rezenclowd3

A repost of what I wrote in the "IM A NEWB!" Forums
Someone suggested I'd get a response here.

Just thought I would register. I am hoping to purchase a 96 Torch Red Vette in a couple weeks, which would become my new daily driver. Its in GREAT condition, 53K miles: $10900. Some bra wear mainly.... I took it for several test drives and it all sounds and feels fine. If all goes as planned at work here, this will be my first car purchase, before that a 89 Volvo 240DL and a 92 Ford Crown Vic that I inherited when my Grandfather passed away.

I am curious, but I would like to autox this car maybe 6 times a year in stock form, stock tires etc. Would it be worth it to buy a spare set of tires/rims for only 6x a year? Currently I race electric RC cars 2x per month, which costs about $90 per day, including upkeep between races. The RC car itself costs over $1000! However I would love to replace some of my RC addiction with the real deal. I plan on taking some driving lessons as well if possible. Anyone here that could compare RC racing costs to autox? If not, you do the math and you see what I was spending on RC, is this comparable to autox costs?


Ill be reading the boards as much as possible to help me out with any Vette problems I have obsessed over this 96 since I took a test drive

BTW, the screen name is NOT implying I use illegal drugs, just a dumb screen name that I have used since my introduction to forums and chatting over 15 years ago. Just want to get that out of the way ;-)

rezenclowd3

BTW, if the amount of money that I stated is too little or too much, please don't be afraid to tell me that I can not afford it if you feel this to be true. I will have to try AutoX once though ;-)

Carolina C4 Racer

Entry fees vary from app. $20 to $50 per day.

For now just stick with street tires. Yes race tires are much faster but they are also expensive (App. $1000 a set new or $400 a set used) & then you need a way to carry them.
Learn to drive what you have & most of all have a good time!!!!

rezenclowd3

Thanks, I read about the entry fee price, which is inline with RC entry fees as well. Sorry, but thats the only racing costs I can relate to

BTW, can the stock 96 C4 suspension geometry be changed, and if so, which aspects can be changed? (Camber, Caster, Toe, Shock angle, Droop etc) Tuning the suspension geometry is my favorite aspect of racing.

rezenclowd3

Bump

StealthLT4

I just got into autocrossing my '96, and can only tell you it's an addiction! As far as costs go, it's really just the fee for the event. Around here it's $30 for SCCA members and $45 for non-members. I'm still using street tires right now, but next season I'm gonna buy another set of GS-replicas and Hoosier A6 autox slicks.

You can change the camber, toe, and caster (I think) assuming you have some sort of gauge accurate enough to know what you're doing. Unless you want to jump into the heavily-modified categories, you can't change mounting points, but you can lower it and add stiffer springs, as well as changing the shocks.

rhneff

The suspension can be adjusted within factory limits, using stock adjustments, but you'll find the C4 to be camber-limited especially in the front. You can remove some/all of the camber shims to max out camber, but are not allowed to remove or modify the spacers that sit between the upper a-arm and the frame rail. Caster and camber use the same adjustment method i.e. insertion/removal of shims, so getting max camber may compromise caster and/or vice versa - just try to balance both sides so the car turns the same in both directions.

Toe adjustment is fairly simple and can help both with turn-in (front toe) and forward bite (rear toe). The car can be lowered using stock adjustments, but only minimally - the typical lowering kit for the front as well as the longer rear bolts are both not legal for stock auto-x (at least by SCCA Solo rules). And suspension pickup/mounting points may not be modified so you really can't affect the suspensioln geometry.

That said, with a good alignment and some good street tires the car will be reasonably effective for auto-x and certainly a lot of fun. And will still get you back-and-forth quite comfortably as a daily driver.

Good luck with it, and have fun!

BrianCunningham

Here's a good read
http://www.vettenet.org/align.html

http://www.vbandp.com/instructions/h...ruct/align.htm

rezenclowd3

Thanks guys!!! So far it looks like someone else is interested in the Vette as well, and I am still waiting to have my rates approved by various clients, so I may have to wait longer to buy the Vette. At least then I will have a little more dough and time to find a 96 LT4.

