travisnd

I'm finding the driver side end tank is wide at the top and hitting the frame rail. The space between frame rails actually widens slightly (about 1/8") in the area the radiator would normally be laid back.

I'm using RAFT (Danny Popp) brackets and I know they usually use aftermarket radiators, but they use ones designed to fit in the stock location.

I know I've seen people lay the stocker forward... ideas?




UPDATE

Had a custom radiator built to my design by Tapp, Inc. in High Point, NC. Glad I took the time to do it right vs. making the stock radiator and old oil cooler work.

Hi Volts Z06

You need more of an angle. The bottom of the radiator should be about a half inch from the sway bar. If the tank doesn't seem to fit....you need to take a 3 lb lump hammer and "gently pursuade" the frame rail. Don't worry....a few whacks andit will dimple enough to clear.

Falcon

That's a "frame modification" which carries penalties for NASA.

travisnd

Then it won't work with these RAFT brackets. Probably going to just go ahead and get a new radiator and do it up like I had originally intended... i.e. dual pass with integrated oil cooler.

Yep

Maynor29

Travis, one note on the dual pass radiator.. You'll have to do some hose rerouting as the inlet and outlet move to the same side. Usually, drivers side.

I wound up going with a circle track triple pass rad to keep the hose routing the same. The side benefit was improved cooling.

If hose rerouting is no big deal, keep the dual pass.

John

travisnd

I'd do a dual pass with inlet/outlet on the passenger side. Very clean on a LS.

Hi Volts Z06

With all due respect..... A few taps with a hammer to the frame rail is hardly a "frame modification". Use a block of wood and it will be impercievable (not to mention that the radiator will occupy that space). I've gotten the Ron Davis and the DeWitts to fit without a problem after a few taps.

Oh.....and FYI....been running ST-2 in NASA for the last 4 years. Never had anyone say anything about my frame rails being modified.

Falcon

Send that into Greg (the NASA ST Director) and see what he says.

RX-Ben

To state the obvious, compliance at the regional level is a totally different than the scrutiny that is applied at a national event.

Hi Volts Z06

I completely understand the concept of compliance at the Nationals but I think you would have a very difficult time proving a 1/4" or 3/8" variable between frames since there is definately a certain variance observed between C5's. As I stated....it only took a few taps to make adequate clearance in mine. I've seen others that dropped in.

To further the argument, how would a vehicle that had been on a frame machine and tweaked back into alignment be any different?

Falcon

Not my call.

I went through this with Greg a couple of years ago, and lost the argument.

On a regional basis, I alerted all the competitors and race directors so they were aware of the "modification" and none had a problem, but on a National level, that's Greg's call.

I wanted to err to the side of full disclosure.

LateBreak

Since you're laying it forward on custom mounts, your options for a replacement radiator are a lot more wide-open and affordable. Personally, I'm planning on running an Afco 16x26 Dual Pass when I do mine. It's thicker than the stock one but a few inches shorter in height in order to fit better in the available space. It will also make the intake problem much simpler to resolve but that's hard to explain until I get around to actually doing mine.

Maynor29

Damn. That is clean. I'd love to have that much room to play with in my car. Sweet.

Hi Volts Z06

Falcon, was your car DQ'ed at the nationals for this "mod" or was the concept of doing it knocked down by Greg?

Falcon

Greg, and the powers higher than him, knocked it down by pictures I sent. They mulled it over for a week or so, but finally ruled against it. I was as surprised as you when it was disallowed.

They said since the frame rail was modified, it wouldn't be allowed to run in ST2, only in Unlimited. That was in 2013.

In 2014 they decided to only tag a penalty factor on frame modification in ST, so you can run in ST2, but with decreased horsepower or more weight. I don't recall the point penalty, it's in the ST rules.

If y'all go to Nationals with a radiator that is pushing the frame rails, they night be looking for dimples/notches, so just beware.

Here's how mine was done. This is what they disqualified in 2013 on a National level, but regionally no one cared.

Hi Volts Z06

That's really a big dimple. I have to get a picture of how mine is done. Regardless it's BS. How the hell does that give someone an advantage that warrants a HP or weight adjustment? They should give him a job with SCCA.....he's completely destroying the spirit of the rules of ST.

Supercharged111

Gay. The intent of frame modification is to prevent you from taking a turd car with crap pickup points and addressing that weakness. That and lowering CG by moving drivetrain components, not notching a rail to clear a radiator. I hope I don't lose sight of what's truly important as I progress through the "ranks".

RX-Ben

Go read the ST rules on frame rail mods. Then tell me what you have divined the "spirit" of the ST rules to be. Then tell me how Greg's decision is contrary to either.

Supercharged111

The regional guys get it, but big NASA has their heads lodged firmly up their asses. Just like ramming Toyo RRs down our throats, they start with half the rubber of an RA1 but if you want to win now you'll buy way more tires. Shaved RA1s even have more rubber. That's what we get for supporting a for-profit racing body.

96CollectorSport

I think it's the classic "give and inch they'll take a mile" argument - the rules are pretty clear:

That is clearly a frame modification, there are several ways around it (one being installing a different radiator like what Travis is thinking of doing - which looks like a better/cleaner install btw). Do I really think that Jody's car should have to run in SU - No. But was he actually forced to run in SU regionally? Again no. This kind of scrutiny only comes up when you run at Nationals and even then I'm not sure if they are going to catch something like a dimpled frame rail - it all depends on how big the dimple is. There are a lot of cases out there where a certain car would like a certain mod - the mod is easily doable but it's cheaper / easier to do it a way that violates a rule. In that case it's better to say no and have the current rules enforced than to say yes and have a giant list of technical bulletins for every mod that infringes on a rule. It's the game we play but calling rule makers names isn't going to help anything, racing costs money and sometimes rule changes/interpretations have to be made, it sucks when they don't go our way but at least can still go racing!