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This is a warning to stay away from Blueprint engines. In summary, Blueprint Engines did not honor their labor commitment in their warranty. Blueprint engines did not communicate to me in a professional or timely manner; I had to reach out to them every time to get an update.
I purchased a Blueprint engines crate engine (BP35512CT1) from Summit racing in 2015 for my 86 coupe. I went with Blueprint because of the warranty and the horsepower ratings (402hp). I had a professional shop do the entire installation, and made sure that all the installation and break-in procedures were followed. Furthermore, all maintenance procedures have been followed.
When I got the car dynoed by a reputable/esteemed local race shop, the wheel horsepower was much lower than I expected, around 250whp. So a few months later, I got it tuned by another reputable/esteemed race shop, and same thing, wheel horsepower was around 240. I took it to another reputable/esteemed race shop a few months later for a dyno tune, and once again, wheel horsepower was around 240. I had always attributed it to the 700r4 and IRS stealing all the power. I had called Blueprint engines to ask about the lower than expected horsepower and was told that it was because of a “loose converter.”
The last two shops that tuned the engine had both pointed out that engine wasn’t running quite right. I always attributed the rough idling to the cam specs, because AFR, timing, etc. was always on point. The last shop ran a compression test, and cylinders #6 and #8 had 0 compression. That explained the missing 80 horsepower from what I was originally expecting.
I called Blueprint engines to file a warranty claim, explain the situation, and authorize work on the car. Blueprint engines authorized the shop to do the work, so the shop took off the heads and saw a blown head gasket between 6 and 8, as well as two little grooves between the combustion chambers of 6 and 8. The block was undamaged, and the pistons and spark plugs were all in good shape, with no signs of melting or damage. The only damage was in the aluminum head between combustion chambers of cylinders 6 and 8. I did some searching and found that Blueprint Engines uses China head castings. Three separate mechanical engineers, and two separate mechanics told me that the damage was due to either a casting error or improper torque sequencing.
When I spoke with Ken, the warranty rep, on the phone, he explained that Blueprint Engines would ship a new head and a shipping label to return the damaged head back to Blueprint Engines. Ken said that Blueprint Engines would perform an inspection on the head to see what caused the damage.
After waiting with no word from Blueprint Engines for 2 weeks, I called Blueprint Engines and was told that the cylinder head was being built. Blueprint engines sent a new cylinder head 3 weeks after the old head had been removed. That surprised me because they are readily available at Jegs, Summit, etc., so the inventory should have been large enough to ship quickly. The old head was returned to Blueprint Engines. I paid the local shop up front for the labor, and I must give them the highest accolades for their professionalism and service; they were always prompt and great at communicating. I got all of my updates through the local shop, not Blueprint Engines. The local shop called me every step of the way and updated me on their progress, but I had to reach out to Blueprint Engines for any updates at all.
After waiting 3 more weeks after the installation and no word from Blueprint Engines, I called Blueprint Engines for an update. The customer service rep told me that the head had not been inspected, and took a message to have Ken call me back. Ken called me back a few hours later, saying that the part had been inspected. Ken repeatedly called me by the wrong name “Dave”, accused me of negligence, stated that Blueprint Engines will not pay for the labor, and that he hopes that the car was tuned right this time. He directly insulted me by calling me the wrong name while reading my reference file, and also insulted my installation mechanic and all three respectable dyno tuners by saying that it was not tuned correctly in the past. All procedures outlined by Blueprint Engines were followed from the start by ASE certified technicians.
I am disgusted by Blueprint Engines’ quality and service. I purchased their engine because of the warranty and “value”, unfortunately having disregarded others’ previous bad experiences with Blueprint Engines that I had read. I was without my only car for 6 weeks and am left with a bill of almost $1000 because Blueprint Engines did not stand up to their word and did not do the right thing. After this ordeal with Blueprint Engines, I have spent the same amount of money to get a GM crate motor, which would not have had the quality issues that I experienced. Please learn from my ordeal and stay away from Blueprint Engines.
