Who is King? C6 ZR1 or C7 ZO6
10-23-2014, 09:13 AM
#21
Melting Slicks
http://www.roadandtrack.com/go/first...?click=main_sr
Read the quote below from Tadge.
Forget the ZR1. When GM’s engineers put the first 2015 Z06 mule on the Milford Road Course, the car promptly set a new lap record. More insane? It did it using engine and suspension calibrations that were nothing but good guesses by engineers. Tadge Juechter, chief engineer and vehicle line director for Corvette, says there’s more speed in the car.
“The question isn’t how close we can get to the ZR1,” he says. “It’s how far we can surpass it.”
The final version will be faster. Much faster. Here’s why.
Read the quote below from Tadge.
Forget the ZR1. When GM’s engineers put the first 2015 Z06 mule on the Milford Road Course, the car promptly set a new lap record. More insane? It did it using engine and suspension calibrations that were nothing but good guesses by engineers. Tadge Juechter, chief engineer and vehicle line director for Corvette, says there’s more speed in the car.
“The question isn’t how close we can get to the ZR1,” he says. “It’s how far we can surpass it.”
The final version will be faster. Much faster. Here’s why.
10-23-2014, 10:01 AM
#22
Safety Car
10-23-2014, 11:09 AM
#23
Team Owner
Compare the base 2013 C6 ZR1 vs the base C7 Z06 and compare the C6 ZR1 w/PDE vs the C7 Z06 w/Z07.
Even then the base C7 Z06 has the better Michelin Super Sports vs the Michelin PS2's found on the base ZR1. That alone should really help the base C7 Z06. On the C7 Z06 with the Z07 option, it comes with the newer version of the CUP tires vs the older version CUPS used on the C6 ZR1. That also would be an advantage to the C6 Z06 with the Z07 option.
Now, since tires are consumable items and the newer versions of the tires used on the C7 Z06 can be retrofitted to the C6 ZR1(and is not considered MODDING), then it's very questionable as to which car will actually be faster/quicker when mounted with the same tires.
Also the 2013 ZR1 with the PDE option has a different transmission(MH3) than the base 2013 ZR1 transmission(ME2), which really helps acceleration past 150 MPH, when both versions are forced to shift from 4th to 5th gear. At this point we don't know if two different transmissions will be offered(like with the 2103 ZR1) on the C7 Z06, but I suspect that the C7 Z06 will have gear ratios similar to the base C6 ZR1's transmission(1st -6th).
To me, that would give the advantage to the ZR1 with the PDE option vs the C7 Z06 with the Z07 option(at speeds from 150 to 184). Past 184 MPH the gearing advantage would favor the base C7 Z06 and the base C6 ZR1 over the C7 Z06 with Z07 and the 2013 C6 ZR1 with PDE.
Last edited by JoesC5; 10-23-2014 at 11:14 AM.
10-23-2014, 11:22 AM
#24
Melting Slicks
http://www.roadandtrack.com/go/first...?click=main_sr
Read the quote below from Tadge.
Forget the ZR1. When GM’s engineers put the first 2015 Z06 mule on the Milford Road Course, the car promptly set a new lap record. More insane? It did it using engine and suspension calibrations that were nothing but good guesses by engineers. Tadge Juechter, chief engineer and vehicle line director for Corvette, says there’s more speed in the car.
“The question isn’t how close we can get to the ZR1,” he says. “It’s how far we can surpass it.”
The final version will be faster. Much faster. Here’s why.
Read the quote below from Tadge.
Forget the ZR1. When GM’s engineers put the first 2015 Z06 mule on the Milford Road Course, the car promptly set a new lap record. More insane? It did it using engine and suspension calibrations that were nothing but good guesses by engineers. Tadge Juechter, chief engineer and vehicle line director for Corvette, says there’s more speed in the car.
“The question isn’t how close we can get to the ZR1,” he says. “It’s how far we can surpass it.”
The final version will be faster. Much faster. Here’s why.
10-23-2014, 12:05 PM
#26
10-23-2014, 12:10 PM
#27
Burning Brakes
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Difference of drivers that can squeeze out the nuance difference in performance times vs 98% of people here who can't.
For all but a few it is all bench racing bs.
