Improve your ARE Dry Sump System
 

I tested a new product from Gary Armstrong at ARE on Monday and Tuesday at VIR. The product, with no moving parts, is called a Spintric! It installs in the line returning oil to the dry sump tank. It removes about 75% of the air in the oil before it goes back into the tank. So, what are the results. Once the air out line was hooked up to the dry sump tank the oil level in the dry sump tank dropped about 1.25" to 1.5"! Oil pressure went up 5psi or 12%! Water temperature went down 10 degrees! I have a Ron Davis radiator so my oil temps and water temps are always low. Those with higher water and oil temps may see them both go down.

Our conclusion is with the air reduced in the oil lubrication is better, cooling is better and since the oil is denser it takes less room in the tank.

Jim

Pics? Where to buy? So this is the voodoo magic you were alluding to :)

Are you running a scavenge pump and if so is the unit on the pressure side of the pump or in the other line from the pan to the tank? How large is the unit?

Jim

cost?

All of the above questions?

Jim I was talking to Jason about possibly getting one of these a few weeks ago. I was at RichieRich's shop down here a few months ago and he had just got one in to try out. Nice to hear some real world results with it, would have been nice to try one in my car a few weeks ago when it was 108f outside at the track lol! One question for you though, where did you mount it? We were looking around trying to figure our where the best place to position it would be close to the tank.

I am on my way to AMP to instruct with Tracks Unlimited. I will post pictures Monday. Cost is around $900. Ron, I mounted mine just in front of the electrical box on the passengers side. Oil comes out of the stage III pump and into the Spintric. I am so pleased. NO MOVING PARTS and more cheap insurance! My car already cooled GREAT but the Spintric cools even more and lubes much better. This is going to be in future race cars!

Jim

Hi friends, and thank you Jim for your comments. For those of you interested in the Spintric, you can visit www.spintric.com. Or the main A R E web site at www.drysump.com. No voodo,
Just good old physics and fluid dynamics. I had it in development for almost a year, awaiting patent and testing it constantly. It has been available since early this year, and is selling very well. See the other testimonials on the Spintric web site as well as a "youtube" and other information there. Net. Price is $897, complete, but we have a "ProRacer" price of $769
It works on any dry sump system, not only A R E, however our dry sump tanks are set up for the air / oil return. Thank you, Gary Armstrong

The ARE baffle inside the tank is supposed to remove the air from the oil. Does your unit work on a different principal?

Very much so. One uses gravity, (slow) Spintric uses centrepetal force, on every drop of oil /air going back to the tank. Having both is still an assett, and the tank baffle also is to stabilize oil movement inside the tank in high cornering g's.

Nice looking product! I never thought about the gassing of oil being an issue, but it makes sense. I have an ARE 2 stage dry sump (2 scavenge lines, factory oil pump for pressure) and I'll give you a call.

Bill.

Just got some info from Gary on this last week. Looks like a nice product, and if Gary can chime in here on this, I'm going to say it is just like an airator line that would be on a higher end external dry sump setup, which we know will not fit on the Corvette without A/C removal and customer passenger side engine mount.

Spintric post
 

The Spintric.on Jims system, and all ARE LS7 ZO6 retrofit systems keep the AC, and even the factory damper. In fact, everything except the pan, factory windage tray, tank and vent can. The systems Anthony is refering to are our LS 1-6 dry sumps, in which case all but one, we mount the pumps where the AC was. However, the Spintric works on them all! That is a huge thing that is often confused. Again, all you folks looking to up date your factory dry sump to to the ARE LS7 retrofit systen, either stage 2 OR stage 3, you KEEP your air conditioner right where it is. The Spintric can even be added later, as Jim and many othere have.
For more info, schematics, and CAD drawings visit drysump.com, or call A R E 916-652-5282 gary@drysump.com.
Also, these systems are available from KATECH (#1 buyer) , LG, Pfadt, Quality Motorsports, APP Holland, Callaway Cars, and many more. See web site for engine builder / supplier list. Or, you may buy direct from
A R E with qualifications. Thank you! And Thank you Jim Painter!

VERY cool! I have worked a couple of times with Gary on my ARE dry sump system and he has ALWAYS been the best to work with! He has always been of the utmost assistance. This system sounds like something I will check on in the future! :-)

Has anyone tried to adapt this to the stock dry sump system on the LS3 or LS7? My understanding was that the problem with the stock system was too much entrained air at high lateral G loads (such as those produced when driving on sticky tires). This system would seem to help that problem, yes?

^ I would also like to know this. I'm under warranty for a while yet, but for future reference I'd like to know if this is an option to improve the stock dry sump.

I'd say the problem with the stock dry sump is that there is only one stage of scavenge and that is the reason for so much air. The air separator will do nothing if the single scavenge pump is only sucking up air (when the pickup is not submerged in oil like under heavy braking forces).

Painrace: Do you have a GM system or a 3 or 4 stage external setup?

I am wondering how much difference this will make on external setup that already has a proper tank.

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i2...cInstalled.jpg

Here is a picture of the install, Ron. We ran it with the air bleed to the dry sump tank not attached and then attached it. I believed Gary but I was quite surprised when the Dry Sump tank level wend down so fast. Remember, my system is an ARE stage III system.

THIS THING WORKS GUYS!


I might add I am surprised by how many times I see race cars where the area around the radiators and coolers are not completely blocked off so all the trapped air does not go through the coolers. This product will reduce oil/water temps but so will forcing all air through the coolers.

MANY THANKS GARY!