If it was me, I would make a copy of all supporting documentation and notify Summit Racing of the situation. While they are not the warranty supporter, their business is affected by your problem. Summit has a reputation to uphold and they might have enough pull to influence them.
It is worth a try.
Also, if there is no help from Summit, make sure to post up a scathing review (as long as it truly is deserved) on the engine on Summit's site.
I appreciate the review. Thanks for posting. I agree w/the above post about pasting your review from here, on the Summit page for that particular engine.
Ron, they claim to be casting their own 400 blocks now. IDK about the heads.
I appreciate the review. Thanks for posting. I agree w/the above post about pasting your review from here, on the Summit page for that particular engine.
Ron, they claim to be casting their own 400 blocks now. IDK about the heads.
If it was me, I would make a copy of all supporting documentation and notify Summit Racing of the situation. While they are not the warranty supporter, their business is affected by your problem. Summit has a reputation to uphold and they might have enough pull to influence them.
any time I have had a problem with something I bought thru Summit. . they were quick to make good without to much much jaw jacking. however, it was parts and not something as complicated as an engine with its many interpetations of what could have caused the problem. best of luck.
Last edited by ghoastrider1; 08-18-2016 at 07:20 AM.
Hey guys, we are not getting on here to argue with anyone, but wanted to share additional information about the failure.
BluePrint Engines supplied a long block – complete through the oil pan and valve covers. We did not supply the engine with an intake, carb, or distributor. The OP or Shop sourced and installed these components on their own. The engine was Dyno tested at our facility prior to shipping to Summit Racing. (add-on components are removed after dyno testing on this specific configuration.)
We received a call from the OP on June 30th 2016. We were told “one of the intake valves was hanging open, causing backfiring through the carb.” After in-field diagnosis, we were told by his shop that two cylinders had 0 compression. On July 6th the shop pulled the head and called to inform us on the failure. They found that the head gasket was blown between 6 and 8. We received pictures and agreed with the shop that fire slotting had occurred. On July 6th we advised the customer that this was likely not going to be covered by warranty, but did offer to send him a replacement head and gaskets at no charge. We did send these out 9 days after we said we would – that is not acceptable by our standards and can understand the customers frustration on that part. We also advised that if we found something other than fire slotting during our inspection, that was a manufacturing or parts defect, we would reimburse his labor bill.
There was a question about the head bolts being torqued properly. Upon inspection we found the gasket armor to measure .042” .0435” around all cylinders, this would indicate that all head bolts were properly torqued and not the cause of failure.
Here is a little data regarding the head gaskets used on this engine configuration. This engine was built with FelPro 501SD head gaskets. These are severe duty gaskets – designed specifically for superior performance and longevity under the toughest conditions. Their increased armor thickness and stainless steel material offer the best resistance to withstand “some” overheat, pre-ignition and detonation. They of course cannot withstand these symptoms for long periods of time. We intentionally designed the engines with an “overkill” head gasket knowing that some customers could have run ability issues if not tuned properly. This was a safety margin we thought was important to add. Gaskets that have failed due to detonation or pre-ignition will usually have cracked armor around the combustion chamber which leads to burn-through. You can see signs of this in the picture the shop provided to us.
Overheat, along with pre-ignition and detonation is one of the most common failures of head gaskets. The engine's cooling system, air/fuel mixture and ignition system all have to be correct to minimize the risks of overheat, pre-ignition and detonation. Unfortunately all of these things were out of our control with this engine.
We hate to see customers have issues with our product. It’s just bad for business. This is why we work with customers on these issues, like offering a replacement head and gaskets – at no cost – on a failure that was caused by something outside of our control. None the less, this post has proven we still have flaws in our system – delays in replacement parts, slow response time, etc… and for that jojo1590 – thank you for helping us be better!
