nuke421

I have been given the task to take a c6 which now has low oil pressure, and exchange the motor to bring it up to 800rwhp no matter what it takes, this is a road race car so would like some input if anyone is willing to help. thanks

davidfarmer

you need big displacement and boost! I'd call Katech or Lingenfelter

SIK02SS

and a dry sump!!

nuke421

yea kind of a stock item on a sprint car lol. it will get one, it has stock pan which i can figure is the reason for low oil pressure, no windage im sure.

nuke421

im thinking bigger bore, maybe stroke it, different cam, and a charger just would like to know which has the best drivability on a road course

dfinke23

The best drivability on a road coarse is a NA setup, but with an LS2/3 you are not going to be able to bore, stroke and cam enough to get that kind of power.

Git Er Dun

A big 440+ci LS7 will get you around 700 at the crank (600ish at the tires). You could spray it for the other 200rwhp but most groups/classes don't allow nitrous. You could built the motor with 8.5:1 compression and throw on a decent blower and you would be over 800rwhp if you went with a big 440+ci motor. So if you wanted exactly 800rwhp you could do a slightly smaller motor or just less boost to get to the targeted 800rwhp...then if the need should ever arise for more hp (who would ever want more right ...) you could simply up the boost again and you would be right back at the 800-900rwhp area.

That's what I would do if I was you.

1989vette

There is NO boosting a road course car. Anyone that will tell you differently does not know what they are talking about. There is a reason that ALMOST all race cars are NA. With the amount of power being generated, even by a NA car, underhood temperatures are exceedingly hot. Toss in a turbo or supercharger and you make matters worse. A supercharged motor will have a difficult life surviving the rigors of road course racing, so if I were you I would build a NA motor that will handle the racing in which YOU choose to do. Coming from the sprint car world you know that motors are not cheap, be prepared to crack the hinge on your wallet!

longdaddy

sell the car, buy a viper and go from there. wtf do you do with 800rwhp roadrace car? scare the novice group at your local DE off the track?

Git Er Dun

Making 800rwhp N/A would be VERY tough. N/A is the best option for road racing but if they really want to get to the 800rwhp mark it will take more I think. Rob Morrison aka Racer-X built his C5 for the Ultimate Street Car Challenge. It's like a 440ci LS7 with a huge procharger that makes 1400-1600hp but over 1000rwtq. It only made a few warm up laps though and then he went to do a hot lap and it sucked the air filter through the blower when he floored it. Here's a picture of it though:





Now I'm not saying a blower or N02 is the best option but I think it's one of the only options to getting 800rwhp. With enough money and time a big blower setup probably could be made somewhat trackable and reliable.

AU N EGL

Why?

Just for the heck of it?

or?

VetteDrmr

Rip 500+ lbs. out of the car and put an LS-9 in it. Not 800 rwhp, but it'll be a hoot on the track.

Have a good one,
Mike

69427

Nonsense.

Successful turbo road course cars have been around for 40 years (Hint: Go look up this little company called Porsche.). It just takes a bit more talent (compared to N/A) to do it if you're doing all the work yourself.

longdaddy

yes, let's look at the Porsche.

http://www.porsche.com/usa/eventsand...ry/racingcars/

out of almost 50 real factory racecars (not overweight poser garage queens like 911 Turbo or 996/997 GT2) I see 3 turbocharged ones - all older cars. Hmm. I guess they are a little short on that "talent", right?

Solofast

You can boost a road course engine and make it live, but you have to do a lot more work than if it was normally aspriated. Note that 540 cubic inch marine engines typically make over 1,000 hp and they get run harder than a road course engine. While a big dispacement small block is preferred for road courses because it is lighter, you are probably looking a big block motor if you want it to be real reliable at 800 hp. That's just my opinion, but it's a lot easier to get rid of the heat if the engine is bigger to start with.

First, you need to open up the displacement and then add a blower or a turbocharger, but in either case you absolutely need to intercool it if you want it to live at big power. The bigger the displacement the lower the boost you need, so go big or go home. The limit is also based on how much the block and head gaskets can take, and GM is already likely pushing it with the ZR1, so that's going to be a starting point. Turbocharging is more efficient overall, and if the boost is kept low, lag is less of an issue. Using two small turbos will also keep the lag down.

The second point is that it's going to take a huge cooling system and a lot of air to get rid of that much heat. One of the biggest problems they had with the Bugatti was trying to get rid of the heat from 1,000 hp. Your problems will be similar. In order to keep the heat out of the oil and water, thermal barrier coatings on the pistions, cylinder head surfaces, exhaust valves and in the exhaust port will be a big help. Even with that, expect the need for a huge radiator, big intercooler and a big oil cooler to make it reliable for track duty.

In short, anything can be done if you spend enough money on it, but this is not a cheap proposition, even though it would be a lot of fun to develop it.

I frankly don't know what I'd do with 800 hp on a road course. You would need huge tires and slicks to put that much power down, or 4 wheel drive of some kind. I know Mark Donahue said that you didn't have enough power unless you could leave two black strips all the way to the next braking zone, but really, for all the headaches involved trying to get to 800 hp, I would have thought that 600-700 normally aspriated horsepower should really be as Rolls Royce used to say "adequate"...

69427

Do you have anything technical to contribute, or is this just your attempt at sarcasm?

Painrace

Many races are won by cars that don't have the most HP. Setup and throttle response with a talented driver can and will make the difference up to a point.

Jim

bosco022

Why would you need any more road race power than that supplied by Katech for the ALMS GT1 C6R cars. Plenty even for super human drivers.

That power coupled with a great suspension package, light weight, the right rubber, and talent behind the wheel will be omnipotent.

Somebody still has some coins. As suggested just call Katech, they already have been there and have the answers.

If your customers wallet is deep but not bottomless, Maybe buy Lou Gigliotti's ALMS GT2 car as roller and have
Katech build a big inch C6R motor for it. That should get the job done. It is about lap times not HP

longdaddy

no just countering your statement with actual data straight from the manufacturer you have attempted to cite as an example

69427

How are you "countering" anything? Do you deny that the turbocharged 917-30 was a succesful road racer? Pretty much destroyed the Can-Am series with its domination in my recollection. How about the 936 at Le Mans? How about the 935? How about Al Holbert's 956/962? I almost stopped going to IMSA races because I got tired of seeing the Lowenbrau car in the winner's circle so often.

I believe Audi had some reasonable luck with a turbo machine the last couple years at Le Mans and here in the US. Correct?

BMW certainly gave Greenwood some competition with their turbo cars in the seventies.

Unless I'm imagining things, I was under the impression that F1 had some damn fast turbo cars for several years. Unless I'm mistaken, F1 cars generally tend to spend most of their time on road courses.

I can go on and on with examples of successful turbo cars on road courses. Is it your contention that these cars were in fact not fast or successful?