Apparently Porsche does not cover / warranty their cars if they get damaged at track
01-04-2017, 11:40 PM
#1
Apparently Porsche does not cover / warranty their cars if they get damaged at track
I have talked to a guy at my last HPDE track event who owns two Porsches, a 2013 Cayman R and a newer souped up version of the Cayman, that supposed to be a track weapon. Both cars have PDK. He told me that at his second track event, he is mid level driver, pdk overheated and went into limp mod within 15 minutes. The day after he told me that the tranny no longer worked, had it towed to Porsche dealer and they denied him coverage / warranty for pdk tranny. He also told me that he got very upset but the Manager told him that the car is not a "race car", that it is a high performance street / sports car. What? I recently read an article in a Porsche exclusive magazine stating that all Porsches make great daily driver / track cars. Wow, well apparently GM is not the only company doing this. The almighty Porsche is doing similiar things. Interesting. Ger. 
01-05-2017, 12:52 AM
#2
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Porsche is almighty?
Of course they are street cars, not race cars.
Warranties cover defects in materials and workmanship. They don't cover abuse, misuse, racing, off road activities, etc.
"track car" and "hit the trail" and like terms are marketing puffery in which any reasonable person should understand is just braggadocia and attention grabbers. taking it literally is doing it wrong.
don't worry, there will plenty who will chime in and say "GM said this is the best track car ever and I should be able to race it at LeMans if I want to!" Yeah sure.
Of course they are street cars, not race cars.
Warranties cover defects in materials and workmanship. They don't cover abuse, misuse, racing, off road activities, etc.
"track car" and "hit the trail" and like terms are marketing puffery in which any reasonable person should understand is just braggadocia and attention grabbers. taking it literally is doing it wrong.
don't worry, there will plenty who will chime in and say "GM said this is the best track car ever and I should be able to race it at LeMans if I want to!" Yeah sure.
01-05-2017, 10:53 AM
#3
Melting Slicks
This sounds very unusual in that normally Porsche dealerships are very 'track' friendly places. If the car hasn't been modified in any way, he needs to escalate this event by calling PCNA and getting them involved. Hell, every 991.1 GT3 engine that has failed on track has been replaced/repaired by Porsche according to RL. Sure those are a GT car, but still.
Bish
Bish
01-05-2017, 01:38 PM
#5
Le Mans Master
Porsche is almighty?
Of course they are street cars, not race cars.
Warranties cover defects in materials and workmanship. They don't cover abuse, misuse, racing, off road activities, etc.
"track car" and "hit the trail" and like terms are marketing puffery in which any reasonable person should understand is just braggadocia and attention grabbers. taking it literally is doing it wrong.
don't worry, there will plenty who will chime in and say "GM said this is the best track car ever and I should be able to race it at LeMans if I want to!" Yeah sure.
Of course they are street cars, not race cars.
Warranties cover defects in materials and workmanship. They don't cover abuse, misuse, racing, off road activities, etc.
"track car" and "hit the trail" and like terms are marketing puffery in which any reasonable person should understand is just braggadocia and attention grabbers. taking it literally is doing it wrong.
don't worry, there will plenty who will chime in and say "GM said this is the best track car ever and I should be able to race it at LeMans if I want to!" Yeah sure.
Creating a track ready oiling system, giving track specs for the alignment, specifying what oil to use at the track, including track only components with the car and having a track mode isn't "puffery" that shouldn't be taken literally.
Also, there is a world of difference between HPDE and competitive racing.
And agreed that this sounds strange for Porsche. It's honestly just as strange for GM to deny warranty claims. It happens, it makes a big noise on the internet and the other 99.99% of warranty claims go through smooth.
01-05-2017, 02:03 PM
#6
Drifting
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2020 Corvette of the Year Finalist (track prepared)
C7 of Year Winner (track prepared) 2019
Uhh... yah GM warranty will still cover you for at least the Z51 Corvette, the SS & Z28 camaros. (not entirely sure about other models)
They do explicitly say non-timed/competitive track driving is covered.
Things like SCCA club trails or NASA time trials would in theory cause your car to not be covered.
Just for the sake of additional details, I even took my car in for a check engine light (0455) (large emissions leak) car still had numbers on it, track logo decals & tow hooks while covered in race rubber, no questions asked.
They do explicitly say non-timed/competitive track driving is covered.
Things like SCCA club trails or NASA time trials would in theory cause your car to not be covered.
Just for the sake of additional details, I even took my car in for a check engine light (0455) (large emissions leak) car still had numbers on it, track logo decals & tow hooks while covered in race rubber, no questions asked.
Last edited by lobsterroboto; 01-05-2017 at 02:06 PM.
01-05-2017, 03:02 PM
#7
Instructor
I own both brands so I have a perspective having dealt with Porsche for nearly 20 years. Porsche warranty is often not easy to deal with especially if you tell them that you track or "race" your vehicle. Like many of you, it blew my mind that these track cars are "not allowed" to go on the track if you care about a warranty for your nearly $200k toy!
