Autocrossing with an A4
08-26-2007, 01:29 AM
#1
Racer
Thread Starter
Autocrossing with an A4
Can any tell me how to autocross with an A4 how to start and What gear to drive the car in?And do i turn off traction control.Thanks
08-26-2007, 01:50 AM
#2
Burning Brakes
Member Since: Jan 2005
Location: Littleton CO
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St. Jude Donor '07
Most auto-x courses are below 70 MPH. So I would keep it in whatever gear most likely goes up to that. Likely 2nd. Can't give you much advice on an auto other then that.
Yes, turn off traction control!
Some other preparation tips for auto-x:
http://www.bauerracing.net/Prepare/Autocross.htm
Most of all, go have fun!
Yes, turn off traction control!
Some other preparation tips for auto-x:
http://www.bauerracing.net/Prepare/Autocross.htm
Most of all, go have fun!
08-26-2007, 02:58 AM
#3
Team Owner
PS....Never did an autocross...........
DH
08-26-2007, 09:08 AM
#4
Drifting
Just lock it in 2nd, it will switch between 1st and 2nd for you anyway. If you leave it in drive, you'll have to wait for it to downshift when you get back on the power and will lose alot of time because of that.
08-26-2007, 10:53 AM
#5
Melting Slicks
It might be an automatic, but it isn't smart enough to just leave it in 2nd. I understand that you may be a noobie, but this is the right way to do it:Leave the line in first, and command the first to second shift by moving the lever and at the same time giving a little bit of a lift. Even if you do that as a short shift it is better than letting car decide where to shift.
That way your upshift will occur where and when YOU expect it. If you just leave it in second it can and will upshift when you hit the shift point, and (assuming your foot is on the floor) that can be a hard upsift. If you are not pointed straight ahead (like where on a typical autocross course you are going straight for long at all?), you can (and often will) get sideways when it shifts.
Most of the time it won't downshift back into first unless you are coming off a really slow corner. If it does downshift to first, pull the lever back and then command the 1-2 shift as above.
If you are entering a really slow corner (like a single pylon 180), you know that the car is going to want to downshift when you hammer it on corner exit. In that case pull the 2-1 downshift as you get close to the apex and slowest point in the corner (and expect it to jerk the car if you do it too soon). That way you can power out of the corner and you won't have a downshift that upsets the car as you are feeding in power.
If you just leave it in second, when you are still in first and you go down a short chute to a slow corner, in a case where you really want to keep it in first, it will also upshift when you are entering the corner (because you lifted on corner entry). It messes you up because you get almost no engine braking in second where you were expecting to maybe have some. Then you are stuck in second with no punch coming off the corner, Since the speed may be too great to get a downshift....
You are smarter than the car, can see the course ahead and should have a good idea of what is coming. Tell the car what you want.
While you may be a novice, and don't really understand it yet, this is really the best way to do it. Better to learn the right way from the start, or at least understand the why and wherefore so that as you improve you won't cultivate bad habits.
08-26-2007, 04:00 PM
#6
Team Owner
It might be an automatic, but it isn't smart enough to just leave it in 2nd. I understand that you may be a noobie, but this is the right way to do it:Leave the line in first, and command the first to second shift by moving the lever and at the same time giving a little bit of a lift. Even if you do that as a short shift it is better than letting car decide where to shift.
That way your upshift will occur where and when YOU expect it. If you just leave it in second it can and will upshift when you hit the shift point, and (assuming your foot is on the floor) that can be a hard upsift. If you are not pointed straight ahead (like where on a typical autocross course you are going straight for long at all?), you can (and often will) get sideways when it shifts.
Most of the time it won't downshift back into first unless you are coming off a really slow corner. If it does downshift to first, pull the lever back and then command the 1-2 shift as above.
If you are entering a really slow corner (like a single pylon 180), you know that the car is going to want to downshift when you hammer it on corner exit. In that case pull the 2-1 downshift as you get close to the apex and slowest point in the corner (and expect it to jerk the car if you do it too soon). That way you can power out of the corner and you won't have a downshift that upsets the car as you are feeding in power.
If you just leave it in second, when you are still in first and you go down a short chute to a slow corner, in a case where you really want to keep it in first, it will also upshift when you are entering the corner (because you lifted on corner entry). It messes you up because you get almost no engine braking in second where you were expecting to maybe have some. Then you are stuck in second with no punch coming off the corner, Since the speed may be too great to get a downshift....
You are smarter than the car, can see the course ahead and should have a good idea of what is coming. Tell the car what you want.
While you may be a novice, and don't really understand it yet, this is really the best way to do it. Better to learn the right way from the start, or at least understand the why and wherefore so that as you improve you won't cultivate bad habits.
