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It does not look like the C7 Z06 has carbon fiber front fenders like the C6 Z06.
The C6 Z06 Carbon and ZR1 both sport all carbon fiber body panels from the doors forward and roof. (The front fascia is ABS I believe and for a good reason).
One would think that GM would start from the ZR1 body and then make the doors and 1/4 panels in carbon fiber as well.
What is strange, is that the company that makes the body panels shows the front fenders as a 4lb weight loss and made from carbon fiber. http://plasancarbon.com
Hope I'm wrong. It is much better to shave weight off the front rather than the rear.
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It does not look like the C7 Z06 has carbon fiber front fenders like the C6 Z06.
The C6 Z06 Carbon and ZR1 both sport all carbon fiber body panels from the doors forward and roof. (The front fascia is ABS I believe and for a good reason).
Yeah, I had hoped they would have had CF fenders, floor boards, and a exposed CF under belly on the hood, as the 427 & Z06 have. I guess it came down to offsetting the additional costs for improved technology & developments costs of the C7.
It would be nice is someone developed aftermarket CF fenders for the C7 that extended further over the front wheels and eliminated the "spats". It also appears that the paint seems to have little if any orange peel on the C7's CF hood vs the composite fenders, where it is apparent is many cases.
plasan cant keep up with required body parts for c7 now they arent going to take on any more.
Where did you hear that? I was looking at having them do our parts at one time. They brag about being able to make a complete hood skin for the C7 in <20 minutes. You might be right, but why advertise it on their website?
Jim, when GM decided to add weight via supercharger, I'm sure the notion of saving a few pounds via carbon skin went out the door immediately. And now when your free of trying to save every ounce, if certainly won't matter to those who buy this car so why not GM pocket more profit?
That is why it's so strange to many of us that they decided to ruin the Z06 name. Here is a company that spent a lot of effort on the C6 Z06 for sake of weight,etc. Can bring out an insane Camaro true to its name (Z28) and then all of sudden throw all that out the window with the name. IMHO they should have called it ZR1 and then came out with an ultra carbon stripper (Z06) much like what they did with Z28.
But alas, they didn't. And it doesn't matter, an extreme few of us look for ounces of weight to save (and thus keeping our C6 Z06s). The rest of the buying population is just content with what ever. So why not simply capitalize on the extra profit? Luckily, we live in a time where you can just throw gobs of power at a pig and the pig does fly. It doesn't have to do it gracefully.
Or perhaps, the intent was to do carbon. They then saw the huge demand and little resistance to the weight gain, so they decides at the last minute before production, what's a few more pounds, no one will notice. Extra cash for us.
Regardless, it will sell like hot cakes at the price and there will be MANY ultra low mile ones at car shows all over the country.
This helps explain the cheaper than anticipated entry fee. Painted wheels instead of powder coated as well I would guess.
How many buyers would opt for this if given the opportunity?
Carbon Fiber body (ULZ code). All carbon fiber body parts including a Lexan rear window (no heated window, but who cares) It probably would cost $1800 per fender. Using that guessimate, you would have 2 front and 2 rear fenders: $7200; CF deck with Lexan window: $3500; Carbon Fiber doors with Lexan windows: $4,000. A $14,700 option for a 100% carbon fiber body.
If you look at the difference between the 1LZ vs. 3LZ, the ULZ upgrade would not be that much more, since you save around $8,000 for the 1LZ vs. the 3LZ.
The fascia and maybe the doors have to pass crash tests, so that might be a problem, but I would jump on this is a heartbeat!
Several more codes: ML30C Braille Lithium Ion 9lb battery. $1800
GU1 Braille Lithium Ion 6lb battery for the track $500
CR9: Carbon Revolution 1 piece CFRP wheels $14,500
TI1: Full Titanium exhaust like the C5 Z06 $3000
Curb weight now for the 1LZ Z06: 3524lbs Maybe more with the Z07 package.
ULZ code with other weight loss options: 3281 lbs
Weight to Power ratio: 5.05lbs/hp 5.05lbs/lb-ft torque (what counts the most)
I realize that most C7Z06 buyers would not be interested in this type of option, but there are some that would spring for a Track Ready Z06 that would smoke the Nissan GTR Nismo. 7.08.69 with a weight/power ratio fo 6.47lbs/hp (3850/595) and 8lbs/lb-ft. This is extremely important coming out of the turns and not losing speed.