I hope you all consider all the facts before encouraging people not to do business with us.
Hey guys, we are not getting on here to argue with anyone, but wanted to share additional information about the failure.
BluePrint Engines supplied a long block – complete through the oil pan and valve covers. We did not supply the engine with an intake, carb, or distributor. The OP or Shop sourced and installed these components on their own. The engine was Dyno tested at our facility prior to shipping to Summit Racing. (add-on components are removed after dyno testing on this specific configuration.)
We received a call from the OP on June 30th 2016. We were told “one of the intake valves was hanging open, causing backfiring through the carb.” After in-field diagnosis, we were told by his shop that two cylinders had 0 compression. On July 6th the shop pulled the head and called to inform us on the failure. They found that the head gasket was blown between 6 and 8. We received pictures and agreed with the shop that fire slotting had occurred. On July 6th we advised the customer that this was likely not going to be covered by warranty, but did offer to send him a replacement head and gaskets at no charge. We did send these out 9 days after we said we would – that is not acceptable by our standards and can understand the customers frustration on that part. We also advised that if we found something other than fire slotting during our inspection, that was a manufacturing or parts defect, we would reimburse his labor bill.
There was a question about the head bolts being torqued properly. Upon inspection we found the gasket armor to measure .042” .0435” around all cylinders, this would indicate that all head bolts were properly torqued and not the cause of failure.
Here is a little data regarding the head gaskets used on this engine configuration. This engine was built with FelPro 501SD head gaskets. These are severe duty gaskets – designed specifically for superior performance and longevity under the toughest conditions. Their increased armor thickness and stainless steel material offer the best resistance to withstand “some” overheat, pre-ignition and detonation. They of course cannot withstand these symptoms for long periods of time. We intentionally designed the engines with an “overkill” head gasket knowing that some customers could have run ability issues if not tuned properly. This was a safety margin we thought was important to add. Gaskets that have failed due to detonation or pre-ignition will usually have cracked armor around the combustion chamber which leads to burn-through. You can see signs of this in the picture the shop provided to us.
Overheat, along with pre-ignition and detonation is one of the most common failures of head gaskets. The engine's cooling system, air/fuel mixture and ignition system all have to be correct to minimize the risks of overheat, pre-ignition and detonation. Unfortunately all of these things were out of our control with this engine.
We hate to see customers have issues with our product. It’s just bad for business. This is why we work with customers on these issues, like offering a replacement head and gaskets – at no cost – on a failure that was caused by something outside of our control. None the less, this post has proven we still have flaws in our system – delays in replacement parts, slow response time, etc… and for that jojo1590 – thank you for helping us be better!
I hope you all consider all the facts before encouraging people not to do business with us.
My cooling system is beyond adequate, and the carburetor is a 600cfm quality carburetor mounted to a dual plane quality intake (the same combination that Blueprint engines performed the original power measurement). As mentioned above, the distributor is a Performance Distributors DUI distributor.
" On July 6th we advised the customer that this was likely not going to be covered by warranty, but did offer to send him a replacement head and gaskets at no charge. We did send these out 9 days after we said we would – that is not acceptable by our standards and can understand the customers frustration on that part.We also advised that if we found something other than fire slotting during our inspection, that was a manufacturing or parts defect, we would reimburse his labor bill." This was not made clear. I had to ask if there would be a charge for the head and gaskets, and the labor reimbursement statement was left vague.
Had I known that I would have received the poor customer service and been without my only car for 6 weeks, then I would have paid the shop a prior agreed $900 to repair the head at a local machine shop. The shop was exceptional with all of their service and timeliness, so I would have been without my car for a maximum of 2 weeks. The rate-limiting factor of the return would have been the machine shop's turnaround time, as the shop re-installed the heads within 2 days of receiving the new head from Blueprint engines. Furthermore, had I kept the repair local, I would not have dealt with the insults and shady business practices that I experienced with Blueprint engines.