But if you put the tranny in 2nd gear ...... thats where it will stay....it will NOT shift down to 1st. And it will not upshift to 3rd it will hit RPM limit and fuel will be cut off.
DH
08-28-2007, 11:44 PM
#7
Drifting
A4
I have auto crossed a few times and I just put mine in 2nd. It has worked great for me. and it will downshift to first with the shifter in 2nd. it just won't upshift to 3rd. I recommend running the course in comp. mode or with AH and TC both off. I know alot of people with 6 speed cars that stay in 2nd after the launch. I'm no expert. I have only ran about a dozen auto crosses.
08-29-2007, 05:49 PM
#9
Melting Slicks
If you roll on the power and don't really hit it, by the time you get fully into the power you will be above the speed where it will command the downshift. If the course is not too slow it won't downshift, and on most courses that is what happens.
Belive me when I say that if you get a 2-1 downshift when you are not expecting it that it can ruin a run. Better to do it yourself on slow corners so you don't get surprised. Besides, the acceleration coming off of a slow corner in first will pin you in the seat and can be a real time gainer, besides being a lot more fun...
08-29-2007, 09:50 PM
#10
Team Owner
I don't know if you guys have a problem with your A4's or if its just me.
But when mine is in 2nd it stays in second .... even WOT from a stop...NO DOWNSHIFTING to 1st !!!!!!
And I know I'm not the only one
DH
But when mine is in 2nd it stays in second .... even WOT from a stop...NO DOWNSHIFTING to 1st !!!!!!
And I know I'm not the only one
DH
08-29-2007, 10:06 PM
#11
Melting Slicks
I AX'd a C4 with A4 trans for 3 years and I did exactly as Solofast describes. I was also very competitive with it and had a number of people thinking I had a manual trans. I'll also add that if you know how to left foot brake then take advantage of it. That way your right foot never moves away from the gas pedal. 2 feet, 2 pedals, perfect match! 
If you don't know how to LFB then learn after you get the hang of doing AX. It helps and shaves some time off your run.
Now I had read somewhere that on either certain year C5s or all C5s that there was a "2nd gear lockout". Using that stopped the trans from downshifting to 1st. Even after braking and entering a turnaround. If that is a myth then manually shifting the car is the only way to fly. If it is true then the car has enough torque where I would just leave it in 2nd. As you get better though you will want to shift it for specific reasons and situations Solofast mentioned.
I was also very competitive with it and had a number of people thinking I had a manual trans. I'll also add that if you know how to left foot brake then take advantage of it. That way your right foot never moves away from the gas pedal. 2 feet, 2 pedals, perfect match! If you don't know how to LFB then learn after you get the hang of doing AX. It helps and shaves some time off your run.Now I had read somewhere that on either certain year C5s or all C5s that there was a "2nd gear lockout". Using that stopped the trans from downshifting to 1st. Even after braking and entering a turnaround. If that is a myth then manually shifting the car is the only way to fly. If it is true then the car has enough torque where I would just leave it in 2nd. As you get better though you will want to shift it for specific reasons and situations Solofast mentioned.
08-29-2007, 11:35 PM
#12
Racer
Thread Starter
I AX'd a C4 with A4 trans for 3 years and I did exactly as Solofast describes. I was also very competitive with it and had a number of people thinking I had a manual trans. I'll also add that if you know how to left foot brake then take advantage of it. That way your right foot never moves away from the gas pedal. 2 feet, 2 pedals, perfect match! If you don't know how to LFB then learn after you get the hang of doing AX. It helps and shaves some time off your run.
Now I had read somewhere that on either certain year C5s or all C5s that there was a "2nd gear lockout". Using that stopped the trans from downshifting to 1st. Even after braking and entering a turnaround. If that is a myth then manually shifting the car is the only way to fly. If it is true then the car has enough torque where I would just leave it in 2nd. As you get better though you will want to shift it for specific reasons and situations Solofast mentioned.
I was also very competitive with it and had a number of people thinking I had a manual trans. I'll also add that if you know how to left foot brake then take advantage of it. That way your right foot never moves away from the gas pedal. 2 feet, 2 pedals, perfect match! If you don't know how to LFB then learn after you get the hang of doing AX. It helps and shaves some time off your run.Now I had read somewhere that on either certain year C5s or all C5s that there was a "2nd gear lockout". Using that stopped the trans from downshifting to 1st. Even after braking and entering a turnaround. If that is a myth then manually shifting the car is the only way to fly. If it is true then the car has enough torque where I would just leave it in 2nd. As you get better though you will want to shift it for specific reasons and situations Solofast mentioned.