All that said, proving that it was used in a track event or activity is difficult and on them to do especially if you don't tell them it was tracked. I learned a LONG time ago that you never provide more info than necessary. The words to say are: "It is just is not working properly" or "It just broke" and never saying "while racing at the track".
Honestly it is sad that Porsche who builds them for the track frowns on the use of them on the track! They do perform and hold up assuming you don't rub paint, hit immovable objects or do things that would void any warranty (run without oil/lube/coolant).
All that said, proving that it was used in a track event or activity is difficult and on them to do especially if you don't tell them it was tracked. I learned a LONG time ago that you never provide more info than necessary. The words to say are: "It is just is not working properly" or "It just broke" and never saying "while racing at the track".
Honestly it is sad that Porsche who builds them for the track frowns on the use of them on the track! They do perform and hold up assuming you don't rub paint, hit immovable objects or do things that would void any warranty (run without oil/lube/coolant).
01-05-2017, 05:38 PM
#8
Pro
A few years back while at a PCA track day event, a Boxter broke down. Owner was from out of state. He made one call to Porsche (or local dealer), the next thing I saw was a Porsche mechanic at the track fixing his car under warranty so he could continue with the afternoon session! I was blown away...
Pretty hard for Porsche to deny warranty at a PCA event!
Now we just need GM/Corvette Club sponsored trackdays across the country...!
Pretty hard for Porsche to deny warranty at a PCA event!
Now we just need GM/Corvette Club sponsored trackdays across the country...!
01-05-2017, 05:56 PM
#9
Le Mans Master
The best I can find is for the Camaro, from the chief engineer:
"If you're not modifying your car and you take your production car to a track day and you have an issue with one of your parts, it's covered under warranty."
01-05-2017, 06:00 PM
#10
Le Mans Master
A few years back while at a PCA track day event, a Boxter broke down. Owner was from out of state. He made one call to Porsche (or local dealer), the next thing I saw was a Porsche mechanic at the track fixing his car under warranty so he could continue with the afternoon session! I was blown away...
Pretty hard for Porsche to deny warranty at a PCA event!
Now we just need GM/Corvette Club sponsored trackdays across the country...!
Pretty hard for Porsche to deny warranty at a PCA event!
Now we just need GM/Corvette Club sponsored trackdays across the country...!
01-05-2017, 06:20 PM
#11
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Creating a track ready oiling system, giving track specs for the alignment, specifying what oil to use at the track, including track only components with the car and having a track mode isn't "puffery" that shouldn't be taken literally.
Also, there is a world of difference between HPDE and competitive racing.
And agreed that this sounds strange for Porsche. It's honestly just as strange for GM to deny warranty claims. It happens, it makes a big noise on the internet and the other 99.99% of warranty claims go through smooth.
GMs alignment specs are proven to not be ideal either. Not to mention if you are actually racing your car you have your own alignment specs tailored to your track and driving style.
If we are just talking about track days and fooling around then sure, it's track ready. Sorry, I just don't consider something "track ready" if you can drive it to the track and then drive it home when you're done. All that is a safer way to run harder than it's safe to do on the street. Smart thinking but it's not a track car.
01-05-2017, 06:58 PM
#12
Le Mans Master
just because it is dry sump doesn't make it "track ready." it's clearly not, unless your idea of track ready is a sunday drive in a parade lap. No Passing!!
GMs alignment specs are proven to not be ideal either. Not to mention if you are actually racing your car you have your own alignment specs tailored to your track and driving style.
If we are just talking about track days and fooling around then sure, it's track ready. Sorry, I just don't consider something "track ready" if you can drive it to the track and then drive it home when you're done. All that is a safer way to run harder than it's safe to do on the street. Smart thinking but it's not a track car.
GMs alignment specs are proven to not be ideal either. Not to mention if you are actually racing your car you have your own alignment specs tailored to your track and driving style.
If we are just talking about track days and fooling around then sure, it's track ready. Sorry, I just don't consider something "track ready" if you can drive it to the track and then drive it home when you're done. All that is a safer way to run harder than it's safe to do on the street. Smart thinking but it's not a track car.
Whether GM gave you alignment specs you like or not is irrelevant. They give owners a recommended specification for use at the track. Heck, racers change alignment from track to track. They change suspension from track to track.
And yes, you can drive your car to the track, drive on the track in a HPDE, then drive it home. Like every single other car that sees the track, whether it be a purpose built track car, needs to have brake fluid bled and oil changed.
Is it a race car? Hell no. Is it capable of being driven on the track at a HPDE in stock form (plus fresh fluids)? Absolutely.
Can an professional (ie: Competition level) level driver break stuff on it in stock form. Probably, but you'll probably need to get into slicks and some very high level professional for that anyway.