It does not look like the C7 Z06 has carbon fiber front fenders like the C6 Z06.
The C6 Z06 Carbon and ZR1 both sport all carbon fiber body panels from the doors forward and roof. (The front fascia is ABS I believe and for a good reason).
One would think that GM would start from the ZR1 body and then make the doors and 1/4 panels in carbon fiber as well.
What is strange, is that the company that makes the body panels shows the front fenders as a 4lb weight loss and made from carbon fiber. http://plasancarbon.com
Hope I'm wrong. It is much better to shave weight off the front rather than the rear.
Where did you hear that? I was looking at having them do our parts at one time. They brag about being able to make a complete hood skin for the C7 in <20 minutes. You might be right, but why advertise it on their website?
this isnt the exact article i read but there was another article about their expansion and how it will increase production. It is pretty obvious that they cant keep up production right now due to the availability alot of last year only the glass roof was an option on the stingrays
This is what I have been doing today. Started in with an initial weigh-in.
New TiAL GT35R BB turbo, some new all aluminum bodywork. 1550cc Turbo/Nitrous 450 HP.
I'll get this finished by snow time. I haven't riden this monster for 20 years. I used to drag race it, but now it is being converted to street use.
What is really weird is the front fairing. I made it with a provision for ram air, but never did it. Just a hole that happens to be the exact size for a Xenon headlamp.
I designed every component on this bike from scratch including the chrome moly frame where I have a sealed airtank in the rear for my airshifter.
Did 9.50 @ 150 mph on its maiden run in Las Vegas back in the early 90s, without a wheelie bar. The rear tire was fishtailing through the traps at 150! Fun!
Some of the parts were just heaped in today to get them weighed.
Jim, when GM decided to add weight via supercharger, I'm sure the notion of saving a few pounds via carbon skin went out the door immediately. And now when your free of trying to save every ounce, if certainly won't matter to those who buy this car so why not GM pocket more profit?
That is why it's so strange to many of us that they decided to ruin the Z06 name. Here is a company that spent a lot of effort on the C6 Z06 for sake of weight,etc. Can bring out an insane Camaro true to its name (Z28) and then all of sudden throw all that out the window with the name. IMHO they should have called it ZR1 and then came out with an ultra carbon stripper (Z06) much like what they did with Z28.
But alas, they didn't. And it doesn't matter, an extreme few of us look for ounces of weight to save (and thus keeping our C6 Z06s). The rest of the buying population is just content with what ever. So why not simply capitalize on the extra profit? Luckily, we live in a time where you can just throw gobs of power at a pig and the pig does fly. It doesn't have to do it gracefully.
Or perhaps, the intent was to do carbon. They then saw the huge demand and little resistance to the weight gain, so they decides at the last minute before production, what's a few more pounds, no one will notice. Extra cash for us.
Regardless, it will sell like hot cakes at the price and there will be MANY ultra low mile ones at car shows all over the country.
Based on price I am guessing the decision process went something like this as I think they set out to buy the most marketable and highest performing car they could for the money.
If we go near the old ZR1 price we won't sell that many cars so here is our target price for the base model and he is the high end package price. We expect to sell 25,000 of these cars (I don't know, pick a number as I am sure they had one in mind) so our cost to build this needs to be cost of development divided by 25,000 plus the cost of production. What is the most important stuff to put on the car?
I mean the existing basic C7 that has the major components of the Z06 (z51 package plus magnetic ride control though the Z06 goes a bit further in those areas) is like $62,000. So you basically have $18k per car or less to play with as far as major basic changes. Out of that you have to pay all the development cost plus the increased cost to build the thing with a supercharger and more cooling and so on. That isn't a whole hell of a lot of money on which to develop and deploy a modified engine and do all the development work on the other critical parts of the car that had to be done. I would venture that the price target for the car was pretty fixed so if you add say $2,000 to production cost for the car that comes right out of the budget to do the necessary development work on everything else. If you are spreading that over 25,000 cars you expect to sell putting those $2,000 of CF panels on the car would be a $50 million dollar decision and likely a hit of that amount to development.
I am guessing they looked at it and decided that other things would help performance and (probably more importantly) sales more than shaving some pounds off the car.