10-23-2014, 04:53 PM
#29
Racer
Member Since: Jun 2014
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The Milford track is a pretty tight low speed track, in comparison. Hence, the significant improvements in C7Z downforce over the ZR1 will probably make a MUCH more significant difference at the Ring than at Milford.
Anyone with track experience agree?
10-23-2014, 04:55 PM
#30
Burning Brakes
When it comes to Nurburgring times, consider this:
The Milford track is a pretty tight low speed track, in comparison. Hence, the significant improvements in C7Z downforce over the ZR1 will probably make a MUCH more significant difference at the Ring than at Milford.
Anyone with track experience agree?
The Milford track is a pretty tight low speed track, in comparison. Hence, the significant improvements in C7Z downforce over the ZR1 will probably make a MUCH more significant difference at the Ring than at Milford.
Anyone with track experience agree?
10-23-2014, 07:02 PM
#31
Melting Slicks
When it comes to Nurburgring times, consider this:
The Milford track is a pretty tight low speed track, in comparison. Hence, the significant improvements in C7Z downforce over the ZR1 will probably make a MUCH more significant difference at the Ring than at Milford.
Anyone with track experience agree?
The Milford track is a pretty tight low speed track, in comparison. Hence, the significant improvements in C7Z downforce over the ZR1 will probably make a MUCH more significant difference at the Ring than at Milford.
Anyone with track experience agree?
It doesn't sound like I would call it a tight low speed track. They try to mimick the Ring. I do agree that the new Z07 will have an advantage on high speed corners with all the aero. I would expect it to be 4-7 sec quicker on a track the length of the Ring.
Last edited by racerns; 10-23-2014 at 09:07 PM.
10-23-2014, 10:38 PM
#32
10-24-2014, 12:18 AM
#33
Racer
Member Since: Jun 2014
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You may want to read this article: http://www.superchevy.com/features/v...e-the-crucible
It doesn't sound like I would call it a tight low speed track. They try to mimick the Ring. I do agree that the new Z07 will have an advantage on high speed corners with all the aero. I would expect it to be 4-7 sec quicker on a track the length of the Ring.
It doesn't sound like I would call it a tight low speed track. They try to mimick the Ring. I do agree that the new Z07 will have an advantage on high speed corners with all the aero. I would expect it to be 4-7 sec quicker on a track the length of the Ring.
), the real Ring has some much faster turns. Obviously kidding. But seriously, it's a pretty damn good sim 
Last edited by Flyboy22; 10-24-2014 at 12:21 AM.
10-24-2014, 02:48 AM
#34
10-24-2014, 03:38 AM
#35
Safety Car
For a fair comparison, the base ZR1 does not come with Cup tires. The CUPS come with the extra cost PDE option on the ZR1.
Compare the base 2013 C6 ZR1 vs the base C7 Z06 and compare the C6 ZR1 w/PDE vs the C7 Z06 w/Z07.
Even then the base C7 Z06 has the better Michelin Super Sports vs the Michelin PS2's found on the base ZR1. That alone should really help the base C7 Z06. On the C7 Z06 with the Z07 option, it comes with the newer version of the CUP tires vs the older version CUPS used on the C6 ZR1. That also would be an advantage to the C6 Z06 with the Z07 option.
Now, since tires are consumable items and the newer versions of the tires used on the C7 Z06 can be retrofitted to the C6 ZR1(and is not considered MODDING), then it's very questionable as to which car will actually be faster/quicker when mounted with the same tires.
Also the 2013 ZR1 with the PDE option has a different transmission(MH3) than the base 2013 ZR1 transmission(ME2), which really helps acceleration past 150 MPH, when both versions are forced to shift from 4th to 5th gear. At this point we don't know if two different transmissions will be offered(like with the 2103 ZR1) on the C7 Z06, but I suspect that the C7 Z06 will have gear ratios similar to the base C6 ZR1's transmission(1st -6th).
To me, that would give the advantage to the ZR1 with the PDE option vs the C7 Z06 with the Z07 option(at speeds from 150 to 184). Past 184 MPH the gearing advantage would favor the base C7 Z06 and the base C6 ZR1 over the C7 Z06 with Z07 and the 2013 C6 ZR1 with PDE.
