Current Paint Technology
08-04-2014, 01:07 PM
#1
Instructor
Thread Starter
Current Paint Technology
Here is my first plea for help. I used to road race motorcycles and out of necessity learned to make panel repairs to fiberglass and steel surfaces. I was good enough at it that I had a never-ending stream of races buddies to repair their crash damage as well.
This was before HVLP gun and the new lines of paint. I used DuPont Lucite lacquer and Imron acrylic lacquer with a high-pressure gun. Now it seems DuPont dropped the Lucite and high pressure guns for environmental reasons. What are professional painters using these days and how do you make panel repairs to a 50-year-old car that was probably painted with Lucite?
This was before HVLP gun and the new lines of paint. I used DuPont Lucite lacquer and Imron acrylic lacquer with a high-pressure gun. Now it seems DuPont dropped the Lucite and high pressure guns for environmental reasons. What are professional painters using these days and how do you make panel repairs to a 50-year-old car that was probably painted with Lucite?
08-04-2014, 01:55 PM
#2
Melting Slicks
If you still have your old guns you can use them but the paint transfer is better with the new guns. I have been using single stage urethane, which is catalyzed, and have been happy with the results so far.
08-05-2014, 07:26 PM
#4
Race Director
That is a $1,000,000 question.
It has everything to do with what you are trying to do.
Such as that light blue Corvette in your avatar. If it is lacquer, enamel and is single stage paint and you are doing spot repair...I seriously doubt that you would get a desirable result. Mainly because if any sanding and buffing is required...and the color being metallic that is a single stage...you would have problems in the finish and possibly have some metallic distortion and your blend area would look like crap.
And shooting a complete panel is possible but it would depend on the color...once again and if you can get the color tinted to match so when you 'butt-match' it to any adjacent panels...it would look acceptable.
Basecoat /clearcoat is what is normally being used in the industry today. It is not that much different than the lacquer that was used...in regards to how it is shot. I have shot my fair share of lacquer paint jobs and when the basecoat/clearcoat systems came out in the early to mid 1980's....I kinda liked it.
So as for going over a 50 year old paint job...I can not comment on that because I can not see the paint. You can prep and paint on it due to it is cured out by now. It may require a sealer to aid in the paint to adhere via a chemical bond and not as much as a mechanical bond. BUT ...that does not mean that you do not have to sand it. Sanding the paint is still required. And the techniques to blending out the basecoat are not that hard...but once again...it all depends on WHO'S paint system you plan on using...That much is a FACT.
If this is going to be your 'maiden voyage' using current paint technology. I will write this. You BETTER practice...practice....practice. I have so many tricks that I have found and use that in my paint system work well...but I know that many of them could not be used in another paint system due to their formulations of their paint are different...thus the procedures will change.
The HVLP gravity feed guns are not a problem. Having the correct gun (1.3,1.5, etc) is also important...but an experienced painter would know how to adjust 'things' to compensate if the incorrect fluid tip size (1.3,1.5) because they would ALREADY know how the paint should look when being applied. Being aware of how you 'set-up' your paint gun adjustments and air pressure is what can make all the difference....and then it is your painting style. SO you can have a gun perfectly 'set-up' and not apply the paint correctly and have a problem....and VICE-VERSA. Which is why I wrote to PRACTICE...and do not let it intimidate you. It is just a matter of procedure(s)....which is NO different if you were shooting lacquer.
DUB
It has everything to do with what you are trying to do.
Such as that light blue Corvette in your avatar. If it is lacquer, enamel and is single stage paint and you are doing spot repair...I seriously doubt that you would get a desirable result. Mainly because if any sanding and buffing is required...and the color being metallic that is a single stage...you would have problems in the finish and possibly have some metallic distortion and your blend area would look like crap.
And shooting a complete panel is possible but it would depend on the color...once again and if you can get the color tinted to match so when you 'butt-match' it to any adjacent panels...it would look acceptable.
Basecoat /clearcoat is what is normally being used in the industry today. It is not that much different than the lacquer that was used...in regards to how it is shot. I have shot my fair share of lacquer paint jobs and when the basecoat/clearcoat systems came out in the early to mid 1980's....I kinda liked it.
So as for going over a 50 year old paint job...I can not comment on that because I can not see the paint. You can prep and paint on it due to it is cured out by now. It may require a sealer to aid in the paint to adhere via a chemical bond and not as much as a mechanical bond. BUT ...that does not mean that you do not have to sand it. Sanding the paint is still required. And the techniques to blending out the basecoat are not that hard...but once again...it all depends on WHO'S paint system you plan on using...That much is a FACT.
If this is going to be your 'maiden voyage' using current paint technology. I will write this. You BETTER practice...practice....practice. I have so many tricks that I have found and use that in my paint system work well...but I know that many of them could not be used in another paint system due to their formulations of their paint are different...thus the procedures will change.
The HVLP gravity feed guns are not a problem. Having the correct gun (1.3,1.5, etc) is also important...but an experienced painter would know how to adjust 'things' to compensate if the incorrect fluid tip size (1.3,1.5) because they would ALREADY know how the paint should look when being applied. Being aware of how you 'set-up' your paint gun adjustments and air pressure is what can make all the difference....and then it is your painting style. SO you can have a gun perfectly 'set-up' and not apply the paint correctly and have a problem....and VICE-VERSA. Which is why I wrote to PRACTICE...and do not let it intimidate you. It is just a matter of procedure(s)....which is NO different if you were shooting lacquer.
