clearcoated? Most metal polishes, including Billet Metal Polish, will turn black on the applicator almost instantly if they are bare and uncoated.

Photos of the lips and of an untreated wheel might also be helpful.

ScottC95ZR1

The centers were not painted. The technipolish finish involves use of a special diamond cutting tool in the final finish machining stage, then clear coated to preserve the resulting shimmering appearance. They looked spectacular before Bubba hit them with the 4x4 wheel cleaner! Short of having them re-machined, they won't have a completely smooth surface. And maybe that's my problem.

The outer rims are certainly not cleared. The polish turns black when being applied and the rims do shine - there is just a cloudy trace in spots where it looks like the cleaner pooled. I will try to get pics of them tomorrow.

Jim D.

Thanks for the clarification.

So it appears the centers are about as good as they're going to get -- it's a unique look, and certainly nothing wrong with it.

The rims will need an aggressive polish, and I'd recommend the PowerMetal Scratch Removing Polish and the PowerBall Mini MD -- it's ideal for this situation. Amazon and other places online also sell it.

ScottC95ZR1

Thanks again Jim, I'll give that stuff a try. Appreciate your time!

Jim D.

Certainly give the products you have now a try before ordering the big guns. Every situation is different, but I know how stubborn acid stains can be.

0TH0001@properautocare.com

Hi Scott, I'm sorry for my late replay, I have been out of town.

Let me see if I can help because I have some (not a ton) of experience polishing aluminum.


On soft aluminum it can still be difficult to polish out 2300 grit scratches with out the use of a machine polisher and an aggressive compound. What happens is that (particularly when using a mild polish and rubbing it out by hand) is that the 2300 grit (and deeper) scratches get rounded off but you are still left with a fine texture, like straight line orange peel, if that makes sense. This creates a scratch that is so shallow that you can no longer remove it (sounds weird at first right).

If you think of the scratches like a mountain range with peaks and valleys.. The peaks are the top of the material and the valleys are the depth of the scratch. To remove the scratches you have to remove all the material above the deepest point. By rubbing it out with gentle polishes, you aren't really cutting off the top of the mountain as much as you are rounding it off into a hill. When you cut off the tops of the mountains you have to be able to just cut the peaks, but once you have created hills, your polishing compound now flows up and down the gradual peaks and you end up removing material not only from the top of the hill but from the valleys as well. This is why you cannot polish away orange peel from paint as well, you have to sand it off (for the most part).

This is because the polish and application is too mild to fully remove the 2300 grit deep scratches, You now have a lots of little hills that are dispersing the reflected light. However you have removed the absolutely finest scratches so you have some gloss.

While repeated polishing may increase the gloss of the aluminum slightly (as more and more microscopic scratches are removed) you are not going to see any significant change in the gloss of the aluminum. This because you can only create so level of a surface until you start removing material uniformly.



Aluminum will oxide if it is contact with oxygen, although the rate of oxidation can greatly be reduced by protecting the aluminum with a high quality metal specific sealant such as Blackfire Wet Diamond All Metal Sealant.

As far as polishing the aluminum, if you keep it sealed, you might need to go over it every 3-6 months by hand and give it a light touch up.


The milky white staining might have stained deep into the aluminum. In that case sanding them would likely remove it. However if you are not happy with the shine you are getting after polishing, it might be a step backwards.

To fix your gloss and get a mirror like shine you are going to need to...

A) Make sure the surface is sanded properly. In my experience this cannot be rushed through. I have polished aluminum show pieces that had to be perfect for various car shows and the most important lesson I have learned is that sanding is the most important part. You cannot rush through it.

It would probably take 30 minutes to an hour per grit per wheel to do it right. So if you are starting with 500 grit than moving to 1000, 2000, 3000, I would expect to spend four hours (by hand) per wheel.

The best way I have found to sand aluminum is by crosshatching, or running each grit in one direction that is 90 degrees to the previous grit. So 500 grit in only left to right, right to left motions. Then come back with the finer grit and go up to down, down to up. This will change the scratch pattern on piece, so you can see any scratches that are not removed from the previous step. If you still see some right to left (500 grit) scratches keep going over them up and down with 1000 grit until they are gone. Any thing you miss will show up later on.

Once the wheels are sanded with a super fine grit (I like at least 3000, if not higher on most aluminum) you need to cut the piece. This means using an aggressive metal compound, usually with cerium oxide abrasives and a machine.

After cutting the surface level, then you need to use a a finer grade polish to remove the very fine marks from the compound. Finally you can use an ultra fine grade polish to bring that mirror shine to the aluminum (which is what it seems you have been using right now).

The two options for polishing aluminum would be to take to a professional metal polisher who is going to use various grades of 'bars' of compounds and a big polishing well or you can attempt to do it yourself. We carry the Blackfire Metal Polishing kit, which includes everything you need to polish your wheels to that mirror like shine, but does require the use of a rotary or da polisher.

Here is a quote of a thread I posted using that kit.

RDVT4ME

Todd,

I am continually blown away by how much stuff you know. You should write a book!

-Bob

ScottC95ZR1

Thanks for the detailed response Todd. I appreciate it very much. As Jim pointed out too, I missed the important step of using an aggressive compound with a polisher, and went straight to the mild polishing by hand. I also did not think to crosshatch until halfway through my sanding regimen.

Seems I am going to need to start over. I have a Cyclo polisher - probably not the polisher of choice for this task having dual heads.
I also just purchased a 6' buffing wheel, but quickly decided I'd need to invest some time learning how to use it on something besides these wheels.

Well, nobody said it would be easy! Thanks again for your time and help.

0TH0001@properautocare.com

Bob, thank you so much your compliments.

My pleasure Scott. Please let us know if there is anything we can help you with. (myself or Angelo@properautocare.com)

Todd

ScottC95ZR1

Todd,

Do you think my Cyclo polisher would be effective with the Blackfire Heavy Cut Aluminum Polish?

I first thought it would not due to it's dual head design but on second thought don't think that would cause me a problem.
But I don't know if it will functionally do the job with the polishing compound?

TIA

0TH0001@properautocare.com

Yes, it will work. It might be difficult to navigate inside the spokes with the dual head design, but that is going to be the biggest downfall. Also you might have to extend your working times to make sure that the compound/polish is broken all the way down. I found that when using the Blackfire Aluminum Polishes via DA, it usually took about 2 minutes per section, give or take.