After shipping the head back to Blueprint Engines, I got as many expert opinions as I could. The three different mechanical engineers with whom I conferred all have engine building experience and two of them race. One was a machinist prior to getting his engineering degrees (BS, MS). The tech who did the head installation used ARP bolts to replace the bolts from Blueprint engines. He specifically commented on the poor quality of the head bolts that were on the engine. Another tech at the same shop said that it was either due to the bolts (improper torque, quality) or a head casting defect, since the pistons, plugs, and block were all in unharmed condition.
The engine had approximately 8,000 miles on it when the above referenced ordeal with Blueprint Engines began. It had approximately 2000 miles on it when I got the first dyno tune and saw the low hp rating. It had been tuned from the start at installation by an ASE master mechanic. The warranty is for 30 months and 50,000 miles. I have receipts and documentation for everything done to the car.
I am the most concerned with spreading the word to others to prevent them from going through the same debacle, insulting, and shady business practices that I experienced with Blueprint Engines. When Ken called to tell me that they would not honor their labor warranty, he used a blocked number in contrast to previous conversations where he used his company line. After insulting me and my tuners by saying he hoped that it was tuned right this time and we won't have the same problem again, instead of leaving me with his direct line, he gave me the general company number. When I called again to speak with Ken, the operator sent me to Ken's phone line where Ken screened the call and has never returned my call. I have all documentation and references available should Ken ever return my call. It is disgusting that the only details I have received for why Blueprint Engines is not honoring their labor warranty have been via their response to a complaint forum.
I was always cordial, factual, and never rude in any of the discussions that I had with anyone from the company. When I spoke with another rep and told him that all procedures had been followed from the start, his tone quickly changed and he ended the conversation. I was never asked for any documents or references, but rather ignored.
I hope that if anyone is considering an engine from Blueprint Engines, he/she does not let the fancy horsepower ads and "value" convince him/her to purchase their product. The old saying "you get what you pay for" still holds true. The initial excitement that one may receive is not worth the risk of poor quality and subsequent terrible customer service, where any problems are blamed on the customer for negligence.
Last edited by batmanrobinwilliams; 08-18-2016 at 12:39 PM.
I have no skin in this game but I have a question - in the first posting we are told by jojo1590 [I]I always attributed the rough idling to the cam specs, because AFR, timing, etc. was always on point. The last shop ran a compression test, and cylinders #6 and #8 had 0 compression. That explained the missing 80 horsepower from what I was originally expecting. [/I]
At a minimum the AFR would not show correct as the blown head gasket creates a crossfire which leads to unburnt fuel in the cylinders. Your AFR should have been out of whack.
On a second note having a "high quality carburetor" does not offer any assurances that it works correct on a motor. We are losing the talented folks that know how to wrench on carbs and make them work correctly. I can attest to factory carbs not being correct out of the box both from the tuning point and the Mfg point. One back fire through a carb even with blowout proof valves can screw one up and have you chasing your tail.
I am sorry you had issues, it sucks I get it, been there lived that dream, hopefully the car will run great here on out. I appreciate the fact that Blueprint stepped up with their version of the story - most of the vendors hide or become belligerent even if it is their fault.
I have no skin in this game but I have a question - in the first posting we are told by jojo1590 [I]I always attributed the rough idling to the cam specs, because AFR, timing, etc. was always on point. The last shop ran a compression test, and cylinders #6 and #8 had 0 compression. That explained the missing 80 horsepower from what I was originally expecting. [/I]
At a minimum the AFR would not show correct as the blown head gasket creates a crossfire which leads to unburnt fuel in the cylinders. Your AFR should have been out of whack.
On a second note having a "high quality carburetor" does not offer any assurances that it works correct on a motor. We are losing the talented folks that know how to wrench on carbs and make them work correctly. I can attest to factory carbs not being correct out of the box both from the tuning point and the Mfg point. One back fire through a carb even with blowout proof valves can screw one up and have you chasing your tail.