DUB
08-06-2014, 11:11 AM
#5
Instructor
Thread Starter
Interior Paint Touchup
DUB,
Your reply is pretty much what I expected. I know it me took years to learn the old systems before I could tackle the plethora of spraying problems and obtain a professional finish. I don't plan on going through that learning curve again, so any repaint will have to go to a good quality shop. The paint on the car overall looks very good, but there are flaws, mostly in the substandard body work, along with a few dings. I guess minor panel repair is out of the question.
I would like to touch up some of the DuPont 4464L Dark Blue Metallic interior surfaces. What are folks using as a replacement for that paint? I need to match the flattened color.
Gene
Your reply is pretty much what I expected. I know it me took years to learn the old systems before I could tackle the plethora of spraying problems and obtain a professional finish. I don't plan on going through that learning curve again, so any repaint will have to go to a good quality shop. The paint on the car overall looks very good, but there are flaws, mostly in the substandard body work, along with a few dings. I guess minor panel repair is out of the question.
I would like to touch up some of the DuPont 4464L Dark Blue Metallic interior surfaces. What are folks using as a replacement for that paint? I need to match the flattened color.
Gene
08-06-2014, 07:32 PM
#6
Race Director
The same thing applies here also....many paint systems have interior color formulas that can be tinted and flattened. Testing will be required. It will all depend on what you are looking for and the place you get the paint. I have my own mixing service so I can tint and spray out test panels. BUT before I got my own mixing machine...I was driving back and forth to my paint supplier and having a few drops of paint added to the mix...or would leave it with them because the guy who mixed paint there at that time had a really good eye for color.
DUB
11-25-2014, 10:51 AM
#7
Instructor
Thread Starter
DUB,
The next chapter to my getting back up to speed on painting technology. I purchased a hardtop for my 1964 convertable. I found lacquer paint in the correct color for my silver/blue car. I have experimented on a piece of fiberglass and can get the color pretty close to matching. I'm not sure I can match a small panel repair on the car, but certainly close enough for the top. After thinging about it the car might not be in lacquer anyway since it's a recent respray, within the last 10 years. I have some touchup paint that came with the car, but it doesn't smell like lacquer.
The question is should I jump into acrylic enamel for the top? Imron?
TIA, Gene
The next chapter to my getting back up to speed on painting technology. I purchased a hardtop for my 1964 convertable. I found lacquer paint in the correct color for my silver/blue car. I have experimented on a piece of fiberglass and can get the color pretty close to matching. I'm not sure I can match a small panel repair on the car, but certainly close enough for the top. After thinging about it the car might not be in lacquer anyway since it's a recent respray, within the last 10 years. I have some touchup paint that came with the car, but it doesn't smell like lacquer.
The question is should I jump into acrylic enamel for the top? Imron?
TIA, Gene
11-25-2014, 06:09 PM
#8
Race Director
DUB,
The next chapter to my getting back up to speed on painting technology. I purchased a hardtop for my 1964 convertable. I found lacquer paint in the correct color for my silver/blue car. I have experimented on a piece of fiberglass and can get the color pretty close to matching. I'm not sure I can match a small panel repair on the car, but certainly close enough for the top. After thinging about it the car might not be in lacquer anyway since it's a recent respray, within the last 10 years. I have some touchup paint that came with the car, but it doesn't smell like lacquer.
The question is should I jump into acrylic enamel for the top? Imron?
TIA, Gene
The next chapter to my getting back up to speed on painting technology. I purchased a hardtop for my 1964 convertable. I found lacquer paint in the correct color for my silver/blue car. I have experimented on a piece of fiberglass and can get the color pretty close to matching. I'm not sure I can match a small panel repair on the car, but certainly close enough for the top. After thinging about it the car might not be in lacquer anyway since it's a recent respray, within the last 10 years. I have some touchup paint that came with the car, but it doesn't smell like lacquer.
The question is should I jump into acrylic enamel for the top? Imron?
TIA, Gene
I would NOT paint your hard top with an acrylic enamel. WHY??? because I can use basecoat / clearcoat and get the desired result.
I would NOT shoot your hard top in a the silver/blue WITHOUT any clear on top of it. The reason is that the second you go and buff and polish it...the chances are great that you will disturb the metallic structure and cause the top to look blotchy.
Is your car clearcoated???? Easy way to tell. Take some really fine grit wet/dry sandpaper ( 500 or 2000 grit) and find a spot you feel will not matter and just scuff it lightly with the sandpaper and see if color comes off on the paper or if it has a white residue on it. If the sandpaper is white ...then there is clear on it. AND DO NOT worry...a little bit of car polish will take out that light scuff.
Getting this color to match is one of the hardest colors...mainly due to all the pigments that make up a silver/blue. But it can be done because I have done it many times. There are many techniques, gun adjustments and choice of thinners/reducers that can actually change the color...WITHOUT even adding any more pigments to it. Being a metallic color.... I can have a full gun cup of this paint and shoot several test panels and by changing some 'things' here and there..I can have 5-6 different shades of the color that was in the gun cup. I can lighten and darken the color by changing some things....and this is not an opinion...but rather a FACT....and it is not what I have found over the years...but rather it was I was taught. So getting your color to be a 'blendable match'...is possible...but it is up to you. And I have worked on some colors for many, many days shooting test panels and tinting the color until I finally get it where it looks correct on all 3 angles under several types of light.
DUB