Compare the base 2013 C6 ZR1 vs the base C7 Z06 and compare the C6 ZR1 w/PDE vs the C7 Z06 w/Z07.
Even then the base C7 Z06 has the better Michelin Super Sports vs the Michelin PS2's found on the base ZR1. That alone should really help the base C7 Z06. On the C7 Z06 with the Z07 option, it comes with the newer version of the CUP tires vs the older version CUPS used on the C6 ZR1. That also would be an advantage to the C6 Z06 with the Z07 option.
Now, since tires are consumable items and the newer versions of the tires used on the C7 Z06 can be retrofitted to the C6 ZR1(and is not considered MODDING), then it's very questionable as to which car will actually be faster/quicker when mounted with the same tires.
Also the 2013 ZR1 with the PDE option has a different transmission(MH3) than the base 2013 ZR1 transmission(ME2), which really helps acceleration past 150 MPH, when both versions are forced to shift from 4th to 5th gear. At this point we don't know if two different transmissions will be offered(like with the 2103 ZR1) on the C7 Z06, but I suspect that the C7 Z06 will have gear ratios similar to the base C6 ZR1's transmission(1st -6th).
To me, that would give the advantage to the ZR1 with the PDE option vs the C7 Z06 with the Z07 option(at speeds from 150 to 184). Past 184 MPH the gearing advantage would favor the base C7 Z06 and the base C6 ZR1 over the C7 Z06 with Z07 and the 2013 C6 ZR1 with PDE.
10-24-2014, 08:28 AM
#36
Racer
Member Since: Jan 2013
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http://www.roadandtrack.com/go/first...?click=main_sr
Read the quote below from Tadge.
Forget the ZR1. When GM’s engineers put the first 2015 Z06 mule on the Milford Road Course, the car promptly set a new lap record. More insane? It did it using engine and suspension calibrations that were nothing but good guesses by engineers. Tadge Juechter, chief engineer and vehicle line director for Corvette, says there’s more speed in the car.
“The question isn’t how close we can get to the ZR1,” he says. “It’s how far we can surpass it.”
The final version will be faster. Much faster. Here’s why.
Read the quote below from Tadge.
Forget the ZR1. When GM’s engineers put the first 2015 Z06 mule on the Milford Road Course, the car promptly set a new lap record. More insane? It did it using engine and suspension calibrations that were nothing but good guesses by engineers. Tadge Juechter, chief engineer and vehicle line director for Corvette, says there’s more speed in the car.
“The question isn’t how close we can get to the ZR1,” he says. “It’s how far we can surpass it.”
The final version will be faster. Much faster. Here’s why.
Last edited by OHV4LIFE; 10-24-2014 at 08:34 AM.
10-24-2014, 11:02 AM
#37
Melting Slicks
I recall seeing an interview with Tadge where he mentioned that typically the previous gen Vette can initially beat the the early test mules for the next gen Vettes. He said that's because the previous gen has already had its suspension tuning refined whereas the early mules for the current gen hasn't. He said the C7 Z06 was the first time that a next gen Vette was able to beat the previous gen in its first try. Therefore, one should expect for the C7Z to put more distance between itself and the C6 ZR1.
10-24-2014, 12:23 PM
#38
Melting Slicks
The video is posted in this thread. He also gives some of that credit to improved computer modeling and the new Cup 2 tires as to why it was so fast out of the box. Some on hear thought that ment it was going to see that much more improvement in tuning, but I really think it just got them closer to the final product out of the box. Which is awesome from an engineering stand point by the way. The fact is it appears that it ended up 1sec faster on that same 2.9 mile test track, which is a nice improvement but is not as much as some were expecting when you take into consideration the tire upgraded.
10-24-2014, 12:32 PM
#39
Melting Slicks
10-24-2014, 12:41 PM
#40
Burning Brakes
Same day, same driver, same tire... The only right way to do this comparison.
The difference in tires alone between what the ZR1 previously came with and what the new Cup 2's on the Z06 is enough to make a second difference per lap. Tadge even admits that the tires play a role in the Z06's performance figures.
The difference in tires alone between what the ZR1 previously came with and what the new Cup 2's on the Z06 is enough to make a second difference per lap. Tadge even admits that the tires play a role in the Z06's performance figures.