I am sorry you had issues, it sucks I get it, been there lived that dream, hopefully the car will run great here on out. I appreciate the fact that Blueprint stepped up with their version of the story - most of the vendors hide or become belligerent even if it is their fault.
Thanks for your comment. Please see the attached dyno reading with wideband AFR. You will see that it is on point. I have not mentioned the tuners' names to keep them out of this, but they are all experienced racers and well known tuners who specialize with carbs.
Hey guys, we are not getting on here to argue with anyone, but wanted to share additional information about the failure.
BluePrint Engines supplied a long block – complete through the oil pan and valve covers. We did not supply the engine with an intake, carb, or distributor. The OP or Shop sourced and installed these components on their own. The engine was Dyno tested at our facility prior to shipping to Summit Racing. (add-on components are removed after dyno testing on this specific configuration.)
We received a call from the OP on June 30th 2016. We were told “one of the intake valves was hanging open, causing backfiring through the carb.” After in-field diagnosis, we were told by his shop that two cylinders had 0 compression. On July 6th the shop pulled the head and called to inform us on the failure. They found that the head gasket was blown between 6 and 8. We received pictures and agreed with the shop that fire slotting had occurred. On July 6th we advised the customer that this was likely not going to be covered by warranty, but did offer to send him a replacement head and gaskets at no charge. We did send these out 9 days after we said we would – that is not acceptable by our standards and can understand the customers frustration on that part. We also advised that if we found something other than fire slotting during our inspection, that was a manufacturing or parts defect, we would reimburse his labor bill.
There was a question about the head bolts being torqued properly. Upon inspection we found the gasket armor to measure .042” .0435” around all cylinders, this would indicate that all head bolts were properly torqued and not the cause of failure.
Here is a little data regarding the head gaskets used on this engine configuration. This engine was built with FelPro 501SD head gaskets. These are severe duty gaskets – designed specifically for superior performance and longevity under the toughest conditions. Their increased armor thickness and stainless steel material offer the best resistance to withstand “some” overheat, pre-ignition and detonation. They of course cannot withstand these symptoms for long periods of time. We intentionally designed the engines with an “overkill” head gasket knowing that some customers could have run ability issues if not tuned properly. This was a safety margin we thought was important to add. Gaskets that have failed due to detonation or pre-ignition will usually have cracked armor around the combustion chamber which leads to burn-through. You can see signs of this in the picture the shop provided to us.
Overheat, along with pre-ignition and detonation is one of the most common failures of head gaskets. The engine's cooling system, air/fuel mixture and ignition system all have to be correct to minimize the risks of overheat, pre-ignition and detonation. Unfortunately all of these things were out of our control with this engine.
We hate to see customers have issues with our product. It’s just bad for business. This is why we work with customers on these issues, like offering a replacement head and gaskets – at no cost – on a failure that was caused by something outside of our control. None the less, this post has proven we still have flaws in our system – delays in replacement parts, slow response time, etc… and for that jojo1590 – thank you for helping us be better!
I hope you all consider all the facts before encouraging people not to do business with us.
I ran across this post while researching Blueprint engines for a customers car. I felt compelled to offer my opinion after reading the posts and looking at the pic's.
I am going to side with BP on this due to the burn through pic's. That damage did not happen quickly. What the original cause was may never be known but I strongly suspect a tuning issue that was unresolved for quite sometime. I am not trying to bash whomever was working on the vehicle but two weak / dead cylinders should be pretty blatantly obvious to a trained tuners ear. I currently own a restoration shop and spent 30 years in engineering so I am not a backyard keyboard mechanic offering his opinion with little to no knowledge.
after the initial start up the rear seal leaked. BluePrint said to pull the rear main and install a new one. I did it my self in my shop only to find this nick in the cranks surface of the seals lip. Its not a scratch but a defined nick with raised edges about .003/.004. 10 hours of my time in and out with the trans, clutch and flywheel plus the new seal. this goes back to June 29th. I have sent multiple emails and all I got was we are still working on it. I realize I bought a "mail order motor" from a company over 1000 miles away. Its installed and I'm on the hook for any future repairs is the drift I'm getting from this company. stay tuned.....