Jim

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i2...cInstalled.jpg

It is just in front of the fuse box, Anthony. I have all accessories on my car. Lou needs one for his race car. You will love it and the best part is no moving parts!

Jim

Dry Sump systems, by there nature, suck air from the pan and mix the air with the oil. Are they better than a wet sump? HELL YES! A little more HP but a lot more throttle response and you don't starve your engine for oil in high G situations. But, the oil system still have some air entrained in the oil and air does not lubricate. The Spintric removes 75% of that air! Gary told me with my 10 quart ARE dry sump tank the oil is in the tank for about 7 seconds at 7,000 RPM! So, even with baffles, the oil does not have much time to get the air out.

I have raced many cars and have known Gary Armstrong's ARE Dry Sump systems for years. There are no better systems and no better guy to work with. And, a big plus in my opinion, Gary is a devout Christian.

Just an old man's 2 cents!

Jim

The original GM systems did not have enough scavenge capacity so a lot of oil stayed in the engine at high RPM. Then in high G corners there was not enough oil in the tank to continually lubricate. Newer cars have a better scavenge system but I still feel it is cheaper to install an ARE stage II or Stage III system then buy a new engine.

By the way, Katech also installed piston squirters in my engine when they built it, another engine and piston life saving device.

Jim

Stage III!

Sorry to be so slow posting guys. I am in a rental house and the guy that owns the property was cutting the grass and cut my cable. All is well now.

Jim

Thanks Jim, that makes sense now. For some reason I thought that it needed to be mounted vertically. The flyer had pictures of the new tanks with integral mounts for the spintric device that ARE now offers which had them mounted vertically. Looking at them though I did not think that there was enough room to install one of those with the catch can mounted like you and I have plus all of the other stuff that is packed into that area.

Hi all, and thanks to Jim for his posts, and great photos. The Spintric has been used primarily on stage 3 systems, on LS as well as other systems with our 4 stage pumps ( 3 scavenge) ,however, all dry sumps are "over scavenging" the pan, as it is the nature of the system. The Spintric helps separate the 2 again, so the tank can be more oil tank than air/ oil tank! This is the reason the level sometimes goes down slightly, as less air is in there to displace the oil. There were questions about the a/c, and it is true on our Stage 3 LS 1-6 systems, normally the pump is "direct to block "mounted,where the A/C was, however, on the ZO6 LS7 retro fit dry sump system like Jim's, the A/C stays put! We also make a track day system for the LS 1-6 C5. C6 Corvettes, Camaro, etc ( anything LS powered) that uses a 2 scavenge cyl head mounted pump in a system we manufacture for the specific reason of keeping the Air Conditioner and factory damper in place. Great for dual purpose cars, but I always recomend our DTB systems for serious race cars. More info is avaiable at www.drysump.com and www.spintric.com. Thank You! Happy 4th and God Bless te USA! Gary Armstrong

Any thought to making a retrofit kit with lines and mount for folks with the stage 3 system like Jim and I have? Doesn't seem too difficult to install if you have the right parts and know what line goes where.

Gary,

Thanks for the info. I sent you a PM as I did not want to derail this topic.

It is not hard to install, Sean. Any good race shop can do it or someone with Aeroquip line knowledge. Maybe Katech will make a kit?

Jim

So if all dry sump systems are over scavenging the pan, spintric should help on even the stock system, correct?

Line size makes a big difference. Early Z06s did not have enough scavage volume. I would be worried about installing it on a stock scavage pump. Mine is installed on a secondary scavage pump that sends a lot of oil and air back to the ARE tank. However, Gary may say it is "OK" to install.

Jim

The Spintric will work, and will help on any dry sump systems scavenge return to the tank. However, the factory lines would need to be adapted to an Aeroquip type fitting to "splice" it in line. Also, the factory tank would need to be modified for the air return from the Spintric. There are many advantages with the A R E retro fit ZO6 system over the stock system when high lateral G's are involved ( ie any track car) and the oil control in the A R E dry sump pan and tank is the #1 benefit. The Spintric helps the deaeration of the oil one step further. If you wanted to start with that, it sure wouldnt hurt. I would contact Katech or any number of the pro builders selling our systems and see if they have a factory line to AN fitting adapter. Best wishes, Gary

Thank you very much for the info. When my 2012 GS goes out of warranty, mods will commence. Since I use the car for teaching, the dry sump will get some of the first attention. Will certainly be in touch.

Spintric
 

Jim, thank you for sharing with the forum. Gary was great to work with. After a few emails and a phone conversation my little hot rod will have cleaner blood. Bill :thumbs:

Spintric
 

Thank you Bill, Jim and all. I am happy to watch this forum and jump in when time permits, but keep in mind, your questions can be sent direct to me at gary@drysump.com or drysump@icloud.com also.
Thanks to all our great customers, and I might add that it makes it easy to be helpful and polite when 97% of all our customers are the same way. I do appreciate the excitement and professionalism that most of our customers have. When my feet hit the ground every day, even after 39 years building racing engines and components, i am ready to design more!
Sincerely, Gary Armstrong

Late seeing this post, but I was there at VIR with Jim and witnessed all he said. It is an amazing system, simple in design but highly effective. Will be putting one on my race car soon. Jerry

Here's a recent Tech Article. Link can also be found at www.drysump.com. :cool:
http://www.corvetteonline.com/oiling...lears-the-air/


https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.cor...da8b88c78a.jpg

Put the spintric on our 4 stage external dry sump system and it has performed flawlessly!

I have a Stage 3 ARE, since I read the Tech Article I am also thinking of buying a Spintric. :)