And again, RACING is not nearly the same thing as HPDE. Not even close. Racing is all out, driving +95% for as long as 30-40 minutes (and longer in endurance events) by some pretty bad *** drivers on slicks with your radiator up someone's exhaust pipe. HPDE this car is "track ready" for are 15-20 minute sessions with warm up and cool down laps driven at 75-80% on street tires that will overheat before anything else goes and no one is supposed to go near anyone and the 98% drivers range from drivers than can't keep up in lead-follow to people who wouldn't have a shot in a true competitive league.
If you think the C7 has too much maintenance to prepare for a track day, you should see real track cars
I should note this is for the Z51. The Z06/Z07 obviously has its cooling issues. No one is disputing that shortcoming.
Last edited by village idiot; 01-05-2017 at 07:08 PM.
01-05-2017, 07:22 PM
#13
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lol what? What isn't track ready about a 10 quart dry sump oiling system with auxiliary engine oil coolers? They literally give you instructions on what to do with it at the track (oil viscosity and levels) in the owners' manual.
Whether GM gave you alignment specs you like or not is irrelevant. They give owners a recommended specification for use at the track. Heck, racers change alignment from track to track. They change suspension from track to track.
And yes, you can drive your car to the track, drive on the track in a HPDE, then drive it home. Like every single other car that sees the track, whether it be a purpose built track car, needs to have brake fluid bled and oil changed.
Is it a race car? Hell no. Is it capable of being driven on the track at a HPDE in stock form (plus fresh fluids)? Absolutely.
Can an professional (ie: Competition level) level driver break stuff on it in stock form. Probably, but you'll probably need to get into slicks and some very high level professional for that anyway.
And again, RACING is not nearly the same thing as HPDE. Not even close. Racing is all out, driving +95% for as long as 30-40 minutes (and longer in endurance events) by some pretty bad *** drivers on slicks with your radiator up someone's exhaust pipe. HPDE this car is "track ready" for are 15-20 minute sessions with warm up and cool down laps driven at 75-80% on street tires that will overheat before anything else goes and no one is supposed to go near anyone and the 98% drivers range from drivers than can't keep up in lead-follow to people who wouldn't have a shot in a true competitive league.
If you think the C7 has too much maintenance to prepare for a track day, you should see real track cars
I should note this is for the Z51. The Z06/Z07 obviously has its cooling issues. No one is disputing that shortcoming.
Whether GM gave you alignment specs you like or not is irrelevant. They give owners a recommended specification for use at the track. Heck, racers change alignment from track to track. They change suspension from track to track.
And yes, you can drive your car to the track, drive on the track in a HPDE, then drive it home. Like every single other car that sees the track, whether it be a purpose built track car, needs to have brake fluid bled and oil changed.
Is it a race car? Hell no. Is it capable of being driven on the track at a HPDE in stock form (plus fresh fluids)? Absolutely.
Can an professional (ie: Competition level) level driver break stuff on it in stock form. Probably, but you'll probably need to get into slicks and some very high level professional for that anyway.
And again, RACING is not nearly the same thing as HPDE. Not even close. Racing is all out, driving +95% for as long as 30-40 minutes (and longer in endurance events) by some pretty bad *** drivers on slicks with your radiator up someone's exhaust pipe. HPDE this car is "track ready" for are 15-20 minute sessions with warm up and cool down laps driven at 75-80% on street tires that will overheat before anything else goes and no one is supposed to go near anyone and the 98% drivers range from drivers than can't keep up in lead-follow to people who wouldn't have a shot in a true competitive league.
If you think the C7 has too much maintenance to prepare for a track day, you should see real track cars
I should note this is for the Z51. The Z06/Z07 obviously has its cooling issues. No one is disputing that shortcoming.
Agree to disagree (I think, I didn't read your whole post), no big deal.
Last edited by Higgs Boson; 01-05-2017 at 07:23 PM.
01-06-2017, 11:45 AM
#14
Le Mans Master
You doobs are talking past each other saying different things:
1) You can't race a factory Corvette!
2) You can track a factory Corvette!
Both are true. Hug it out.
1) You can't race a factory Corvette!
2) You can track a factory Corvette!
Both are true. Hug it out.
Last edited by davepl; 01-06-2017 at 11:45 AM.
01-06-2017, 04:45 PM
#15
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01-07-2017, 11:38 PM
#16
Race Director
I have talked to a guy at my last HPDE track event who owns two Porsches, a 2013 Cayman R and a newer souped up version of the Cayman, that supposed to be a track weapon. Both cars have PDK. He told me that at his second track event, he is mid level driver, pdk overheated and went into limp mod within 15 minutes. The day after he told me that the tranny no longer worked, had it towed to Porsche dealer and they denied him coverage / warranty for pdk tranny. He also told me that he got very upset but the Manager told him that the car is not a "race car", that it is a high performance street / sports car. What? I recently read an article in a Porsche exclusive magazine stating that all Porsches make great daily driver / track cars. Wow, well apparently GM is not the only company doing this. The almighty Porsche is doing similiar things. Interesting. Ger.
01-08-2017, 05:11 PM
#17
My bros Boss tracks a GT4, blew the tranny and the tranny is being fixed under warranty.
I 