How about suspension tweak? Or do you just weigh each side to make sure all 4 tires have the same weight load? With RC, I check suspension tweak with 4 weights, one on each tire, as well as a level system that checks that front to back are in the same plane. Then one goes back and makes sure the car ride height is the same left to right, and readjust all parameters again, since as we all know, changing one thing actually changes 2 or more things.

StealthLT4

Unless you plan on doing a LOT of mods on the car and spending a TON of money, you won't be doing that much tuning on an Auto-X car. You pretty much show up and drive. You might swap on race tires, adjust tire pressure, and remove everything from the passenger compartment (not seats), but not really anything beyond that. There's no way to adjust the spring rates for each corner of a Corvette anyway, especially with leaf springs.

rezenclowd3

Ah ok. I don't plan on spending too much money on the Vette, maybe 3-4 on mods over a few years, not engine related. I was thinking I might concentrate on suspension/weight mods. The idea of just show up and drive is nice all right, but what fun is owning your first sports car if you don't try to tune it to your roads ;-) Thanks again for the info guys.

BrianCunningham

Before doing any mods, get a rule book!

SCCA? NCCC? both?

Easiest way is to just leave it stock.

rezenclowd3

Just SCCA. Ill get a rule book after I have the vette ;-) Even so, the main purpose I will be running in autox is to make me a better driver, and to give me a reason to tear into the vette to fix it myself. If I can 10-20 years down the road, then sure, Ill make a dedicated AutoX or track car.

bse53

C4s are still a good autox car.
You'll need good shocks, some folks like Bilsteins at about $100 each. Penske's are the ultimate, but are close to $4 grand.
Hoosier or Kuhmo Dot R tires, about $260-$300 each and a second set of wheels, a good alignment and you're ready to race.
Add a trailer hitch ($300) and a small trailer to haul the race tires, and your set.
This was my first year in my '93 and I had fun, learned that autox is very technical, and nothing replaces seat time.
I would agree to leave the car stock. While even the LT4 will give up a lot of hp, the car turns well and you'll be close to the c5's and c6's on pax time with enough seat time.

bse53

Here is a great thread at the SCCA forum on the best C4 to autox.
It's long, but has great information from some good drivers. I would say it's essential if you want to be competitive.

<<http://sccaforums.com/forums/thread/196835.aspx>>

rezenclowd3

I also agree seat time is invaluable. HP vs a well setup car....I prefer the well setup car. If you can't control the throttle, you lose WAY too much time. Again thanks for the links. I would just prefer a 96 C4 as it is manual, not because of the added power. Ill stay stock for now, and keep my RC running at its full potential instead of pouring money into the C4.

Bilsteins at $110 each?! Wow, that seems cheap! Not that I have money to blow, but that would be an upgrade I REALLY want to do. (I honestly don't have any idea of what upgrades cost, as this would be my first car that I would have reason to upgrade)

BSE53, I like the idea of a hitch and trailer to carry tires. I bet 90% of the time I won't have someone with a truck be able to follow me to the autox location.

Brain, I really appreciate the setup link! Thanks! Ill try tuning the vette I buy for my local streets, not that I am going to race illegally, but I just prefer a well setup car.

Spinner_89

Go out and have fun ! Start with your stock wheels and tires just the same way as you'd drive it on the street. Have fun and learn the car and get used to the tracks and how your car handles them. Your car in it's stock form will perform quite well!!! have fun !

VetteDrmr

Seat time is more important than power *or* setup. If you want to compete into SCCA, that's fine, but don't toss out other car organizations. BMW, Porsche, Miata, S2000 clubs in this area all have great events.

Find an autocross school in your area; you'll learn more in one weekend than you will in a full *season* of autocross going it alone. Get an instructor whenever you can.

Finally, read through the sticky at the top of this forum.

Have a good one,
Mike

DonF

Check in your area for a NCCC Corvette Club, their will be some racers there. They can help you out & you can race against other Corvettes in your Class. This is much better for beginners then SCCA, NCCC is strickley Corvettes & they will coach you much better.

VetteDrmr

Phuff, NCCC in my area won't give you the time of day helping you out. There are good NCCC clubs, like there are good SCCA clubs, good BMW clubs, etc. There are also the others...