My cooling system is beyond adequate, and the carburetor is a 600cfm quality carburetor mounted to a dual plane quality intake (the same combination that Blueprint engines performed the original power measurement). As mentioned above, the distributor is a Performance Distributors DUI distributor.
" On July 6th we advised the customer that this was likely not going to be covered by warranty, but did offer to send him a replacement head and gaskets at no charge. We did send these out 9 days after we said we would – that is not acceptable by our standards and can understand the customers frustration on that part.We also advised that if we found something other than fire slotting during our inspection, that was a manufacturing or parts defect, we would reimburse his labor bill." This was not made clear. I had to ask if there would be a charge for the head and gaskets, and the labor reimbursement statement was left vague.
Had I known that I would have received the poor customer service and been without my only car for 6 weeks, then I would have paid the shop a prior agreed $900 to repair the head at a local machine shop. The shop was exceptional with all of their service and timeliness, so I would have been without my car for a maximum of 2 weeks. The rate-limiting factor of the return would have been the machine shop's turnaround time, as the shop re-installed the heads within 2 days of receiving the new head from Blueprint engines. Furthermore, had I kept the repair local, I would not have dealt with the insults and shady business practices that I experienced with Blueprint engines.
After shipping the head back to Blueprint Engines, I got as many expert opinions as I could. The three different mechanical engineers with whom I conferred all have engine building experience and two of them race. One was a machinist prior to getting his engineering degrees (BS, MS). The tech who did the head installation used ARP bolts to replace the bolts from Blueprint engines. He specifically commented on the poor quality of the head bolts that were on the engine. Another tech at the same shop said that it was either due to the bolts (improper torque, quality) or a head casting defect, since the pistons, plugs, and block were all in unharmed condition.
The engine had approximately 8,000 miles on it when the above referenced ordeal with Blueprint Engines began. It had approximately 2000 miles on it when I got the first dyno tune and saw the low hp rating. It had been tuned from the start at installation by an ASE master mechanic. The warranty is for 30 months and 50,000 miles. I have receipts and documentation for everything done to the car.
I am the most concerned with spreading the word to others to prevent them from going through the same debacle, insulting, and shady business practices that I experienced with Blueprint Engines. When Ken called to tell me that they would not honor their labor warranty, he used a blocked number in contrast to previous conversations where he used his company line. After insulting me and my tuners by saying he hoped that it was tuned right this time and we won't have the same problem again, instead of leaving me with his direct line, he gave me the general company number. When I called again to speak with Ken, the operator sent me to Ken's phone line where Ken screened the call and has never returned my call. I have all documentation and references available should Ken ever return my call. It is disgusting that the only details I have received for why Blueprint Engines is not honoring their labor warranty have been via their response to a complaint forum.
I was always cordial, factual, and never rude in any of the discussions that I had with anyone from the company. When I spoke with another rep and told him that all procedures had been followed from the start, his tone quickly changed and he ended the conversation. I was never asked for any documents or references, but rather ignored.
I hope that if anyone is considering an engine from Blueprint Engines, he/she does not let the fancy horsepower ads and "value" convince him/her to purchase their product. The old saying "you get what you pay for" still holds true. The initial excitement that one may receive is not worth the risk of poor quality and subsequent terrible customer service, where any problems are blamed on the customer for negligence.
I will second your last paragraph as I am dealing with a warrant issue with Blueprint and the same employee.
Don't sound good here it is a big PITA on stuff like this going to be fun to see what is said on this one. Maybe you took a hammer to it to get the seal out so you have no war.
08-17-2016, 02:15 PM
Blueprint Engines warranty complaint