Someone point out that you could possible offer it as an option later. But it also will be a really expensive car. I don't think they didn't shave more weight to put more money in their pockets but instead it was done because it was more important to bring the car in at a certain price point, offer it with an automatic and convertible option. That price and the other comforts and options more important to 90% plus of the buyers so that is what they will build. I am sure with a no holds barred approach to development they could have probably crafted a carbon fiber skin and body for a $200-300k car that would weigh a lot less. That really isn't what they set out to do though.
Carbon fiber front fenders on the C6 Z06/ZR1 showed a weight loss compared to the high density SMC used on the base C6. The base C7 uses a low density SMC, which is lighter than the SMC used on the base C6, so there isn't near the weight savings by going with carbon fiber for the C7 Z06's front fenders.
The very low weight savings is not justified by the huge increase in cost, if carbon fiber were used.
This time around someone has to make a full titanium exhaust, from manifolds to tips.
Honestly speaking id jump on this Z in a heartbeat if they offered it, So I guess if someone did offer them as aftermarket parts I might do them.
Jim, will there be a Halltech cold air intake for the Z06? Do you think there is room to squeeze out a little more power from a CAI?
Yes, we already have most of the molds done. Just need our car. The A8 is going to put us behind somewhat due to constraint that everyone is aware of.
The airbox design looks very similar to the Stingray airbox, so that is done. The section with the MAF boss/Velocity stack/filter is done. GM probably knows better than we do what we have to do, since they have already tested our Stinger at Milford Proving Grounds. It will be interesting to see their final design now on the production car.
It is our goal to find a way to lower the carbon fiber part cost for the Z06.
Capacity is our biggest obstacle. We have only sold 95 Stingers, and we are still backordered 2 to 3 weeks now.
I doubt that we'll attack the body parts this time, since hand laid pre-preg is much more expensive than the Plasan method.
Carbon fiber front fenders on the C6 Z06/ZR1 showed a weight loss compared to the high density SMC used on the base C6. The base C7 uses a low density SMC, which is lighter than the SMC used on the base C6, so there isn't near the weight savings by going with carbon fiber for the C7 Z06's front fenders.
The very low weight savings is not justified by the huge increase in cost, if carbon fiber were used.
Labor is the biggest cost aspect of carbon fiber parts. That is now a thing of the past with the patented Plasan process. I cannot imagine making an entire hood sub 20 minutes in SMC, but I could be wrong.
This is why you limit those parts to the specialty race car with a license plate C7 Z06-Z07. Make them optional and that ends the dispute over cost.
Labor is the biggest cost aspect of carbon fiber parts. That is now a thing of the past with the patented Plasan process. I cannot imagine making an entire hood sub 20 minutes in SMC, but I could be wrong.
This is why you limit those parts to the specialty race car with a license plate C7 Z06-Z07. Make them optional and that ends the dispute over cost.
Since the hood on the C7 is already made of carbon fiber, it's immaterial to this discussion.
I thought that the cycle time on conventional SMC molding was in the 1 minute to 6 minute range. "Faster cycle times and lower unit cost are possible when sheet-molding compounds (SMC) are used in the process. Fiberglass thermoset SMC cures in 30-150 seconds, and overall cycle time may be as low as 60 seconds. Major SMC markets worldwide include high-volume electrical components and the transportation industry." http://www.compositesone.com/process.php
Look at the number of presses/molds that would be required for making parts with a 20 minute cycle times vs parts produced with a 3 minute cycle time. That's a huge investment in machines and tooling.
Just look at the constraints there are on carbon fiber roofs. Tells you how limited their production capacity is. Just think what it would be if they were making all the body panels in carbon fiber.
Just the fact that the fenders, doors, rocker panels, etc are made of SMC and not carbon fiber tells me that the weight savings of using carbon fiber was not justified because of the increase in cost by using carbon fiber on the production Z06.
Of course, making extremely low production parts from carbon fiber for a select market is a different matter. I doubt you can make replacement fenders doors, rocker panels etc in carbon fiber and sell them to me for what GM will sell me a SMC part.
I doubt that very many people would be willing to pay an additional $10,000 to save 35 pounds in a production Z06.
09-20-2014, 08:39 PM
Carbon Fiber front fenders?