08-30-2007, 01:50 AM
#14
Melting Slicks
Well if you're running in stock class then it is an illegal mod doing a shift kit. I ran my C4 with the stock 700R4 trans and no mods. Here is the catch with the shift kit. You are not drag racing. You need to shift not as much based on RPMs but more as the course dictates.
Example. You have a start gate, then a tight offset, then a short straight, then a sweeping turn. You want the shift to happen in that short straight. You have to time it and get the torque converter to make the shift happen at your desired point. So there is some delay from when you move the shifter from 1 to 2. You need to know that delay in time. So you launch and hold 1st, just as soon as you are finishing that first tight offset you want to shift to 2 so that it catches as the car is pointing straight for the short straight. Now as you hit the sweeping turn the car is settled from the shift into 2nd and you won't upset it during the sweeper. Auto or manual you want the wheels pointed straight as the clutch or torque converter kicks in the next gear. Catching the next gear going into or coming out of a turn is unsettling.
Same with a turnaround (pivot cone, 180, whatever you call it). Downshift on entry and let the torque converter knock the gear down before turning. Then do the rest of your braking, turn, shift for 2 as the car starts to point straight and accelerate. The shift causes no drama.
Shift as little as possible. Every shift costs you time.
The big rub against an auto trans for AX purpose. The torque converter bump and you not being in control of it. Whereas with a manual you know exactly when the clutch grabs and the gear engages. So in an auto your job is to sense and know when that torque converter is going to actually make the shift. It's all about feel. I got it to the point where most people thought I was driving a manual.
Example. You have a start gate, then a tight offset, then a short straight, then a sweeping turn. You want the shift to happen in that short straight. You have to time it and get the torque converter to make the shift happen at your desired point. So there is some delay from when you move the shifter from 1 to 2. You need to know that delay in time. So you launch and hold 1st, just as soon as you are finishing that first tight offset you want to shift to 2 so that it catches as the car is pointing straight for the short straight. Now as you hit the sweeping turn the car is settled from the shift into 2nd and you won't upset it during the sweeper. Auto or manual you want the wheels pointed straight as the clutch or torque converter kicks in the next gear. Catching the next gear going into or coming out of a turn is unsettling.
Same with a turnaround (pivot cone, 180, whatever you call it). Downshift on entry and let the torque converter knock the gear down before turning. Then do the rest of your braking, turn, shift for 2 as the car starts to point straight and accelerate. The shift causes no drama.
Shift as little as possible. Every shift costs you time.
The big rub against an auto trans for AX purpose. The torque converter bump and you not being in control of it. Whereas with a manual you know exactly when the clutch grabs and the gear engages. So in an auto your job is to sense and know when that torque converter is going to actually make the shift. It's all about feel. I got it to the point where most people thought I was driving a manual.
08-30-2007, 11:08 AM
#15
03-22-2008, 02:11 PM
#20
Race Director
It might be an automatic, but it isn't smart enough to just leave it in 2nd. I understand that you may be a noobie, but this is the right way to do it:Leave the line in first, and command the first to second shift by moving the lever and at the same time giving a little bit of a lift. Even if you do that as a short shift it is better than letting car decide where to shift.
That way your upshift will occur where and when YOU expect it. If you just leave it in second it can and will upshift when you hit the shift point, and (assuming your foot is on the floor) that can be a hard upsift. If you are not pointed straight ahead (like where on a typical autocross course you are going straight for long at all?), you can (and often will) get sideways when it shifts.
Most of the time it won't downshift back into first unless you are coming off a really slow corner. If it does downshift to first, pull the lever back and then command the 1-2 shift as above.
If you are entering a really slow corner (like a single pylon 180), you know that the car is going to want to downshift when you hammer it on corner exit. In that case pull the 2-1 downshift as you get close to the apex and slowest point in the corner (and expect it to jerk the car if you do it too soon). That way you can power out of the corner and you won't have a downshift that upsets the car as you are feeding in power.
If you just leave it in second, when you are still in first and you go down a short chute to a slow corner, in a case where you really want to keep it in first, it will also upshift when you are entering the corner (because you lifted on corner entry). It messes you up because you get almost no engine braking in second where you were expecting to maybe have some. Then you are stuck in second with no punch coming off the corner, Since the speed may be too great to get a downshift....
You are smarter than the car, can see the course ahead and should have a good idea of what is coming. Tell the car what you want.
While you may be a novice, and don't really understand it yet, this is really the best way to do it. Better to learn the right way from the start, or at least understand the why and wherefore so that as you improve you won't cultivate bad habits.
That being said, start in 1st and shift to 2nd when you are ready. Then you can usually leave it in 2nd.
DO NOT leave the car in 3rd or OD as Solofast is correct about the loss of control that can occur when your car is turning as the tranny shifts. Trust me, I have experienced this issue.....
